Talk:Zaoldyeck family

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

	Portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Anime and manga, which aims to improve and expand anime and manga related articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit this article or visit the project page.
Stub	This article has been rated as Stub-Class on the assessment scale.

Contents 1 Additional Images 2 A note on the spelling of "Zoaldyeck" 3 Change the name to Zoldyck 4 Ridiculous statement about the grandmother 5 Fair use rationale for Image:Hunter x hunter alluka zaoldyeck ch229.jpeg 6 Fair use rationale for Image:Hunter x hunter kikyo zaoldyeck ep35.jpeg 7 Fair use rationale for Image:Hunter x hunter maha zaoldyeck headshot ep62.jpeg 8 Fair use rationale for Image:Hunter x hunter mike dog.jpeg 9 Killua and Zeno's ability

[edit] Additional Images

I think screenshots of Kikyou and the remaining workers for the family should be added. [I would do it myself but I no longer have the episodes] It would help identify the characters especially Mike & Kikyou.

This time proper fair-use should be stated however. Noremon (talk) 05:16, 13 March 2008 (UTC)Noremon

[edit] A note on the spelling of "Zoaldyeck"

I'm aware there are alternate spellings for this. Both "Zoldick" and "Zoldyck" have been redirected (i.e. someone searching for the "Zoldyck family" will be redirected to this page.)

I'm also aware that "Zoldyck" has been deemed the 'official' translation by Viz. However, as explained by the policies on the wiki animemanga project (WP:Otaku) and the discussions on the style guide for japanese articles (WP:MOS-JP), the name that is most commonly accepted by the fan community can be used if the official name is bad or barely used.

So if anyone has any objections/opinions/suggestions on this, can they please say so here on the talk page as oppossed to just editing the article.

I think it's best to keep the surname consistent as "Zoaldyeck" on the article (so it's the same as the article title) unless a decision is made to change the Article's name.

thanks Yaksha 10:30, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Change the name to Zoldyck

I believe that we should change it to "Zoldyck". Considering that's the official translation from Viz's translators, who are more likely to get it right than fansubbers on the internet, it should stay up rather than the fan translation of "Zoaldyeck". Aside from that, the name is spelled as "Zoldyck" throughout the rest of the website. It's confusing to have one or the other, and I would rather go by an official translation instead of the one created by anonymous translators that distribute illegal chapters and episodes of the series.

Mr. Toto 11:07, 01 October 2006

So your concern is that the scanlation translations are confusing, and that they are "created by anonymous translators that distribute illegal chapters and episodes of the series"?

confusing isn't an issue. The fact that the hxh articles are not consistent is a problem, but it's easy to fix. It's something i've been planning to do soon anyway. The names itself aren't confusing, in fact, using the ViZ names would cause more confusion because the ViZ names are not popular, and rarely used amoung HxH fans.

As for the fact that ViZ translations are "official", that was a problem previously. When i first came here, i changed all scanlation names to ViZ names since i believed that was what wikipedia did. Actually, the entire notion of using "official" names was under heavy debate at the time.

Now, there're guildlines about naming of fictional characters at the WikiProject Anime and manga page. For article names: "Name your pages in English and place the native transliteration on the first line of the article unless the native form is more commonly recognized by readers than the English form" and for character names, "Characters should be called what the series officially states their romaji names as. If that does not exist, use what they are named in the most recent or popular English translation, if it exists, isn't egregiously bad, and is the generally-used name (a google test is appropriate here). Otherwise, use a literal transliteration"

Which means we use scanlation names. The "officially stated romaji" is the absurd "english" names Togashi himself came up with. The most recent translations are ViZ, but they are *not* the generally used name. The most popular translation of name are the most common scanlation names, which are not egregiously bad, and is generally used, and beats the VIZ names by miles on the google test.

If you're interested, the discussion about what names to use for japanese fictional characters is here

And i've also posted a note on the talk page of the Japanese Manual of Style, just to see what the people over there says. --Yaksha 23:41, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

(In case it's not clear, i'm going to disagree with your suggestion. And i'm also planning to change all names back to scanlation names soon.) --Yaksha 23:43, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

I must once again disagree with your statement. Going through that page, it states that the name used in scanlations can be written in the site if the English name is unpopular or little known. However, this arguement is flawed since only the people who have had access to Hunter x Hunter through the internet uses those names. You have absolutely no way of knowing if most people in the world prefer "Zoaldyeck" instead of "Zoldyck", because there's a great number of people being excluded from your count. Now, "Zaoldyeck" shows up more commonly than both of them, but even so that term is romanized the worst out of all three.

Seeing as how an official product has been available for quite some time, I am sure that there are more people using that instead of what is available through the web. Now "Zoaldyeck" is not only an incorrect romanization, but it's far from the original romaji "Zorudikku". If anything, the Viz translation of this name is correct. You may prefer it, but think about what will happen when the anime is licensed in more countries. Then, "Zoldyck" will be the more commonly accepted term, as there is a very low chance that any dubbing company will choose to romanize it as "Zoaldyeck".

Also, you fail to emphasize the "If that does not exist" in your quote up above.

Viz's translation is the first to have officially stated romaji names of the characters in it. Do you not believe that they would have consulted not only Togashi, but Jump itself to make sure they romanized the correct names? Now, it is true that Viz has changed some names in their other products. However, this is solely because of copyright reasons. Since this is the first and only time Hunter X Hunter has been licensed in the United States, then their translation should be as close as possible to the intended romanization.

I'm once again going to change the names back to their form. If you have a problem with this, consult me about it.

Mr. Toto 23:28, 10 October 2006

"However, this arguement is flawed since only the people who have had access to Hunter x Hunter through the internet uses those names. You have absolutely no way of knowing if most people in the world prefer "Zoaldyeck" instead of "Zoldyck", because there's a great number of people being excluded from your count." Yes, we do. Considering Manga and Anime is still far larger on the internet than in real life, internet evidence is considered reliable in popularity tests for manga and anime. For example, readers of HxH on the internet and in real live who happen to be fanfiction writers equally post to fanfiction.net. However, there is no, and never has been any changes on fanfiction.net with authors starting to use the ViZ names. Or readers of ViZ manga coming onto fanfiction.net and using ViZ names. This can be easily compared to with anime/manga series where the real life spelling is popular.

Using the internet as a popularity test for manga is especially true when the manga is more populat on the internet than in real life. Which is defintely true for HxH, because HxH has existed for far longer on the internet if nothing else.

"Seeing as how an official product has been available for quite some time, I am sure that there are more people using that instead of what is available through the web." you have no evidence to back that up. most manga series, when avaiable through the internet, are more popular on the internet (as in more people read scanlations than official versions). The internet version has still been around for longer than the official version. And if the official version was at all popular, then there should be signs of it on the internet. The official version has been around long enough that if there was a fanbase for it, it would show. Do a google test and you'll find almost nothing.

"Now "Zoaldyeck" is not only an incorrect romanization, but it's far from the original romaji "Zorudikku". If anything, the Viz translation of this name is correct. You may prefer it, but think about what will happen when the anime is licensed in more countries. Then, "Zoldyck" will be the more commonly accepted term, as there is a very low chance that any dubbing company will choose to romanize it as "Zoaldyeck"." Zoldyck is no more correct than Zoaldyeck. Especially when you consider that the two are pronounced the same. And if anything, Zoldyck is an incorrect english word (on its own, not in comparision to Zoaldyeck) because of the 'dyck' part. Zoldyck is not any more "correct", it's just ViZ's chosen one.

"Also, you fail to emphasize the "If that does not exist" in your quote up above.", no, i did comment on that. HxH, s "officially stated romaji names" are not ViZ's names, they are Togashi's romanji, which is a classic example of what is both egregiously bad and not ever used. ViZ's names are not official romanji names, they are english translations. Like the scanlation translations.

"Viz's translation is the first to have officially stated romaji names of the characters in it. Do you not believe that they would have consulted not only Togashi, but Jump itself to make sure they romanized the correct names? Now, it is true that Viz has changed some names in their other products. However, this is solely because of copyright reasons. Since this is the first and only time Hunter X Hunter has been licensed in the United States, then their translation should be as close as possible to the intended romanization." No, so called official romaji, such as "Gon Freecss" is taken into account both by ViZ and scanlators. For characters like Kuroro, the intended Romaji was Togashi's so-called 'english names', which in this case was Quoll, used neither by scanlators or by ViZ. If anything, scanlators stick closer to officla romaji because they don't translate names (such as Deme-chan to Blinky), and they don't need to worry about copyright or simplfying names for non-jap readers.

"m once again going to change the names back to their form. If you have a problem with this, consult me about it." Yes, i have a problem with it. I'm changing it all back. You should refer to Talk:Hunter × Hunter#Scanlation vs. Viz (translations) first. Many guildlines on wikipedia exist in order to form common standards between articles.

None of your arguments are backed up by facts, or evidence. It's all a matter of either "ViZ's ones are more official" or "my arguments are not valid", neither of which constitutes evidence for your changes. --`/aksha 04:00, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

And i'd like to add "This is the English language Wikipedia, and we will use the official names stated in the volumes translated by Viz.)" being an english encyclopedia doesn't at all mean we need to use names translated by ViZ, or name which are 'official'. As i've shown by the guildlines i've quoted. --`/aksha 04:02, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ridiculous statement about the grandmother

"Grandmother

The 10th living member of the Zaoldyeck family is the family's grandmother. She has not been named or made any appearances in the manga or the anime because if she did appear, most of the fans would die from shock. Thus her identity is kept secret."

I don't remember anything about a grandmother, but I haven't read the manga and I could be forgetting about an instance where she's mentioned in passing in the anime(Zeno talking about "his wife", for example). So I'll leave that part but I'm deleting the dumb sentence in bold.

I took a quick look at the article history and 71.217.137.147(I don't know if it's the same person as user Lalalakillers) seems to have a habit of doing silly edits. He/she(but let's face it, it's probably a guy) added things like "She also in charge of the Zoldyeck family's uniforms. No one has yet to see these" to Kikyo's section or "If Maha opens his eyes to their widest, the person who sees this will be stunned for 25 years" to Maha's section, as well as adding the nickname or alias "Valo"(as far as I know, Maha Valo is a character/card in Yu-Gi-Oh!) and may be responsible for the other nicks/aliases added to the other characters.

I don't want to hastily delete them but their validity seems questionable at best. Adrael 11:11, 21 October 2007 (UTC)

For any interested parties, this discussion is continued at Talk:Hunter × Hunter#Scanlation vs. Viz (translations)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Hunter x hunter alluka zaoldyeck ch229.jpeg

Image:Hunter x hunter alluka zaoldyeck ch229.jpeg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 04:24, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Hunter x hunter kikyo zaoldyeck ep35.jpeg

Image:Hunter x hunter kikyo zaoldyeck ep35.jpeg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 04:27, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Hunter x hunter maha zaoldyeck headshot ep62.jpeg

Image:Hunter x hunter maha zaoldyeck headshot ep62.jpeg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 04:29, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Hunter x hunter mike dog.jpeg

Image:Hunter x hunter mike dog.jpeg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 04:30, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Killua and Zeno's ability

When Zeno's "dragons" rain on Killua and the others, Killua recognizes it as his grandfather's ability. But how is this possible? During his childhood he was unaware of Nen and would be unable to see the dragons. And even though he eventually becomes aware of Nen later, he has not encountered his grandfather or witnessed his ability until this moment.

-- 130.163.11.22 (talk) 17:40, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

I think it has to do with Nen being so strong [or to have physical form] as to be seen by non-Nen user eyes. Like Shizuku's Deme-chan. Noremon (talk) 05:24, 13 March 2008 (UTC)Noremon

That... or Zeno just told Killua about it. After all, he could have told Killua about his dragon ability without needing to explain nen. Tsukiyume1209 (talk) 16:11, 6 June 2008 (UTC)