User talk:YDaniel7

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Welcome!

Hello, YDaniel7, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on discussion pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question and then place {{helpme}} before the question on your talk page. Again, welcome! Midorihana(talk)(contribs) 07:34, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] May 2008

Welcome to Wikipedia! I am glad to see you are interested in discussing a topic. However, as a general rule, talk pages such as Talk:Atheism are for discussion related to improving the article, not general discussion about the topic. If you have specific questions about certain topics, consider visiting our reference desk and asking them there instead of on article talk pages. Thank you. Gimme danger (talk) 19:06, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

I'm really sorry if my behavior disrupted the topic. (^^;) I was trying to exemplify the unreliability of Conservapedia as an unbiased source for the article in question. 余(姚七)

[edit] Han Chinese

YDaniel7, sorry if I came at you with a sledgehammer. Chinese ethnic groups are a vexed topic, especially Zhonghua minzu, Han Chinese, and minority ethnic groups. The problem is that an official ideology has been built up and imposed through the education system that is intimately related to "restoring Chinese glory". Think Tibet. No matter whether the Chinese regard the Tibetans as "Chinese" or not in their hearts or in their actions, any challenge to the concept that the Tibetans are "Chinese" is an open invitation to split China's territory up. No patriotic Chinese (especially Han Chinese) could accept that.

The relationship between "Chinese" and "Han Chinese" is also a vexed one, because Chinese people have a vested interest in perpetuating the official ideology. For the most part, even for Chinese people, "Chinese" is equivalent to "Han Chinese". It's when questions of national territory arise that they suddenly remember that Mongols, Tibetans, etc. are all actually "Chinese", too, at least according to their ideology. For most people in most situations, "Chinese" means Han Chinese, Chinese literature means Confucius and everything thereafter -- not the Tibetan "Book of the Dead" or "The Secret History of the Mongols". One could almost say that the ideology is a convenient fiction (although a very complicated fiction) that is brought out when it's useful. The problem is that the Chinese people believe in it implicitly, even if they don't practise it.

The person who is saying that Cantonese, etc. are not Han Chinese has his own particular axe to grind. He wants to prove that Han Chinese is a false category and that these people are not Han Chinese. He may be right in the historical sense, but in modern China, the state regards these people as Han Chinese, as do the people themselves. Racial and bloodline arguments are not relevant in defining the Han Chinese. By tying Han Chinese to some type of bloodline, the user is trying to create the basis for ethnic disharmony. Not coincidentally, such an ethnic view of the Han Chinese is highly conducive to Taiwanese independence!

I'm not really so well read on all these things, but even a cursory glance at Chinese history and attitudes reveals rather gaping cracks in the State ideological consensus that nobody wants to challenge. One day, when the Chinese state changes its ideology, everyone will suddenly change their tune. That may be centuries off. Until then, you will continue to have almost 100% of Chinese defending the ideological consensus as though it were established fact, and a minority of people (mostly non-Chinese or perhaps minority ethnic groups) trying to show that this consensus is not based in fact, but is a useful fiction created for a specific purpose.

Sorry for the rant. Have a nice day!

Bathrobe (talk) 02:30, 8 June 2008 (UTC)