Talk:World Youth Chess Championship

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[edit] Xu Yuanyuan

She won the U-16 in 1997 and U-20 in 2000, as is stated in her article. But my question is, could she not also be the 1995 U-14 winner also? This is credited to a Xu Xuun Yuan, who would be the same age as Xu Yuanyuan and whose name sounds incredibly similar. Any way to check this out? Brittle heaven (talk) 22:48, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

You are right, it is probably her. However, without any good sources (eg birthdate) this will be very hard to establish as all the sources I have give Xu Xuun Yuan. Chessbase megabase has only 11 games from Xu Xuun Yua, all played in the Wch U14 in 1995, and as so often, chessbase gets the gender wrong (indicated as male!). Just had a look at the tournament table and Ana Matnadze played in the same edition, she has an account on ICC (Sarakhatkhan). So perhaps we can ask her (I don't dare to ask her, because I have been asking her quite a few things in the past and I think she had enough of me bugging her). Voorlandt (talk) 16:59, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
Also Iweta Rajlich played in that tournament (came shared second 7.5/11), so perhaps an email to her would help. Voorlandt (talk) 17:03, 2 April 2008 (UTC)
Xu Xuun Yuan does exist on FIDE's records, but only by way of a distant mistake it would seem, as they have zero data, not even a birth year. Having checked out Ana Matnadze in Wiki Commons, no-one could blame you for bugging her a bit more! ... maybe I'll sign up for ICC one of these days. Brittle heaven (talk) 20:42, 5 April 2008 (UTC).

[edit] 1989 event

CHESS magazine Oct 1989, gives a full list of winners for the event in Puerto Rico. Unfortunately, the list disagrees on the boys' U-12 winner - giving Marcin Kaminsky (POL), 8½ points. There are no 2nd / 3rd places given, so Jorge Zamora does not get a mention. Not sure how to resolve this one? Brittle heaven (talk) 20:23, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

The Nov 1989 issue repeats all this in much greater detail and Zamora is not in the top 4 - so I will change the winner to Kaminsky and add some notes. Brittle heaven (talk) 12:25, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for spotting this. It is my mistake. From [1]
Jorge Sammour-Hasbun became the surprising winner of the ICC Dos Hermanas online tournament. Who? Many were wondering that of course. Sammour-Hasbun has been away from the game for ten years, but at some point he was a true prodigy. He won the world championship under 10 in 1988 and later also the Wch under 12, when his name was still Jorge Zamora. Jorge’s family emigrated from Palestina to America and there, at the age of 15 he already had a USCF rating of 2500. Amongst others he beat Gata Kamsky in those days. Read more...
I concluded he must have won the 1989 edition. Perhaps it was the 1990 edition? But we have another one for that year. So this needs further investigation! Voorlandt (talk) 15:00, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Cadets

Browsing through a number of publications, I am coming to the conclusion that the early editions of this category (from Mestel onwards) were in fact under-18, not under-16. Unfortunately, I can't piece together the whole story, but looking at Brasilbase, you note that whilst these early editions sit above the under-16 results, they are not described as U-16 themselves. They have (I think) been put there because at some point, the "Cadets" category switched from U-18 to U-16, so the name is the common element, not the age group. Our article is therefore misleading as it titles all editions as U-16. Perhaps some more research is needed to fully clear this up, and discover when the crossover happened. Brittle heaven (talk) 20:23, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

From the intro:
  • The under 16 category has the longest history as youth championship. It started off unofficially in 1974 in France for players under 17 and was recognized in 1977 by FIDE as the World Championship for Cadets. Later the age limit was reduced to under 16, applicable at the start of the year the championship is played in. This implies that some of the U16 are in fact seventeen, so that there is a large overlap with the age category before they changed the age category (and that is why I merged the cadets with the U16, as is also done here. If we would know the year it changed, we can perhaps put the cadets in a different subsection.
  • It would be really great to know when all the editions started officially for the first time. A poster from 1983 can be found here: [2] (from this page [3]), which implies 1983 was the third edition of the U16. The numbering on brasilbase cannot be trusted imo.
  • This chessbase article has a bit on the history [4], which says that the cadets where merged with the U18 and first editions of U10, U12 and U14 where first played in 1987! One thing it mentions is the World Youth Chess Festival for Peace, and I think we should mention this is our article. Voorlandt (talk) 15:05, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Conflicting results

I found conflicting winners for 1988 boys U10

  • Jorge Zamora [5] (he also won some U12, but we don't have him as such)
  • John Viloria [6]
Resolved. This is thankfully as simple as it looks - they both won. CHESS magazine gives joint winners, Horge Hasbun (Zamora's name then - and should probably be used in the table) and John Viloria. If there was any tiebreak employed, it is not mentioned. Brittle heaven (talk) 10:21, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Also conflicting results for 1982 U16 (both ref from chessgames)

  • Zdenko Kozul [7]
  • Evgeny Bareev [8]

Boys 1979 U14

  • Miroljub Lazic (brasilbase)
  • Saeed Ahmed Saeed, our wikipedia article [UAE Chess Federation] and [9] and [10] (the last one is a kind of newspaper)

Susan polgar U16 in 1981 or 1982?

  • 1981 [11], [12], [13] (the first link is an interview with her parents, who say: n 1981 Zsuzsa played in the world U-16 Championship in westergate (England) and won it. She was only 12 then. )
  • 1982 [14], [15], [16], Susan Polgar

Note that both years have a link to her website...

Would be good to find first hand sources for these. Voorlandt (talk) 19:40, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Results from old twics

Because they are no longer online, I post them here for now, until the year is covered in the "notes" section.

[edit] 1995 TWIC57: 11TH WORLD YOUTH CHESS FESTIVAL by Claudio Antonio Tonegutti

Place: CITY OF SAO LOURENCO - STATE OF MINAS GERAIS - BRAZIL Date: OCTOBER 17 TO 28, 1995. The 11th World Youth Chess Festival was realized in October, 17 to 28, at Sao Lourenco City, Brazil, by FIDE and Brazilian Chess Federation. Sao Lourenco is an agreeable resort inland the State of Minas Gerais and it is located 386 km from Belo Horizonte, the state capital, 290 km from Sao Paulo, and 275 km from Rio de Janeiro. Sao Lourenco has 30,000 inhabitants and the average temperature in the month of October is 25 Celsius degrees. The city has a wonderful mineral water park with a lake and hoots baths. This Festival covered the World Chess Championships under 10 (born on or after 01/01/85), under 12 (born on or after 01/01/83) and under 14 (born on or after 01/01/81), boys and girls, with the participation of representatives from the Federations affiliated which FIDE. The participation was very good, with 263 players from many countries.The players top placed in each category are : etc...

[edit] 1996 TWIC104 XII World Youth Chess Festival

Cala Galdana Menorca in the Balearic Islands is the venue of the World Youth Chess Festival between 20th October and the 3rd November 1996. This FIDE event is endorsed by the United Nations and is an annual event. The competition has under 10,12,14,16 and 18 sections for both boys and girls. It will produce 10 Champions altogether. The events are 11 round Swiss events. The leaders of these events are not guaranteed to go on to be professional players but this year there were quite a number of quite well known figures playing in the tournaments. Probably the most interesting event was the Boys under 14 event with Etienne Bacrot as its star. He had a very good Olympiad and has recently beaten ex-World Champion Vassily Smyslov 5-1 in a match. Did he win? No in fact he came 5th a point and a half behind the winner after losing to him in last round game. He was level with Ganguly who beat a strong GM last year in India. The winner was Gabriel Sargissian who beat Ganguly and Bacrot on the way to the title. Azerbaijan and India seem to have quite strong junior programs in train, and China also has a few high profile names but not as many as might have been expected given their interest in chess. Alek Gershon won the under 16 section above a number of more highly rated players after winning an extremely odd game in the last round. The under-18 section Rafael Leitao from Brazil took the under 18 section. etc..

[edit] Some comments

One interesting fact is the numbering. So 1985 would be the first world youth chess festival? This would explain part of brasilbase numbering. Anyway, here is my best guess so far

  • 1977-1981 Cadets
  • 1981-1984 U16
  • 1979,1980,1981,1984 U14 as part of the 'World Infant Cup'
  • 1985 U14 ?? | U16 ' World Youth Festival I'
  • 1986 U10 U12 U14 | U16 ' World Youth Festival II'
  • 1987 U10 U12 U14 U18 | U16 ' World Youth Festival III'
  • 1988 U10 U12 U14 U16 | U18 ' World Youth Festival IV'
  • 1989 U10 U12 U14 U16 U18 (finally!) ' World Youth Festival V'

etc..

The big question to me is whether there were U10 and U12 sections in 1985. Also, if we are to believe brasilbase, some girls sections started later. In any case, I think we should split the World Infant Cup out. Voorlandt (talk) 20:07, 9 April 2008 (UTC)