Talk:William Brown (admiral)

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the William Brown (admiral) article.
Please sign and date your posts by typing four tildes (~~~~). Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic. New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Ask questions, get answers. This is not a forum for general discussion about the article's subject.	Be polite Assume good faith No personal attacks Be welcoming	Article policies No original research Neutral point of view Verifiability

This article is within the scope of the following WikiProjects:

WikiProject Ireland     (Rated B-Class) Ireland Portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Ireland, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to Ireland on Wikipedia. For more information, or to get involved, visit the project page. B This article has been rated as B-Class on the Project's quality scale. (If you rated the article please give a short summary at comments to explain the ratings and/or to identify the strengths and weaknesses.) Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the priority scale. WikiProject Biography     (Rated B-Class) This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography. For more information, visit the project page. Biography Portal B This article has been rated as B-Class on the project's quality scale. [FAQ] This article is supported by the Military work group. Military history WikiProject     (Rated Start-Class) This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see lists of open tasks and regional and topical task forces. To use this banner, please see the full instructions. Start This article has been rated as Start-Class on the quality scale. Additional information and associated task forces: This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-Class status: Referencing and citation: criterion not met Coverage and accuracy: criterion met Structure: criterion met Grammar: criterion met Supporting materials: criterion met Associated task forces (general topics): Maritime warfare task force WikiProject Argentina     (Rated B-Class)     This article is part of WikiProject Argentina, an attempt to expand, improve and standardise the content and structure of articles related to Argentine history. If you would like to participate, you can improve William Brown (admiral), or sign up and contribute in a wider array of articles like those on our to do list. Mid This article has been rated as mid-importance. B This article has been rated as B-Class on the quality scale. WikiProject Irish Maritime This article is within the scope of WikiProject Irish Maritime. WikiProject Irish Maritime is an attempt to expand, improve and standardise the content and structure of Maritime, seafaring and inland waterways articles associated with the island of Ireland. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this notice, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion. Ireland Portal

	William Brown (admiral) was one of the History good articles, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these issues have been addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.
Article milestones Date Process Result October 15, 2006 Good article nominee Listed October 22, 2007 Good article reassessment Delisted Current Status: Delisted good article

Contents 1 GA Nom Comments 2 FA status? 3 William Brown's religious affiliation and national identity 4 the football clubs 5 GA Sweeps (on hold) 5.1 GA delist

[edit] GA Nom Comments

I dropped by to review the article for GA and have a few quick comments. First, the article is interesting, seems complete and has a good number of references. It needs some attention yet

The main problem in terms of GA is that the lead section does not meet WP:LEAD. Please read the standard and adjust to meet it.

In terms of language. It's clear but there are some stylistic issues that make it hard to read in spots. I'll give examples later, but this is a problem for me.

While it wouldn't prevent me from promoting the article, some attention to completing the references would be helpful. THey do not, as a rule, contain the author, publisher, place and date of references. I know this isn't always possible, especially with web sources, but should be there if available. May I suggest consulting a print source or three to lend credibility to the article.

I'll also put the article on hold later, if another reviewer doesn't get here first. --CTSWyneken^(talk) 10:01, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Hi there. I've improved the lead section as per WP:LEAD, I've edited all references in the page as per WP:CITE, and as you suggested I've added some printed sources to the article (see Further reading section). Regarding the "stylistic issues" about the language, as you can see in the history page spelling and typos were fixed several times by different native English speakers; if the prose still represents a problem for you, it would be nice to hear some examples.

Hope the page now meets Wikipedia's good article standards. Thanks for your time, --200.89.166.132 21:14, 15 October 2006 (UTC)

My apologies. Real life did not allow me to get back here as I hoped. YOu've done some good work here. Citations and the lead look fine now, and the article is now readable. I'll promote it, although it could still use some improvement. I'd recommend:

• Shorten Sentences: English readers, especially Americans, find it easier to read sentences that have one or two clauses and one subject so: "A short time after the arrival, the friend who had invited them out and offered them food and hospitality died of yellow fever, and several days later, William's father also succumbed to the same disease." Is awkward.
• Keep Subject-Main Verb-Object together: In the same sentence, try: "shortly after they arrived, a friend died of yellow fever. William's father died of the same disease a few days later."
• Avoid passives: These slaw down readers and make the passage feel "fuzzy" to them. For example, "Brown's ship was seized by a French man-of-war, and he was made a prisoner" could be "a French man-of-war seized Brown's ship and imprisoned him."

I hope this helps. --CTSWyneken^(talk) 20:26, 21 October 2006 (UTC)

Personally I dislike this dislike of passives. They are a perfectly legitimate part of the English language, and should not provide any difficulties for native speakers. To me "a French man-of-war seized Brown's ship and imprisoned him." produces images of a ship throwing Brown into prison; the passive is more accurate. -- Arwel (talk) 01:12, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] FA status?

Should we try to get this article up to Featured Article status in time for next March's anniversary? I think it would be nice if we could get on the main page on March 3rd, but I may be a little close to the article and unable to see problems, so I'd appreciate comments from outside! The article appears to be a nice length, not excessively long or in too many sections, no problems with any of the pictures' copyright status, etc. -- Arwel (talk) 01:12, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] William Brown's religious affiliation and national identity

There would be secondary evidence that William Brown was a Protestant, probably of the Church of Ireland. This evidence is (i) the absence of any Roman Catholic records in Ireland or Argentina, (ii) his wife's religion, and (iii) his financial contributions to Protestant works in Argentina.

As for WB's national identity, it is doubted that he considered himself Irish. According to Mike Geraghty, the Union Jack was hoisted on his ships. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.62.160.133 (talk) 20:49, 29 January 2007 (UTC). protestant??? please, read a book just one time, they don't BITE!!!!! LAYER! He is Catholic . He was persecuted in USA for being Catholic , so, do not post supossing messages please, thanks.. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.16.108.83 (talk) 22:35, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] the football clubs

Almirante Brown de Isidro Cassanova and Almirante Brown the San Justo are the same team. The club head-cuarters are in San Justo and the field is located in Isidro Casanova.--furgonero 02:41, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the info, I'll fix it right now. —Aucun effort n'est trop grand 15:44, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] GA Sweeps (on hold)

This article has been reviewed as part of Wikipedia:WikiProject Good articles/Project quality task force in an effort to ensure all listed Good articles continue to meet the Good article criteria. In reassessing the article, I have found that despite its high quality there are some issues that should be addressed. These are:

• MoS compliance: in-line citations should directly follow end-of-sentence punctuation (with no separating spaces), and the section heading After his death might be better as Legacy (or something similar?).
  • Done. -- Arwel (talk) 19:22, 11 October 2007 (UTC)
• Lead: this does not really do the article justice and could be expanded; per WP:LEAD it should summarise every major point in the article and be capable of standing as a mini-article in its own right. At present, for example, much of the Early life and career section is unmentioned.
• Prose: perhaps because the standard is otherwise very good, the sentence "The captain enquired if he wanted employment and Brown answered yes." stands out. There are also a number of very short paragraphs; these could perhaps be incorporated into their neighbours?
• Referencing: there are a number of gaps in the referencing. Currently the minimum for GA is one citation per paragraph (preferably at the end to cover the para content) with additional inline sentence cites where needed. At present several paragraphs and sections are uncited, as are some direct quotations (which absolutely must be cited).
• Finally, we'd recommend formatting references using the templates on WP:CITET. This not only helps produce a standard format, but allows them to be parsed by bots for things like ISBN conversion and tracking down archived versions of dead web pages. However, this is a preference and not yet a GA criterion ;)

I will check back in no less than seven days (around 19th October). If progress is being made and the issues above have been addressed, the article will remain listed as a Good article. Otherwise, it may be delisted (such a decision may be challenged through WP:GAR). Should this happen, it can be improved and renominated at WP:GAN.

Feel free to leave a message on my talk page if you have any questions, and many thanks for all the hard work that has gone into this article thus far. Regards, EyeSerene^TALK 18:18, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] GA delist

Thank you for the work undertaken so far. However, following the expiry of the hold period, there are still some issues remaining to be addressed. I have therefore reluctantly delisted this article as a Good article. If improvements are made to bring the article up to standards, it may be nominated at WP:GAN. If you feel this decision has been made in error, you may seek remediation at WP:GAR. EyeSerene^TALK 09:59, 22 October 2007 (UTC)