Talk:Wilco
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[edit] Alternate definitions
Why are there two alternate definitions for what Wilco could mean at the bottom of the page? NO other Wikipedia article I've ever seen is formatted like this. Dstopping
Should we add a disambiguation link? I got here looking for the radio term (e.g. "roger, wilco").
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- Please Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages. Thanks. Hyacinth 20:03, 13 July 2005 (UTC)
- Did you try roger, wilco? Hyacinth 20:11, 13 July 2005 (UTC)
- I fixed it with a Wilco (disambiguation) page —Fitch 07:34, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
Blarg-I'm really not impressed that this page leads to some band--Wilco should probably be a disambiguation page; the primary uses of Wilco are the radio word and (perhaps more importantly) the large gas company (Wilco-Hess).
- Wilco is a Grammy-award winning, top-ten Billboard album selling band that is a shoe-in for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Wilco-Hess is a very regional gas chain based in North Carolina with a "web page" that a 13-year-old could have designed.
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- "Blarg"? "Not impressed"? Here's an idea, "some band", Wilco, can stay at the page bearing its name and "Wilco-Hess" could go on a page called "Wilco-Hess" were anyone ever to become interested enough in such a thing to write an article. BabuBhatt 21:19, 13 October 2006 (UTC)
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- I also got here trying to find information about the radio term. There's no reason for the first page to be the band's page; Wilco should be the disambiguation page, with Wilco (band) showing the content that's on the main page now. Raptor007 (talk) 21:07, 6 February 2008 (UTC)
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[edit] Sister Lover
"Musically, the Yankee and Ghost's combination of power pop and obliquely lyricked art rock most resembled Big Star's Sister Lover - an album which ironically also suffered the fate of being rejected by the band's own record company."
This seems out of place to me. What does "Sister Lover" have to do with Wilco? It wouldn't seem to me an appropriate place to compare/contrast with other artists.
One of the leaders of rock and roll? Please.
- I agree that the "leaders of rock and roll" statement is over the top being unsourced. Please Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages. Hyacinth 07:29, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Max Johnston
I am curious if anyone could add what happened to Max Johnston. I dont' know, but he's not on A Ghost Is Born.josebove
- Added info on Max Johnston's subsequent project (now with The Gourds) with link to The Gourds' page. Mollman 15:57, 14 October 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Conet Project
"seminal 1980s and 1990s group Uncle Tupelo"
Uncle Tupelo's debut LP "No Depression" was released in 1990 so they are not a band of the 1980's, technically.
While still with Wilco, Jeff Tweedy recorded with alternative rock consortium Golden Smog under the pseudonym "Scot Summit," a name created by using his middle name as his first name, and the first street that he lived on as his last name. He was featured on two albums, 1995's "Down By The Old Mainstream," and 1998's "Weird Tales." He recorded under his real name for the latter album.
Jeff Tweedy composed the soundtrack to the Ethan Hawke directed film, "Chelsea Walls," released in 2001.
Evidently, many noises sampled on YHF, including the haunting "Yankee Hotel Foxtrot" radio call, are sampled from a box-set collection of shortwave radio transmissions entitled "The Conet Project." Deepcloud 06:20, 28 October 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Image
We should have a picture with all six members of the band as the main image, however I can't find any good ones on the internet... Mkaycomputer 18:54, 1 April 2006 (UTC)
"Uncle Tupelo's debut LP "No Depression" was released in 1990 so they are not a band of the 1980's, technically."
Uncle Tupelo formed in 1987 and toured extensively prior to the release of their debut album. In fact, Sony released an Uncle Tupelo compilation in 2002 titled "89/93: An Anthology". Additionally, most of the songs found on "No Depression" were orginally recorded as a demo tape the band sold at shows between 1988 and 1989.
[edit] Chart numbers for YHF
The Wilco article claims YHF entered the charts at #12, the YHF article says #13 this should be checked and cited.
[edit] Golden Smog
Should there be a mention of this side-project somewhere.. Like in related articles?
[edit] Pazz & Jop
Please leave all mentions of the Pazz & Jop critics' poll as is. There is no such thing as a "Jazz & Pop" poll, and critics' poll should not be capitalized (it's not part of the name). --Tbotcotw 18:36, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
[edit] A.M.
Is there any reason in particular that "A.M." is missing from the discography? -albrozdude 20:58, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Classification
Should Wilco really be categorized as indie? I think that many people consider the band "indie," but they've released every one of their albums on labels owned by Warner Music Group (Sire Records, Nonesuch Records, and Reprise Records, none of which is indie). Would anyone object to removing this article from the indie rock group categories? Nanten 00:23, 22 May 2007 (UTC)
- Hmmm... this is the classic debate of "indie as label or indie as ethos". They're not technically on an indie label, but I'd say they're still an indie bandBarbara Osgood 23:35, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
[edit] UK Chart Positions:
Did A Ghost Is Born chart in the UK top 75?
[edit] Mermaid Avenue
I removed the following from the text:
According to Bob Dylan's autobiographical Chronicles, Woody Guthrie gave his unpublished songs to Dylan but Bob was unable to get them from Guthrie's family. Guthrie had instructed Dylan to obtain the manuscripts from his wife, Margie; alas, when Dylan showed up at the house (after hiking through a swamp), he was greeted at the door by a babysitter, who said that Margie was not there. Liner notes of Mermaid Ave. written by Nora Guthrie indicate that it was her intention that the songs be given to a new generation of musicians who would be able to make the songs relevant to a younger generation.
If someone owns the book, I can rework it into the text. However, I cannot cite this source without a page number, so I'll keep it here in the meantime. Teemu08 21:38, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Good Article Review - Pass
See Good Article Criteria for further details.
- It is reasonably well written.
- a (prose): b (MoS):
- It is factually accurate and verifiable.
- a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
- It is broad in its coverage.
- It follows the neutral point of view policy.
- It is stable.
- It contains images, where possible, to illustrate the topic.
- a (tagged and captioned): b lack of images (does not in itself exclude GA): c (non-free images have fair use rationales):
- Overall:
Overall, this is a good article, which is exceptionally well referenced. Happy to pass. NSR77 TC 21:56, 24 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Wilco and Loose Fur bandmembers and discographies
Since both Wilco and Loose Fur have categories in them which cause them to be included set of articles that are tagged by bot with {{ChicagoWikiProject}}, it might make sense for the band members and related discographies to have similar categories. I was looking at Jeff Tweedy and noticed that he has Category:People from Belleville, Illinois and Category:Illinois musicians in his article. If he had Category:People from Chicago or Category:Chicago musicians in his article then he would be tagged with {{ChicagoWikiProject}} and thus they would fall under WP:CHICAGO. As WP:CHICAGO director, I would like to monitor these musicians, but I generally leave category decision to the editors of the pages. Please make whatever category decisions you feel would be correct with this in mind for all band members, the bands and all discographies.
I am placing this message several places. I am asking all respondents to respond at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Alternative_music#Wilco_and_Loose_Fur_bandmembers_and_discographies.
[edit] Rights to YHF
This page says they got the rights to YHF for free, but the YHF page says they paid $50,000 for them. Which one is correct? 71.206.173.193 18:02, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
- They both say that they got them for free. The original offer was for Wilco to pay $50,000 for them, but the situation had already become such a public relations problem that Reprise just gave the rights to them for free to keep a low profile. Teemu08 21:12, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
- Hi Teemu08, Wikipedia rules require us to use the most reliable source. I added the following statement, which came from All Music Guide, which stated that Wilco paid $50,000 for YHF: Wilco was "[u]nwilling to change the album to make it more 'commercially viable,'" and the band "bought the finished studio tapes from Warner/Reprise for a reported $50,000 and left the label altogether." http://wc05.allmusic.com/cg/amg.dll?p=amg&sql=11:jxfqxqqgld6e~T1 ...............................................However, this statement got cut. What is your source?Nazamo (talk) 14:45, 31 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Mikael Jorgensen
The page says Mikael joined after Leroy left, when really, Mikael toured with the band for YHF and performed on AGIB, both before Leroy's departure. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.86.75.37 (talk) 05:43, 31 October 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Kot book overkill
I have mixed feelings on what's happened to this page since Teemu08 took it upon himself to rewrite the entire Wiki. It's basically turned into a Cliff Notes version of the Greg Kot book, replacing years of previous content written by a variety of contributors with an overabundance of regurgitations from 'Learning How to Die', a book that many consider to be a flawed, skewed history of the band, which Tweedy himself and the other members don't really consider to be authoritative. Going forward, it would be nice if this page draws from a wider range of sources. 43 citations to the Kot book is absolutely ridiculous given how much has been written about this band in the media in general. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.175.98.178 (talk) 20:10, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
- Well, it is the only dead tree source for Wilco available. It's not like the book was written by Tweedy himself—Kot is a pretty notable rock journalist. Wikipedia requires reliable sources for featured articles, and the book clearly meets those guidelines. I'd need some evidence for your comments about how "Tweedy himself and the other members don't really consider to be authoritative". Teemu08 (talk) 21:10, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
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- I agree that the article as of January 2008 is too dependent on Kot. However, the opinions of the band on whether or not the book is authoritative or not doesn't seem important; it is the opinions of other journalists, reviewers, and music historians that count, not the opinions of the subject. I'm sure totalitarian dictators don't like the biographies written about them, but the fact that the dictators "don't consider the bios authoritative" doesn't mean we shouldn't use them. Unless Tweeedy et al have articulated their criticism by showing errors, egregious bias, etc., I don't think the opinions of the subject of a biography needs to be taken into account! : )Nazamo (talk) 14:39, 31 January 2008 (UTC)
- It's clear the page is too reliant on the Kot book. Not only is the section regarding the reason for Kahne/Vukovic leaving Reprise unlikely, it also is disputed by Kahne himself on his own official website (vincristin.com). The story of the artist having their vision squashed by the big, bad record label, only to be vindicated by having these opposing forces ousted and scolded, is melodramatic poetic license; a biased embellishment in which Kot paints his favorite band in a triumphant heroic light. Great that the album was released and everything worked out, but in telling that chapter, let's just stick to the facts... Kahne had a hand in the band taking the album elsewhere, but he & Vukovic were not "punished" for their involvement, nor are they enemies of the band. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.122.50.38 (talk) 18:57, 26 April 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Musical style section: reverting of sentence sourced from New York Times...Wikipedia rules say you can only revert if you have "firm, substantive, and objective proof" that the content is inappropriate
Hi, An editor, Wesley Dodds, removed a sentence from the Musical Style section which describes Wilco as having a "roots rock" sound. This sentence was sourced from the New York Times, a reputable source. However, Wesley Dodds removed it, on the grounds that the sentence was "Really not up to par with the rest of the section (and why is what this one critic says important?" First of all, we can't just remove sourced content based on a subjective assessment that you don't think it is "up to par with the rest of the section." Second, the sentence does not try to argue in a POV fashion that Wilco IS a roots rock band or some other contentious argument. Instead, the sentence summarizes the commentary of a New York Times critic, who argues that Wilco has a "roots rock sound". ...............................But perhaps most importantly, the Wikipedia rules which govern all of our contributions here state that you should "not revert good faith edits....unless, and only unless, you as an editor possess firm, substantive, and objective proof to the contrary. Mere disagreement is not such proof." So based on the Wikipedia rules, Wesley Dodds must show firm, substantive, and objective proof that the added sentence is inappropriate. Since the sentence is short, directly on topic, and sourced from a respected newspaper, I argue that the sentence should be allowed.......................... By the way...here is the sentence in question:...............................................................A critic from the New York Times argues that Wilco has a "roots-rock...[sound which] reached back to proven materials: the twang of country, the steady chug of 1960's rock, the undulating sheen of the Beach Boys, the honky-tonk hymns of the Band and the melodic symmetries of pop." [1] Nazamo (talk) 18:00, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Uncle Tupelo...All Music Guide calls them a roots rock band
The lede has had the term "roots rock" re-added to describe Uncle Tupelo. The term "roots rock" was removed by the editor Wesley Dodds without a reason. (Here is the sentence: "The band was formed in 1994 by the remaining members of alternative country and roots rock[1] group Uncle Tupelo."). As with the above Talk discussion on Musical style, I would like to point out that the Wikipedia rules which govern all of our contributions here state that you should "not revert good faith edits" just because you disagree with them. The rules say not to revert good fait edits "unless, and only unless, you as an editor possess firm, substantive, and objective proof to the contrary. Mere disagreement is not such proof." So based on the Wikipedia rules, Wesley Dodds must show firm, substantive, and objective proof that the added two words ("root rock") is inappropriate. Since they are sourced from a music reference, I suppose he could show that several other prominent music references argue that Uncle Tupelo are NOT a roots rock band, which would make the AMG cite problematic. But failing that, it is a sourced, factual addition. Nazamo (talk) 18:20, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
- Why is it important that "roots rock" is in the first sentence? It's not necessary. WesleyDodds (talk) 06:33, 24 January 2008 (UTC)
- Hi, I'm not sure if Wesley Dodds read my letter here, or took note of the Wikipedia rules outlined on the Wikipedia website. Just to repeat, them, even though they are right above, the rules say not to revert good fait edits "unless, and only unless, you as an editor possess firm, substantive, and objective proof to the contrary. The rules go on to say "Mere disagreement is not such proof."............................................................. So based on the Wikipedia rules, Wesley Dodds must show firm, substantive, and objective proof that the added two words ("root rock") are inappropriate. Since they are sourced from a music reference, I suppose he could show that several other prominent music references argue that Uncle Tupelo are NOT a roots rock band, which would make the AMG cite problematic. But failing that, it is a sourced, factual addition..................................................................If it was a lengthy 2 sentences about how Uncle Tupelo is a roots rock band, you could argue that the sentences make the lede too long. But it is two words! You removed them again, but instead of proposing objective proof why the term "roots rock" cannot be in the article lede, you pose a rhetorical question: " Why is it important that "roots rock" is in the first sentence?" and then give your reason for removing it: "It's not necessary."......................Could you please act in accordance with the rules set out in Wikipedia? By the way, I looked at your contribution list, and I note that you are a very hard-working contributor to many articles. Thank you, and talk to you soon, to resolve this discussion in a positive way : ) .Nazamo (talk) 14:33, 31 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] band member timeline colors
The producer and manager colors are the same, and probably should not be. The scripting for it looks pretty complicated to my eyes, so I'll leave it alone and ask someone else to fix it. —ScouterSig 17:12, 26 April 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Audio engineer
Audio engineer is not verified, noted, or otherwise, please update. i believe it is currently Stan Doty.
JD 5/22/08 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.182.165.49 (talk) 03:12, 23 May 2008 (UTC)