Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Soil

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[edit] Articles for the WPCD project

WikiProject Soil needs to prepare an assessment of these articles. Furthermore, WikiProject Soil has the opportunity to identify additional articles of similar importance. -- Paleorthid 05:46, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

For article assessment, see Wikipedia:WikiProject Soil/Worklist. -- Paleorthid 21:05, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Article cleanup

Most articles under WP Soil need some level of cleanup. It seems somewhat uselesswould be overwhelming to tag and list them to the project. This is a problem throughout WP. See Wikipedia:Cleanup process/Cleanup sorting proposal for perspective. We need to formulate a manageable approach for WP Soils, identifying key articles and article clusters that need cleanup. -- Paleorthid 03:41, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

I have hit upon using a Wikipedia:Worklist approach, which I am trying out here, using the WPCD candidate articles. -- Paleorthid 17:27, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cross-classification issues

[edit] Soil types

Conflicting particle size criteria needs to be resolved and affects the following articles:

This comes out strikingly in the soil texture classification but it gets worse - there not shown are differences within the countries depicted between agricultural/pedological sytems and engineering/geological systems. Suggestions for in-article solutions are needed. These solutions should anticipate the addition of additional country/application specific criteria beyond the current content.

  1. Is there a world dominant soil textural classification system?
  2. Will WP need an article for each grain size classification system?
  3. Does it sort out better if engineering and ag/soil science systems are kept separate?
  4. Should disambiguation be considered as an alternative to in-article solutions?

-- Paleorthid 18:13, 14 June 2006 (UTC) revised -- Paleorthid 19:17, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Is this project specific to soils or soil science? The name would imply the former, but the content implys the latter.
In the US engineering world, there's two major classification systems: USCS is commonly used in geotech, AASHTO is common in highway engineering. The differences are:
  • gravel/sand boundary: USCS puts it at the #4 (4.75 mm), while AASHTO puts it at the #10 (2 mm).
  • silt/clay boundary:USCS puts it at PI = 0.73*(LL-20), while AASHTO puts it at PI = 10.
AASHTO defines anything larger than 3" as a boulder. USCS calls things between 3" and 12" cobbles and greater than 12" is a boulder. Both use the #200 (0.075 mm) as the sand/fines boundary. AASHTO groups soils according to their quality as a subgrade, USCS groups them according to their composition.
I don't know anything about non-US classification systems.
Anyway, I think that there's not a lot of overlap in the ways that soil scientists and engineers view soils. There's not even much overlap in the way that geotechnical engineers and highway engineers look at soils. The former are mostly interested in response to long duration loading (years), the latter are mostly interested in response to short duration loading (milliseconds).
As far as how boulders, cobbles, gravel, sand, silt etc. are defined I don't really care. These are fuzzy concepts, and while I've never come across the Wentworth Scale in professional practice it seems as good as anything for the purpose of wikipedia. If the definition is really important (e.g. to meet some construction specification), folks shouldn't be relying on wikipedia anyway. Toiyabe 21:29, 14 June 2006 (UTC)
I think Toiyabe's question needs to be answered before you get too excited about details of classification. Most articles will have a specific focus, either towards soil science, or towards geotechnical engineering, or towards geology, and the appropriate system to use will depend on that focus.
Even within articles, it won't generally be necessary to stick to one standard - I've only used a standards-based soil classification once in the Geotechnical engineering article. The article on clay says " typically less than 2 μm", then goes on to define clay in ways which don't depend on classification systems used by engineers. Argyriou 00:41, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
Thank you both for the observations. -- Paleorthid 01:12, 15 June 2006 (UTC)
Argyriou, what classification system used by geotechnical engineers defines clay particles based on size? Toiyabe 14:55, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Soil taxonomy

There is no soil taxonomy article, but it is directly addressed in the following five articles.

Content coordination is haphazard. There are numerous articles on individual soil classes that add to or are affected by the resulting confusion. Examples:

Any objection to having separate articles for each class within each system? -- Paleorthid 18:13, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Standard layout w/ infobox needed

[edit] U.S. State Soils

Do we need a standard content structure and/or infobox for US state soils articles? -- Paleorthid 18:13, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Soil Taxonomic Classes

Do we need a standard content structure and/or infobox for soil taxonomic classes? -- Paleorthid 18:13, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Soil-stub

Any objections to requesting a soil-stub? See Wikipedia:WikiProject_Soil/Needed and Wikipedia:WikiProject_Soil/Stubs for candidate articles. -- Paleorthid 18:13, 14 June 2006 (UTC)

Related stub structure indicates that a discipline-oriented soil-science-stub is needed more than a resource-oriented soil-stub. Comment from Toiyabe pertaining to grain size classification amplifies this distinction. A list of candidate article stubs and article-specific rationale supporting a soil-science-stub is noted here. See here to discuss the active proposal for the soil-science-stub. -- Paleorthid 19:33, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
The request for a soil science stub has completed a 7-day review period. I will move forward to set up the stub and supporting category: {{soil-science-stub}} & Cat:Soil science stubs. -- Paleorthid 14:50, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] SI units

SI units are used in describing soil characteristics relevant to USDA soil taxonomy, 1938 USDA soil taxonomy, FAO soil classification, and the World Reference Base for Soil Resources (WRB). This is per established covention for these systems, but if you have a different understanding, please give us a shout here. See brown earth for a recent example of the typical SI/non-SI revert dance that has been occurring. -- Paleorthid 04:34, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

See this in the Manual of Style for supporting guidelines. -- Paleorthid 20:56, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] redirect soils retrogression and degradation to land degradation

Without the response I was hoping for to previously stated concerns, and with the new article on biorhexistasy now stable, soils retrogression and degradation should now be redirected to land degradation. Any objections to this approach? -- Paleorthid 19:30, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

Merger avoided, see article talk. -- Paleorthid 15:32, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Definition of soil

I reverted the project's working definition of soil.

  • The original:
  • The revision I reverted:
    • Soil as in the geological material on land surfaces that has become friable by weathering and subsequently modified by biological activity so as to contain discernable quantities of soil organic matter. The process is described as pedogenesis.

I appreciate the effort to help out, but still find the original to be a better definition, and one that has served the project well up to this point. Why do we need to change it? -- Paleorthid 04:11, 9 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Consider links to the Seafriends soil section

I've spent much time researching soil and its various aspects in relation to its degradation and consequent ill effects on the sea. It has resulted in a large section on soil and all of its aspects, in a form suitable for teaching at school. It includes many diagrams and references too. It may be beneficial for the Wikipedia soil group to consider links to:

  • Understanding soil dependence, geology, ecology, sustainability, erosion, conservation, glossary (155pp)

Suggested headings to place this link: soil, soils, soil_classification, soil_functions, soil_fauna, soil_degradation, soil_type, soil_biology, soil_ecology, soil_conservation and so on.

Seafriends is a non-profit charitable organization for saving the sea. Feedback appreciated. Floor Anthoni 01:21, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Project directory

Hello. The WikiProject Council has recently updated the Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Directory. This new directory includes a variety of categories and subcategories which will, with luck, potentially draw new members to the projects who are interested in those specific subjects. Please review the directory and make any changes to the entries for your project that you see fit. There is also a directory of portals, at User:B2T2/Portal, listing all the existing portals. Feel free to add any of them to the portals or comments section of your entries in the directory. The three columns regarding assessment, peer review, and collaboration are included in the directory for both the use of the projects themselves and for that of others. Having such departments will allow a project to more quickly and easily identify its most important articles and its articles in greatest need of improvement. If you have not already done so, please consider whether your project would benefit from having departments which deal in these matters. It is my hope that all the changes to the directory can be finished by the first of next month. Please feel free to make any changes you see fit to the entries for your project before then. If you should have any questions regarding this matter, please do not hesitate to contact me. Thank you. B2T2 00:09, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipedia Day Awards

Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 17:52, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Shingle

Somebody needs to create an article, or a section of an article, about "shingle" as it is used for a soil type or landform or whatever it is in geology. There are dozens of articles which use that term, but nothing to link it to. There is nothing at the disambiguation page at Shingle. Maybe a shingle (geology) or shingle (soil) article with the appropriate disambiguation, or a redirect from that to a section in some other article, something short enough so that people can remember it to add it as a link. Gene Nygaard 14:05, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Scope of project - does it include life?

Hello all, it's a rather long story why I'm asking this, but I was wondering if WikiProject Soil would encompass the Earthworm article? I'm incredibly hesitant to make the decision on my own, as if I'm wrong it would be a rather slippery slope (including all soil-dwelling lifeforms).

If this isn't the case, would anyone happen to know of a project in which Earthworm fits? Yours is the most applicable one I've been able to find.

Thanks in advance! --Nemilar 05:01, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Pedotope

There is a stub article for pedotope which was created as part of a project on ecological land classification and its related terminology. I was surprised to find a project on soils. Can someone here please expand this stub article and make it worthy? BeeTea 00:22, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Soil article discussion

If anyone still watches this page, there is a discussion at Talk:Soil which is desiring additional participants. – Basar (talk · contribs) 22:53, 20 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Notice of List articles

Page(s) related to this project have been created and/or added to one of the Wikipedia:Contents subpages (not by me).

This note is to let you know, so that experts in the field can expand them and check them for accuracy, and so that they can be added to any watchlists/tasklists, and have any appropriate project banners added, etc. Thanks. --Quiddity 19:39, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Soil Directory Structure

Previous content from this section has been archived.

Wikipedia has needed a Soil directory to distance the project from the soil science for better accuracy, a more balanced presentation, and in a few cases, to maintain neutrality.

Category:Soil, new as of November, 2007, is a sub-cat of Category:Natural resources. Category:Soil science is also a sub-cat of Category:Soil. Accordingly, Category:Soil could have been placed under the Category:Soil science ala Commons:Category:Soil but was not sufficiently responsive to concerns for balanced treatment.


  • A structure that uses multiple paths to get to an article is OK:
    • Nature>Natural Resources>Soil>Types of soil>(specific soil type article: material, resource, or pedology class)
    • Nature>Natural Sciences>Earth sciences>Soil Science>Pedology>(specific soil pedology class type article)
    • Nature>Natural Sciences>Earth sciences>Physical geography>Pedology>(specific soil pedology classtype article)

[edit] Tillage articles

SoilMan2007 is a new user who is doing work on Tillage and related articles. (Here are his Contributions.) He is enthusiastic and informed, but new to Wikipedia. I have given him some guidance on Wikipedia house style and related matters but as with all of us, there is a learning curve. Could members of this project assist him, by watchlisting his talk page, where he now is posting questions from time to time? I will continue as well. Thank you. Kablammo (talk) 04:44, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Dead link patrol

Project articles can develop a fair number of dead links over time. These are unwanted, and should be fixed on a regular basis. You can either try to find the current location of the document using a Google inurl search, or use the {{dlw}} or {{dlw-inline}} templates to point to the Internet Archive version of the document, like this: {{dlw|dead URL|caption}}, e.g.: {{dlw|http://free.oszoo.org/|OS Zoo webpage}}. For dead links inside paragraphs, use {{dlw-inline|url=dead URL|title=caption}}, which will not disturb the flow of text as much. Please do not simply remove every dead link; they often contain valuable information. -- Paleorthid (talk) 02:41, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Philip Greenspun illustration project (PGIP)

Dear Wikimedians,

This is a (belated) announcement that requests are now being taken for illustrations to be created for the Philip Greenspun illustration project (PGIP).

The aim of the project is to create and improve illustrations on Wikimedia projects. You can help by identifying which important articles or concepts are missing illustrations (diagrams) that could make them a lot easier to understand. Requests should be made on this page: Philip_Greenspun_illustration_project/Requests

If there's a topic area you know a lot about or are involved with as a Wikiproject, why not conduct a review to see which illustrations are missing and needed for that topic? Existing content can be checked by using Mayflower to search Wikimedia Commons, or use the Free Image Search Tool to quickly check for images of a given topic in other-language projects.

The community suggestions will be used to shape the final list, which will be finalised to 50 specific requests for Round 1, due to start in January. People will be able to make suggestions for the duration of the project, not just in the lead-up to Round 1.

thanks, pfctdayelise (talk) 12:55, 13 December 2007 (UTC) (Project coordinator)

Posted to WikiProject Science and WikiProject Biology, Relayed to WikiProject Soil by Paleorthid (talk) 16:19, 13 December 2007 (UTC)