Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Museums/Archive/Archive 3

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Archive This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

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History Museum

There is no Historical museum or history museum article and this seems like a gross oversight to me. I'm a student and can't take on the task at the moment, but will help out if someone else takes charge. --Gimme danger (talk) 11:58, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

Is it too general to have an article? I'm not really sure. As it is, Art museum is a mess. How do you think such an article should work? TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 15:45, 4 April 2008 (UTC)
I don't think it's too general. The outline for general museum articles (history museum, art museum, museum, etc.) would be as follows.
  1. Definition - this wouldn't be the section title and maybe this would be covered in the intro
  2. Theory, describing basically what type of museum aims to do and what experts say about it. Like this section might have information about the concerns of curators, exhibit design and things like that.
  3. Types (with sub sections covering various types, like living museums, ship museums, historic houses etc.)
  4. History - This would probably be the bulk of the article. To me, the history of the idea of a museum is the most interesting thing about it. This section would cover firsts, development of museums and museum-like institutions in various world cultures, etc.
Of course, this order may not be ideal. Eventually, basic museum articles (Museum) would probably be summary articles linking to main articles like History of museums and such. The biggest problem that general articles pose, in my mind, is example creep. General articles should only have description of really historically important museums, firsts and things like that, but shouldn't include a long list of museums, like "art museum" currently does. --Gimme danger (talk) 16:58, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

Class and Importance update for template

Since we have added importance to the template and a functional bot to summarize, is this our current Template for the Project:

{{Wiki Project Museums
|class=List/Stub/Start/B/GA/A/FA
|importance=Top/High/Medium/Low/None
<!----- CLASS-B REVIEW ----->
<!-- 1. It is suitably referenced, and all major points are appropriately cited. -->
|B-Class-1=yes/no
<!-- 2. It reasonably covers the topic, and does not contain major omissions or inaccuracies. -->
|B-Class-2=yes/no
<!-- 3. It has a defined structure, including a lead section and one or more sections of content. -->
|B-Class-3=yes/no
<!-- 4. It is free from major grammatical errors, and not needing cleanup per [[WP:MOS]]. -->
|B-Class-4=yes/no
<!-- 5. It contains appropriate supporting materials, such as an infobox, images, or diagrams. -->
|B-Class-5=yes/no
}}

Does the bot perform any other function than summarizing the class/importance matrix?

Do we have criteria for the Top/High/Medium/Low/None importances?

Thanks,LanceBarber (talk) 20:11, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

I don't think the bot performs any other functions but I'm not an expert. The importance criteria are at Wikipedia:WikiProject Museums/Assessment but probably still need tweaking.— Rod talk 20:26, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

Museum Ships

I'm an active member with WP:MILHIST and WP:SHIPS and will be glad to tag all instances of museum ships I know of. Looking forward to working with y'all. -MBK004 15:57, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Thanks! TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 18:46, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
You're welcome. I've already identified 4 FAs and 1 GA on top of what you had already, plus numerous well-written ship articles. -MBK004 18:56, 19 March 2008 (UTC)
One thing I should bring up, according to the MOS, all names of ships should be italicized whenever possible, so take that into account when linking. If you have questions, I can point you to some specialized templates developed by WP:SHIPS to expedite this purpose. -MBK004 17:10, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
Would you mind? I think having them here is a good reference, or listing it in the guidelines that RodW started in his sandbox, that way it's at hand for anyone who might be working on a museum ship TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 17:48, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
Sure, here's what I can remember off the top of my head: {{USS}}, {{USNS}}, {{USCGC}}, {{HMS}}, {{HMAS}}, {{HMCS}}, {{MS}}, {{MV}}, {{SS}}, {{warship}} and {{sclass}}. These are intricate templates which reduce the amount of wikicode required to italicize the names of ships and provide a variety of ways to display the links. -MBK004 18:12, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
Here's some more: {{RMS}}, {{GTS}}, {{HSC}}, and {{USAT}}. -MBK004 18:36, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
And yet another one: {{sclass2}} -MBK004 20:19, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

Question: Do we tag both the individual ship and the article on the museum if they exist? The reason being is that an external editor just removed the tag from Vasa (ship) stating that the tag belongs on the museum's article, which I've just tagged. -MBK004 21:03, 21 March 2008 (UTC)

I would say just the museum article when there are separate articles, as that is the article that falls within the scope of this wikiproject. However others such as SS Great Britain just have one article which covers the ship & museum.— Rod talk 21:16, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
Okay, I'll go back through the ships I've tagged and weed out the ones with the museum articles. Also, don't forget to italicize ship names as I've stated above. -MBK004 21:21, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
I've completed that job, we lost a few FAs, and the corresponding articles on the museum proper are only stubs. -MBK004 18:36, 22 March 2008 (UTC)
I'm the 'external editor' in question. The Vasa (ship) is a ship in the Vasa Museum. In contrast to 'regular' museum ships where visitors can go on board the ship, the Vasa ship is not accessible to visitors -- it can only be studied from the galleries in the museum. Vasa (ship) is about the history of the ship and not the museum. Additionally, there are at least three other historical ships forming part of the museum (to my knowledge without articles on Wikipedia). Lastly, just a note - the Vasa Museum is the most visited museum in Sweden, so I'm not sure I agree with "Importance=Low" tag (might be my Swedish POV).
/ Raven in Orbit (talk) 21:55, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
Makes sense. Also, looking at the article on the museum, those other ships do have articles here. -MBK004 22:04, 21 March 2008 (UTC)
Thanks for contributing, Raven. We're still trying to decide how to assess some articles in terms of importance. It's a new project so the standards are still evolving. Being totally unfamiliar with the museum, I can't judge importance but your input is very welcome. And MBK, will do my best to remember itals, thanks for posting the links TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 00:15, 22 March 2008 (UTC)

I developed a List of U.S. National Historic Landmark ships and shipwrecks. This list covers 128 ships and shipwrecks, many or most of which are museums or are within museums, and I believe this covers a large fraction of all museum ships in the United States. I mean for this to be used like a checklist for checking Wikiproject Museum coverage. If you'd like to check some of them, please feel free to use the column available to note museum assocations. I started by adding notes in that column regarding about a dozen ships that are associated with several maritime museums, and adding those museums to this wikiproject. doncram (talk) 17:51, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

To Do- tasks & admin

I have started to add tasks to the project "To Do" list particularly where I come across articles with cleanup, verify & similar tags - feel free to add others (& to remove them once they have been sorted). I've also started to add references etc to Museum & added some comments on the Talk page about what is still needed - further comments & contributions welcome.— Rod talk 14:32, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for that link, I'll add there instead of the random comments I made here at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Museums#Focus Articles TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 19:28, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
The To-do list of requests is a small fraction of the hundreds of museums that need articles. I could probably come up with 3 or 4 dozen just in Colorado. I suggest move the "request list for museum articles" to its Talk OR a create a Division "project" Article under this WP, OR for now ,a temporary section for museum article requests. The Requests section of the To-do List should be for "to-do's" for the details of this WP, creating bots for reports... Adding Importance parameters and bots for our WP template... create priority scheme for the requested articles, including collaboration for Featured Articles... etc. Thanks, LanceBarber (talk) 19:52, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
Agreed, that was part of why I removed a chunk from the 'articles to create' section, there's far too much. Perhaps a "Museums Article Creation" Task Force could be created for that? I know I've been living in the NYC museums and wavered between cleaning up existing articles in the Category and adding those missing (or redlinked) from the list. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 20:41, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
OK I've used the requests section for articles which need to be created with other projects - but I agree there are hundreds (if not thousands) which still need doing - is it worth listing them somewhere either by type/topic or country? There seem to be thousands that need infoboxes etc so I shall stop adding them as well.— Rod talk 20:45, 6 April 2008 (UTC)
I think by country makes sense, but that's personal opinion. I've created Wikipedia:WikiProject Museums/Requested Articles which I think could work for our project. Feel free to change, etc. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 21:08, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

(outdent for clarity), I'm also going to add those listed at Wikipedia:Requested articles/Culture and fine arts#Museums to [[Wikipedia:WikiProject Museums/Requested Articles]] that are relevant. I'm not entirely sure that camel beauty pageants are within our scope. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 23:44, 6 April 2008 (UTC)

Requested

Wow! Rod, you're a museum database. I've been working a lot on NYC Museums but I'm going to expand my scope and tackle some that you've listed there. Broaden my horizons and learn something too. Plus I need a break from the museums I know. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 14:34, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Expansion

Blofeld of SPECTRE has been able to help a lot with the redlinks on the requested articles page and the result is Wikipedia:WikiProject Museums/Requests for Expansion. Stubs are easier to work with then a daunting list of red links. I'm moving the blue links from creation to expansion, but both places are good ones to look. As of now, I've "failed" in my goal, I created another NYC stub rather than an non-US museum. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 17:16, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

The automated article creation process is good & has made a lot of stubs, but some of the titles are too general, as an overview articles for a "museum type" may be required. These may need to be made more specific ? by moving/renaming with the inclusion of the city eg:

Any thoughts?— Rod talk 19:28, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Sorry didn't see this. I think we'll probably need to use the main ones and then make disambigs if we ever get to making overview articles, as someone suggested above for History museum. I think we need to work out there what the best idea for those large articles is to make them more than a dicdef but less than a list of random and unsourced information *cough*Art museum*cough*. ANy thoughts on what these overviews need to include? I need to think on that some more TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 15:41, 10 April 2008 (UTC)
I've outlined what I think overviews should include here. I could definitely use some input there; I'm sure that I'm biased towards the theoretical. --Gimme danger (talk) 15:51, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Importance of museum orgs

specifically Association of Children's Museums, which came up today, but these exist worldwide. I'm guessing they're all probably mid importance. Any thoughts on that? It's not an accrediting body, although some may be. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 18:58, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

SuggestBot

I was pleasantly surprised when SuggestBot's recent suggestions for me were museum related. Hopefully that will continue. I really think that in less than a month we've all done a very good job! TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 16:44, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

Requesting review

hey, i've been working on National Museum of Beirut a while now and I've developed it from a stub to the current article, it was hard finding references yet I submitted to requests for feedback page and i was encouraged to get a review, can anyone help? thanks in advance for your opinion. talk to me :) Eli+ 18:13, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

I would suggest going to WP:Peer review. If you still need help in a month, I could probably do something, but I'm pretty much swamped now. --Gimme danger (talk) 23:15, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Children's Museums - Categories

I've really been trying to clean up Category:Children's museums (CM so as not to wear out my fingers) as it's not well organized at all and many aren't categorized. At the moment the sub-cats we have are:

  • CM (includes worldwide)
  • CM in the US
    • CM in California
    • CM in New York
    • CM in New York City (may be consolidated with the above)
    • CM in New England
    • CM in the Midwest
  • CM in the UK
  • CM in Canada

Any thoughts on further classification. Where I'm finding references to museums that don't exist, I'm creating stubs -- some Canadian ones so far which led to that sub-cat. I don;t know that broader cats i.e. CM in Europe/South America are particularly meaningful but the smaller categories are likely to be cats of one, so I don't know that those are viable. Thoughts? TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 15:39, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Also a starting point for the Children's museums that still need to be created, http://www.childrensmuseums.org/visit/us_members.htm TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 18:23, 20 April 2008 (UTC)

peer review request Bristol City Museum and Art Gallery

We haven't really set up a peer review system yet but could I ask others to take a look at Bristol City Museum and Art Gallery & offer any advice or edits as I'd like to get this one, which is local to me, up to GA level.— Rod talk 21:40, 10 April 2008 (UTC)

Would be happy to if you don't mind waiting until the weekend -- it's late here and I have an early meeting . Want to look at it properly TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 03:48, 11 April 2008 (UTC)
Yeah this was never supposed to take me this long. What's the GA policy/guideline on red links -- I can't find one. In my personal opinion, it stands out showing 'incomplete', but that may be just me. I'm also happy to do up some stubs to solve that 'problem' otherwise I think it's good. Minor points/questions:
  • "The 1872/1877 Museum building was gutted by fire following a bomb hit on the night" - is there a clearer way to say this and identify this building. I had to re-read it a couple of times to understand it precisely because I wasn't sure why were were them talking about a 1940 event.
  • I think the "Collection" section is laid out very well, it's clear and easy to read, but what do you think about giving the History section some sub-headers? I ask because it presents as a rather dense block of test.
Otherwise like I said, very good. Sorry it took so long TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 16:33, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

Edgar Allan Poe Cottage

Anyone up for a look see on this article? A couple of us have worked on it and I'd really like to try for GA on it. TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 14:38, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Infobox Width

anyone know how to fix it? I never thought of it as an issue until I saw it juxtaposed with the NHRP one here and the width disparity bothers me. Suggestions? Thoughts? TRAVELLINGCARIMy storyTell me yours 00:26, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

Peer Review of Louvre

Just wanted to let y'all know that Louvre is up for Peer Review here. Please add comments or improve the article if you can. --Gimme danger (talk) 09:50, 5 May 2008 (UTC)

Museum Stubs: List in Progress

I'm trying to make a list to include on the project page, but I know I don't even know the half of them. So far I've found:

  • {{Museum-stub}}
  • {{US-museum-stub}}
  • {{US-rail-museum-stub}}
  • {{Florida-museum-stub}}

{{UK-museum-stub}}

  • {{Australia-museum-stub}}
  • {{Korea-museum-stub}}
  • {{Aerospace-museum-stub}}
  • {{Greece-museum-stub}}

Feel free to add others. Are there others we need? Talk toCarithe Busy Bee 14:16, 5 May 2008 (UTC)