Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Mortal Kombat/Archive 3

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The Mortal Kombat WikiProject Talk Archive icon This is an archive of past discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.


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New project tag?

Hi there, I borrowed some source code from another template and modified the Mortal Kombat project tag, but I don't wanna change the current one until I have your approval, what do you whink? The first tag is the original as it is now. --Wesborland 18:29, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

The Mortal Kombat WikiProject logo This article, template, or image is part of WikiProject Mortal Kombat, an attempt to structure and organize all Mortal Kombat-related information on Wikipedia, placing emphasis on canonicity. If you wish to help, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
{{{{{1}}}-Class}} This article has been rated as {{{1}}}-Class on its quality.
The Mortal Kombat WikiProject logo This article, template, or image is part of WikiProject Mortal Kombat, an attempt to structure and organize all Mortal Kombat-related information on Wikipedia, placing emphasis on canonicity. If you wish to help, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
{{{{{1}}}-Class}} This article has been rated as {{{1}}}-Class on its quality.
Adding assessments to the MK articles is a goal of mine, but there needs to be a bit more work done than just making a change to the template. EVula // talk // ☯ // 19:05, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
Ok, I was just asking if you agreed we should start rating the quality of all MK-related articles. That way it's easier for everyone to know which articles need more attention. --Wesborland 20:51, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
It's a good thing to do, but I don't think you should be handing out ratings until we've actually reviewed the articles here. Unless, of course, you default all of them to Start-class, since they can only improve from there. VirogIt's notmy fault! 03:27, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Proposed merger of updates

User Jonny2x4 has suggested that the following articles be merged:

Since each case covers similar ground, I've redirected all the merge tags to this topic for discussion. RobWill80 04:05, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

I think that enough time has passed for everyone to have their say. So, if there are no objections, I'll start making appropriate changes shortly. There was no support for merging MK Trilogy into MK3, and there were no objections to merging Unchained into Deception, so I'll sort those out now. RobWill80 18:30, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

UMK3 and MKT into MK3

  • Do not merge – I highly disagree with both of these particular propositions. Although UMK3 spawned from MK3, and MKT from UMK3, each are more than separate enough to warrant their own articles. In the case of UMK3, its existence is almost to entirely replace the role of its predecessor. Although seemingly a simple upgrade with a few new characters and stages, it has grown to become its own complete entity. That is why UMK3 is currently being made available on Xbox Live and included with the special editions of Armageddon and not the original MK3. As for MKT, this is even more farfetched than the UMK3 proposal. As its name implies, it is indeed a compilation of content from all the games in the trilogy. Almost all of the new content is taken straight from MKII and the original MK (While it has exclusive Johnny Cage sprites, this is a character absent from both MK3 and UMK3). While some may view the game as UMK3 just with past game content, the two are still far from comparable. MKT is the first MK game to primarily be a console/home system only game rather than anything arcade based. And if nothing else, it would be fairly absurd to merge both UMK3 and MKT into MK3's article. There is simply far too much information on each individual title, and they would all eventually have to split into three articles once again. MarphyBlack 05:16, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
  • These two games are basically just extensions of Mortal Kombat 3, rather than entirely new titles, with MKT basically being UMK3 but with characters and backgrounds lifted from MK1 and MK2 plus one new character. To cite other popular gaming franchises, Subsistence an updated version of Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater, features several enhancements, including a new camera system that was received favorably over the original by reviewers and an entire online game mode with new playable characters. However, it is covered in the original game's article rather than treated as a separate game. If we could reduce and trim down all the redundant text and info, they would be merge ready. I mean look at the Mortal Kombat Trilogy article. Two entire sections of the articles is dedicated to reiterating the story and cast of the game already covered in Mortal Kombat 3 (and the only new actors hired for the game are the one for Johnny Cage). Jonny2x4 06:21, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
Simply declaring that UMK3 and MKT is MK3 with new characters and backgrounds is far oversimplifying the situation. As I mentioned before, looking at UMK3's role, it was made not simply to be an update to MK3, but to completely replace it. There is almost no trace left of the original MK3 around today, and indeed even Midway is continuing this trend by choosing to repackage and release UMK3 on modern consoles (Armageddon and Xbox Live) rather than its predecessor. Between the two games, any sort of serious competitive or tournament play is done solely on UMK3. Also, if you check the UMK3 article, you'll see that info on another game, MK Advance, has already been merged into that article. If this merge were to happen, then Advance would be included as well, so it would be like including three very separate and individual games in only one article (And that's not even considering MKT yet). Again, UMK3 has become far more than, if not entirely superceded, MK3.
Then there's the case of MKT. Right now, the proposal is to merge it with MK3. However, it has very little to do with MK3 in comparison to its more direct relation with UMK3 (And if the latter was decided not to be merged, it would make little sense to merge MKT into the former). Despite this, I would not believe that MKT should be merged into UMK3 either. The two have little in common. How is this, you ask? Well, looking at all this from a general viewpoint, these are all fighting games first and foremost. Their main aspects are to provide a level field of competition between two players. In this respect, when looking at the fighters and gameplay in terms of being balanced and fair, MKT is the total laughing stock of the series. It is notorious for being glitch-laden, bug filled, and "broken" (Example: view this page and look for the word "broken" and see what it is most commonly applied to). MKT's similarities to MK3 and UMK3 are mostly superficial. Gameplay-wise, while the mechanics are similar, MKT is in a league of its own. It is simply not comparable to either MK3 or UMK3, and certainly it is not taken seriously on a competitive level, although it is only one step up from the game that is. MKT was not meant to be a simple extension from a previous title; it is the anthology that is supposed to include "everything" at the fair expense of balanced gameplay. MarphyBlack 17:51, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
Well in that case, I'll say leave Mortal Kombat Trilogy alone for the time being. However, I don't see your reasoning that UMK3, being an upgrade of MK3 designed to replace it, should be covered separately. If anything, it adds to my argument. Most upgraded versions of games are usually meant to be superimpose/replace the originals with their added features instead of merely supplement them. Hence, companies try to avoid redundancy by promoting the upgraded versions of their games rather than the originals. From what I understood, Mortal Kombat Advance is just another name for UMK3 than a separate game (in the same way Final Fight One is a GBA port of Final Fight), since it's just the SNES UMK3 ported to GBA. Eliminating the MKA infobox and completely merging the info with the text seems downright preferable Jonny2x4 19:37, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Do not merge - I agree with MarphyBlack's assessment of this. RobWill80 21:43, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Do not merge The gameplay varies significantly between MK3 and UMK3. In MK3 players will rarely leave the ground because there are very few combo possibilities. When Ultimate MK3 added in the Jump Punch to ground comobo linkers, it added combos that lead to over 50%. Also, some characters had very abuseable moves. Jax could shoot his fireballs right after each other trapping the other player with very few options. If some were to watch a match video from each, these differences would be very blatent. MK3 and UMK3 are different games. 71.98.81.49 03:55, 30 December 2006 (UTC)anonymous (check IP)
  • Merge UMK3 and MK3, do not merge MKT. UMK3 did have some noticeable cosmetic changes from MK3 (plus extra moves/combos and whatnot), but I think these could be well reflected in a merged article without adding undue length. MKT is different enough to not merge. VirogIt's notmy fault! 16:50, 30 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Do not merge. Tsumng 06:31, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
  • Do not merge. If UMK3 and MKT were simply re-releases of MK3, this move would be more acceptable, but there's more to them than a few new characters (as stated by previous editors). Besides, if we were to merge all three of them, we would end up with one painfully long article. Sonicrazy 21:01, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

MK Gold into MK4

  • Do not merge – This is a peculiar case. While Gold seems identical to MK4 in all aspects except for some new characters and stages, MK4 (including the home console ports) received all around positive reviews, while Gold was torn apart by just about every media outlet and received uniformly negative reviews. Along with Special Forces and the GBA game MK Advance, Gold has gained a reputation for being one of the biggest embarrassments in the entire game franchise. Also, like MKT, it is one of the last console-exclusive games before Midway abandoned the arcade market entirely. I believe that there is enough scrutiny surrounding this title (including the mysterious Belokk, the misprinted strategy guide bios, the not-yet-mentioned little known version 2.0 revision of the game [1]) to make it worthy of its own article. MarphyBlack 05:16, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
I think some proper research going into the MK Gold article would probably render the merge proposal moot. - A Man In Bl♟ck (conspire | past ops) 05:41, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
  • See my arguments from above. Try to expand the article a bit first and research things about. But ultimately the game is based on Mortal Kombat 4. A subsection in that article citing differences and critical reception is probably preferred over a redundant article reiterates the gameplay of the game. Jonny2x4 06:21, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Merge - I don't mind either way, but I personally view MK Gold in the same regard as MK: Unchained. RobWill80 21:43, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Do not merge. Tsumng 06:31, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
  • Comment - I have updated and revised the Mortal Kombat Gold article fairly significantly (Before, After). Although much of the content is still the same, it now looks a lot less like an unorganized stub and a bit more like a full-fledged game article. A bunch of references have also been added where appropriate. MarphyBlack 22:24, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Unchained into Deception

  • May as well Merge this one – This is the only merge proposal that I can agree with. Unchained is literally nothing more than Deception with three characters taken straight out of Deadly Alliance included (Completely unaltered, hence lacking hara-kiris, second fatalities, etc) and one new game mode added in. MarphyBlack 05:16, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
Correction, Marphy. Four characters taken straight out of Deadly Alliance (Frost, Jax, Kitana, and Blaze) The S 20:31, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
  • No argument here. Jonny2x4 06:21, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Actually, as per our decision about the other hand-held ports (specifically, Tournament Edition and Advance), this should have already been merged. The only reason it wasn't done with the others was because it hadn't been released at that time. EVula // talk // ☯ // 06:42, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Merge - As per our previous discussion. RobWill80 21:43, 29 December 2006 (UTC)
  • Merge. Tsumng 06:31, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
  • Merge. The S 22:53, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia Day Awards

Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 17:06, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

cvgproj Tag

Hi, I notice you've been tagging your articles with the WikiProject Mortal Kombat talk page template. Please ensure to also tag them with {{cvgproj}}, since we're trying to index every single video game article on Wikipedia, including Mortal Kombat ones. Cheers, JACOPLANE • 2007-01-2 18:43

Also, if you're having trouble implementing the rating system, you could just use the cvgproj tag and we could add a rating system on there, something like this:

User:Pagrashtak/cvgproj2

If you want something like that it's best to raise it on the WPCVG discussion page. Cheers, JACOPLANE • 2007-01-2 18:46

New MK8 article: delete or keep?

A new stub article called Mortal Kombat: 8 was created a few days ago, and a link was added to the navbox template [2]. The link was removed a short time later [3], but the article hasn't been nominated for deletion.

I was going to nominate the article myself, but I thought that I should ask first. There may be a good reason why it wasn't nominated, and it looks like it was created in good faith. Personally, I think that it's too early for an article or a stub. Any thoughts? RobWill80 18:54, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Edit: I've only just noticed that the article has been linked to Mortal Kombat (series) for the past 30 minutes. RobWill80 19:02, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

It should be deleted (in my opinion). Nothing but love for its creation, but there simply isn't a single development about MK8, and Wikipedia is not a crystal ball (which I'm almost sure will be mentioned in its eventual AfD). EVula // talk // ☯ // 19:34, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
Okay. I've nominated it for deletion (here), so we'll see how it goes. RobWill80 02:53, 4 January 2007 (UTC)
Oh my god again? How many MK8 articles have been created so far?--Wesborland 15:11, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
There are five that I'm aware of: this one, as well as MK8:reunion, MK8, Mortal Kombat: Destroyer and Mortal Kombat: Destruction. RobWill80 16:06, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Some bios are out!

Midway has released some Official bios for the kombatants in MKA; linking the storyline between MKD and MKA. here ---SilentRAGE! 02:29, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Should we rewrite those before using them? I believe Wikipedia has a policy against copyvio--Wesborland 15:13, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
Most definitely. Both bios (Kenshi and Sareena) were reworded before being added. EVula // talk // ☯ // 15:34, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
I vote we wait until someone's bio is out until we add Armageddon bio info to their page (I.E. no adding Armageddon bio info to Raiden, Liu Kang, Kung Lao, or Johnny Cage's pages despite the four of them being mentioned in Fujin's bio) The S 17:36, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
Whoa, I didn't realize Fujin (Mortal Kombat)'s was out as well. At any rate, I agree; any piecing we may try to do on the bio front will just be speculation. EVula // talk // ☯ // 17:56, 5 January 2007 (UTC)
I agree with The S. Just to avoid any confusion and possible contradictions in storyline. I bet that there may be some, as Vogel (or whomever) is writing up 60+ bios. ---SilentRAGE! 10:34, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Any use for this image?

Image:Sektor.JPG is currently orphaned, and will get axed in a few days. Sektor seems to be doing just fine on images without this particular one; is there anywhere else that it might be useful? EVula // talk // ☯ // 16:03, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Personally, I'd say there is little use for it. I mean, before Armageddon came out, it was treated as gold dust as a screenshot from the upcoming game and our first look at Sektor. Now we have pictures that are of so much better quality and don't have part of the character select screen cut into it. Compared to other pictures across the MK pages, it looks pretty ugly, and, as you said, the Sektor article doesn't really need it, and I can't possibly think of another use for it over the MK articles. ≈ The Haunted Angel (The Forest Whispers My Name) 18:34, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Epic Battles

Should a link to this card game be added to The Mortal Kombat Universe sandbox since it heavily features Mortal Kombat characters and settings? Seth0708 22:34, 11 January 2007 (UTC)

Backwards compatibility

I recently noticed that Deception and Armageddon were both relisted on the 360's backwards compatibility list - last I'd heard (which was way before Armageddon was released), the emulation for Deception was almost unplayable due to numerous graphical glitches. Anyone have any news (firsthand or otherwise) as to if the games actually play on the 360? I'm debating if I should pick up the PS2 or XBox version... VirogIt's notmy fault! 18:30, 14 January 2007 (UTC)

Midway released the information as official and soon after Xbox had as well. This was after the petition concerning the topic, we were glad the petition was successful. ≈ Kombat Krave ~ 16:58, 07 March, 2007 (CT)

Mortal Kombat dab page

I really see no compelling reason to have Mortal Kombat redirect to Mortal Kombat (series). There are clearly a number of other valid uses of the term, such as referring to the films or that documentary thing. I say MK should model itself after the Resident Evil series - whose main page is also a disambiguation rather than redirecting to Resident Evil (series). Hbdragon88 01:13, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

On another note, does "MK" overwhelmingly refer to Mortal Kombat? I mean, when I think MK, I think Mario Kart...have never played the fighting series (except to kick my friend's butt on the Genesis version by button mashing and doing super advanced combos as the hat guy). Hbdragon88 01:14, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
I would not have any problem with making Mortal Kombat a disambig page. However, aside from the main series article that it currently redirects to, only two other other pages really use this "Mortal Kombat" name: the arcade game and the first movie. I doubt that anyone searching for the documentary Moral Kombat would actually search using the term "Mortal Kombat", hence I'm fairly dubious on even leaving the footnote in the article head there.
As for the acronym, I can't say if MK is more commonly used to refer to Mortal Kombat or Mario Kart, but I do know that the MK developers use this abbreviated version of the title quite frequently, even in official sources. I'm not sure if Nintendo is ever this informal with Mario Kart's title, or if that's mainly just a fan-created convenience thing. A Google search of the term "MK" seems to mainly bring up Mortal Kombat-related sites first. Searching for the acronym "MK" with the term "Mortal Kombat" added to narrow down the results more elicits 2,760,000 hits. "MK" plus "Mario Kart" elicits 673,000 hits. Still, I suppose MK could be made into a disambig page as well that mentions both Mortal Kombat and Mario Kart. Edit: I just noticed that there is an Mk (disambiguation) page, although the completely capitalized version of the acronym "MK" did not redirect here. Seems that this is a recent edit which an anon ip made without any reason. I have reverted it back to the original redirect. MarphyBlack 01:35, 6 March 2007 (UTC)