Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Canada Roads/Golden Horseshoe

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Miscellany for deletion This page was nominated for deletion on 16 April 2007. The result of the discussion was Rename to Wikipedia:WikiProject Canada Roads/Golden Horseshoe.

Any discussions, regarding the project (about future timelines, project's progress, or anyone having difficulties regarding this project, please leave a message here. Some member would reply to you as soon as possible.

If the discussion matter is an urgent one, please feel free to leave a message at User talk:Smcafirst or User:Smcafirst/WP:GHR Message Centre. Thank you.

Contents

[edit] Images

This is a great idea about having the county road symbols....just two things wrong with them: the road digits are slightly too thick (bolded)...and YORK should be on top, while REGION should be on the bottom. The Legendary RaccoonFox • Talk • Stalk 01:12, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Speaking of Regional Road shields, I have made shields for every single active Regional Road in Niagara at this time. There is probably close to 100 of them. Does Wikipedia have a batch upload feature, as I can't see myself being able to upload each and every one individually.
Also, I apologize for taking such a looooooong time to contact you guys, but yeah, I would love to joint he project.
Take Care all,
Snickerdo 19:55, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Whoa, Nelly!

Do we really need this depth of coverage on roads in your region? How about one article that covers the various major highways in the region? If there is enough material on a particular highway to have a separate article, then that's fine. You can put a line in individual town articles saying what highways pass through them, with a link or links to them. And then you are done. If you have all these categories, people are going to start thinking that we need articles on local streets and such, and that way lies madness. My advice: ditch all the "Roads in..." categories, and just have a "List of highways in the Golden Horseshoe" article, if there is some justification for having that instead of a "List of highways in Ontario". --Brianyoumans 22:26, 28 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Wikipedia Day Awards

Hello, all. It was initially my hope to try to have this done as part of Esperanza's proposal for an appreciation week to end on Wikipedia Day, January 15. However, several people have once again proposed the entirety of Esperanza for deletion, so that might not work. It was the intention of the Appreciation Week proposal to set aside a given time when the various individuals who have made significant, valuable contributions to the encyclopedia would be recognized and honored. I believe that, with some effort, this could still be done. My proposal is to, with luck, try to organize the various WikiProjects and other entities of wikipedia to take part in a larger celebrartion of its contributors to take place in January, probably beginning January 15, 2007. I have created yet another new subpage for myself (a weakness of mine, I'm afraid) at User talk:Badbilltucker/Appreciation Week where I would greatly appreciate any indications from the members of this project as to whether and how they might be willing and/or able to assist in recognizing the contributions of our editors. Thank you for your attention. Badbilltucker 15:53, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Overcategorization

I have made some nominations at WP:CfD to merge the Roads in City Categories into the Roads in Region Categories. It doesn't make sense to categorize a road by all of the cities it passes through. It would make more sense to list the cities in the article and to list the roads in the article about the city. If as you work through the project you find that you have more than 200 roads in a region category, then it may be time to start sorting the ones that are contained within cities in that region into subcategories. You are not yet close to that point, with it unlikely that you have 200 roads in the entire Category:Ontario roads structure. You can find the discussions at:

I have decided that I am not going to propose any further merges until we see the results of these four. ~ BigrTex 18:35, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Template:Roads in Markham merger to Template:York Regional Roads

I believe that the Roads in Markham template should merge into the York Regional Roads template because Markham, Ontario is in York Region and there are many overlaps with the two. Otherwise, remove the redundant links in the Markham template. Please do the same with the other municipalities. Johnny Au 00:10, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

I agree. Some of the roads in Markham are not Regional Roads, so the merged template should be renamed {{Roads in York Region}}. –Pomte 00:21, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
I strongly disagree. What is the point of doing so? It will just cluster up all the templates, making it VERY hard to read.  Smcafirst | Chit-Chat | SIGN  posted at 01:04, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
There are only 2 templates for merging that I see, with 2 redundant rows, making it harder to understand at articles like York Regional Road 1, I think. Here is how a merge would look:
v • d • e
Regional Roads in York Region, Ontario
North-South routes 1 • 3 • 6 • 8 • 9 • 12 • 17 • 18 • 24 • 27 • 30 • 34 • 38 • 48 • 51 • 53 • 55 • 56 • 57 • 65 • 67 • 68 • 69 • 76 • 81 • 82 • 83
Flag of York Region

York Regional Road Shield
East-West routes 7 • 8A • 11 • 13 • 14 • 15 • 16 • 19 • 21 • 25 • 26 • 29 • 31 • 32 • 40 • 49 • 71 • 72 • 73 • 74 • 77 • 78 • 79 • 80
Highways and expressways 9 • 48 • 400 • 404 • 407 ETR • 427
Arteries in Markham Birchmount Road • Brimley Road • Bur Oak Avenue • Enterprise Drive
Collectors in Markham Castlemore Avenue • Fred Varley Drive • Main Street Unionville • Rodick Road • Victoria Park Avenue
–Pomte 05:37, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
But when we start to make articles on roads in Vaughan, or on any other roads in York Region, such as Newmarket, Aurora, and Richmond Hill. The template will be TERRIBLY clustered up.  Smcafirst | Chit-Chat | SIGN  posted at 20:24, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Yorkregionseal.PNG

Image:Yorkregionseal.PNG is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 11:56, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] County Road shields

Hello. I have several highway and county road shields listed at List_of_roads_in_Essex_County,_Ontario, and i was wondering if you could help me out in eventually creating SVG-eqvivalent images of them. I was hoping to have them all just like Image:York Regional Road 49.svg in shape (instead of having the small zig-zags that mine do. Thanks for taking the time to read my message! :) RingtailedFox • Talk • Stalk 21:07, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Template:Ontario King's Highways

The template has been put into a deletion discussion see: Wikipedia:Templates_for_deletion#Template:Ontario_King.27s_HighwaysJForget 18:38, 11 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Template:Roads in Ontario Cities

Another template for deletion by the same user arguing that templates inside templates are not good. See: the discussion--JForget 19:09, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Issues to consider

I've updated the suggested sample article page, which had issues regarding style, duplicate info, and extraneous trivia. It appears that many of the articles generated by this project are nothing more than a list of things along the road in question, and contains little encyclopedic information. If we're to have articles about roads on WP, we should at least ensure they meet minimum quality standards.

It also appears that this project as a whole would be better off if integrated within the scope of WikiProject Canada Roads, instead of as a side-project. Currently, this project has a few sub-pages, most of them ignored for at least a year, indicating that there's little activity regarding them (for example, Wikipedia:WikiProject Golden Horseshoe Roads/Outreach Department). Moreover, most (but not all) of the discussion on this page have been ignored. I'm not certain how many active participants there are here, but in my opinion, this project would benefit by being folded into WikiProject Canada Roads, providing more editors for copyediting and other tasks, and ensuring common standards for all Canadian roads. Mindmatrix 22:30, 5 April 2008 (UTC)

It's been two months, and there's been no reply to my queries. Is this project active? Mindmatrix 23:02, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
I also believe that this project is barely active with us being among the most active. Even The Canadian Roadgeek (formerly known as Smcafirst), who is a major contributor, last went on Wikipedia more than a week ago. Johnny Au (talk) 23:04, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
I'd note that this particular project has previously been criticized for being excessively bureaucratic in its structure and for maintaining non-encyclopedic content standards (including the creation of articles on non-notable residential cul-de-sacs, the refusal to even discuss questions like why the portions of Yonge Street or Kennedy Road that lay within York Region would need separate articles from the portions that lay within Toronto, the arbitrary hijacking of existing navbox templates to serve its own purposes instead of the purposes they were originally created for in the first place, etc.) We've even seen at least one editor actually quit the larger Canada Roads Project in part because of the practices of this particular subproject. Quite a bit of TCR's past work has gotten undone, revised and/or challenged because of its lack of adherence to actual Wikipedia policies and guidelines, and while I don't know this for sure, I suspect they've been cutting back their involvement due to being discouraged and upset by that.
I'd agree, however, that we don't really need a separate subproject for roads in one particular geographic subregion of a province — this should be integrated into the Canada Roads project. If the main project feels that subgroups would be helpful, then roll this into an Ontario-wide roads subproject instead, but certainly nothing smaller or more specialized than that. This region's road articles just don't have any needs so unique, so distinct from the needs of road articles in Ottawa, Sudbury, Thunder Bay or even Calgary, that they would require the attention of a separate project all to themselves. And even if for some reason we did keep this subproject in place, its standards and practices would definitely need to be revised for consistency with those of the larger project and with Wikipedia policies around notability and sources. Bearcat (talk) 23:23, 4 June 2008 (UTC)
No wonder why is this WikiProject is not busy. I agree that this should merge with the Ontario Roads WikiProject. Why are Markham's streets so well represented, despite having a population one-tenths of Toronto's? It may be because the project coordinator, The Canadian Roadgeek, is from Markham. As a result, other regions' streets are quite underrepresented. For example, Mt. Pleasant Road, Lansdowne Avenue, and O'Connor Drive are more notable than Bur Oak Avenue, which is a mere residential street, while the aforementioned three are major thoroughfares. Even Vaughan Road, which is also another mere residential street, is more notable than Bur Oak Avenue, since Vaughan Road is created in the 1840s and 1850s, while Bur Oak Avenue did not exist in the late 1990s. If Bur Oak Avenue can have an article, why not Marlee Avenue, Glencairn Avenue, or Rogers Road, all of which are mere local collector routes that have very little notability? Fred Varley Drive is just as notable as Homewood Avenue or Palmerston Boulevard, both in Old Toronto, for historic reasons. As a result, I shall propose the deletion of Bur Oak Avenue, Rodick Road (Markham, Ontario), and John Street, Markham, since they do not qualify for WP:50k; there should be no more than six articles about individual streets in Markham. As stated in the open letter from USRD, quality is more important than quantity, justifying the deletion of three articles regarding Markham streets. Johnny Au (talk) 02:00, 5 June 2008 (UTC)
There isn't currently an Ontario Roads subproject; that was merely a suggestion for how the Canada project could be subdivided if people feel that some kind of subgrouping would be useful. And while I wholly agree that the roads you've identified aren't notable and should probably be deleted, I would note that 50k is a user essay, not a binding policy. So while the Markham roads definitely need a review for notability (Castlemore Avenue (Markham, Ontario) should almost certainly go into the trash compactor as well), we're not inherently required to whittle them down to just six. Bearcat (talk) 16:46, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

Another one for this project's file of wikisins: self-rating articles as A-class? When they're not even close to meeting A-class requirements? Bearcat (talk) 15:30, 10 June 2008 (UTC)