Talk:Wichita Massacre

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

	Criminal justice Portal This article is part of WikiProject Crime, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide on true crime and criminology-related articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
Start	This article has been rated as start-class on the assessment scale.
Low	This article is on a subject of low-importance for crime-related articles.
WikiProject Crime To-do: edit  Here are some tasks you can do to help with WikiProject Criminal Biography: Requests: Magdalena Solis, Justina Morley, Impersonating an officer, List of major crimes in the United States, Shanghai Kelly, Tucker Prison Farm, Kendall Francois, Purgatory Correctional Facility Expand: Credit card fraud, Theresa Knorr, Marybeth Tinning, Brenda Ann Spencer, Lords of Chaos (self-styled teen militia), Stubs: Calling card (crime), Federal crime, Leslie Irvin (serial killer), Violent crime, Crime Classification Manual, Anthony Sawoniuk Perfect crime Images: Charles Ray Hatcher, Thor Nis Christiansen, Richard Cottingham, Caleb Fairley

Contents 1 Tags 2 Some issue with this article 3 Criminal Sentence 4 Black Profiling on this page

[edit] Tags

There are some serious issues with this article. First, who calls it the Wichita Massacre? If the name derives from an attributable source, we should cite it. Second, much of the language is overwrought tabloid phrasing, e.g. "saw the horror". The article should be rewritten in encyclopedic tone. If there is horror to be expressed, it should come from sources, e.g. "The Wichita Star called it 'the most horrific crime in Wichita history'", or "Judge Smith told the defendants they were the worst scum he had ever had the pleasure to send to prison" (hypothetical examples). Third, the importance of the incident should be made clear. If it's important because of the Supreme Court case, that should be made clear. If it's important because of media coverage, that should be made clear (in this case, it can't, because media coverage was limited for whatever reason). -- Dhartung | Talk 04:16, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you but can you cite a Wiki guideline on your suggestion? No offense to you but if someone can not see the inate "horror" of this crime then I would wonder about the humanity of the reader. But if there is some specific guideline then of course that would prevail. Jtpaladin 22:22, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

The cbsnews.com source states that it "has become known locally as the 'Wichita Massacre' and the 'Wichita Horror.'" so I don't think there's anything wrong with that title. --P4k 21:34, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Some issue with this article

One: The references are being numbered (1, 2, 3, 4) in the text of the article, but there are no corresponding numbers in the References section.

Two: The picture of the victims has one victim incorrectly listed as Heather Miller (instead of Muller). Is there any way to correct the text in the photo? (JosephASpadaro 05:17, 1 April 2007 (UTC))

Apparently the photo has already been corrected. Thanks to the uploader for that. (I don't know if we'll get to keep the photo if the copyright elves get around to checking it, though.) As for the numbering, JosephASpadaro, that's how MediaWiki works; see Help:Link#External_links for more information. If the links are converted to Cite.php format as in Help:Footnotes, they will appear in a separate section; they do not correspond to the External links, except by chance. --Dhartung | Talk 17:12, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

OK, thanks. All of the other articles that I have read in Wikipedia seem to format the numbers and references differently than this article. Then what, exactly, do the reference / footnote numbers (1,2,3,4) in the article refer to? Thanks. (JosephASpadaro 01:38, 2 April 2007 (UTC))

They are just links. When you do not give an external link some text, you get a number.

[1] <-- number

text <-- text

As I said, this article does not have its references formatted. There are four or five different ways to do references on Wikipedia and they don't all work the same way. Many editors do it this way because it's simpler. Please follow the Help links provided. --Dhartung | Talk 05:27, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Great - thanks for the helpful info. (JosephASpadaro 02:44, 6 April 2007 (UTC))

[edit] Criminal Sentence

Were they sentenced to death or life in prison? It's not very clear. Or, were they sentenced to death, and that was appealed, and since then they have been sentenced to life in prison? Have they been executed yet? It's not clear at all. Someone who knows please clarify. Thanks. As of now, it says "they were sentenced to death [...] They were also sentenced to life in prison with no possibility of parole for 20 years [...] Reginald Carr was sentenced to 47 years in prison for his conviction on other crimes, and Jonathan Carr was sentenced to 41 years on other convictions." What does this mean? -Bluedog423^Talk 17:00, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Hi. Let me try to answer your questions here. I hope I can help. Remember -- during this crime spree, the brothers engaged in (and were convicted of) many different charges. Various charges received different sentences. So, they were sentenced to death (on some of the charges) ... and they were ALSO sentenced to life (on some of the other charges). In addition, they received prison sentences of X number of years (41 years for one brother and 47 years for the other brother) on still other charges. So, to answer your Question #1 ... they were sentenced to death AND they were also sentenced to life in prison. As far as your Question #2 ... (Or, were they sentenced to death, and that was appealed, and since then they have been sentenced to life in prison?) ... the answer is "no." That was not what happened. They were sentenced to death independent of the life sentence, and they were also sentenced to life independent of the death sentence. In summary ... separate charges and separate crimes led to separate sentences. Question #3 -- no, they have not yet been executed. If they are ever executed, I am sure that will be many years down the line. Question #4, I think, has been answered (above) in my responses to your Questions #1 and #2. I hope this clarifies. Basically, prosecutors will try to get many different sentences on the many different crimes so that -- if any one sentence is appealed and reversed, at least the other sentences might "stick." For example, let's say that the death sentences were reversed, at least the brothers still have to serve the life sentences. And, let's say the life sentences were reversed, at least the brothers still have to serve the death sentence. And, let's say that BOTH the death sentences AND the life sentences are appealed and reversed, then at least the brothers still have to serve the 41 and 47 years in prison. So, prosecutors will try to insure that -- no matter what a higher level appeal court does -- the brothers cannot ever step foot in free society again. If you have any other questions, please ask. The article states exactly what I have stated above, but I can understand how it might not be clear and might confuse you. (JosephASpadaro 02:02, 3 May 2007 (UTC))

Thanks for all the info. It will do good inside the article by the way.

[edit] Black Profiling on this page

the first thing you see when you come to this page is two BLACK men. this is misleading because it makes people think that ALL blacks commit massacres. pleas fix the page with a better picture that doesnt make people thing black people commit massacres.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.24.236.113 (talk • contribs)

Maybe it would please you if their faces were painted blank? Your point is ridiculous. This article is only stating facts. It isn't implying what you're rambling about: racism.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.19.149.15 (talk • contribs)