Talk:Wallace Fard Muhammad
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I have written a best-selling book researching what has been taught by Wallace Fard (based primarily on his own writings as they appear in The Supreme Wisdom. Why is it that a link to my speaking on Buddhist influences in NOI doctrine is always removed? Please explain whether the removals are according to Wiki policy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.75.15.57 (talk) 21:48, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
I have read that he could be an dark-skinned Arab instead of a "real" Black. Where is he supposed to have immigrated from?
"punished in the Hereafter" is not very neutral
I disagree with the comment above. That phrase "punished in the Hereafter" was preceded by "Orthdox Muslims believe", so the article is neutral. The writer does not state that they WILL be punished, he simply states that SOME PEOPLE BELIEVE they will be punished, which is true.
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I added quotation marks to give the paragraph some balance.
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[edit] identity
I've rearranged this because I think the two photos have to be sufficiently close together to be compared, and because the questiomn of Fard's identity is central to the interpretation of his significance, so I think it shoulfd be 'up front' at the top not relegated to an appendix. It also allows the biographical section to be seen as 'provisional' - based on an assumption about Fard's identity, not as uncontested fact. Paul B 6 Mar, 2005 6:35 (UTC)
"Photographs and fingerprints of both men exist." And identity is still a question? Rich Farmbrough 7 July 2005 12:38 (UTC)
"How can anyone claim that these two men are one and the same...FINGERPRINTS OF "BOTH" MEN EXIST. B.Z. Gilliam, OCT. 26, 2005
- Yes, and they were identical. That's what the FBI say anyway. So you either go for the theory that they were lying about it or that both men are one and the same. If can phrase it more precisely, go ahead. Paul B 17:18, 26 October 2005 (UTC)
Well, consipracy theory allows one to argue anything. The photos and fingerprints were planted as part of a smear campaign etc. Paul B 7 July, 2005 12:45 (UTC)
"Fingerprints of both men exist" - I'm not sure what this means. Does the FBI have fingerprints of somebody acknowledged by Elijah Muhammad or the NOI as Fard which match fingerprints of Ford? I'd like to see a link or a description of exactly where in the 800+ FBI pages it is asserted that the fingerprints are the same, and whose fingerprints the FBI claims to be comparing. - Passing Through 199.219.138.254 22:42, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
- After the ritual murder he was arrested and was fingerprinted. He was identified by the FBI as identical to Dodd Ford from their photographic and fingerprint records. Paul B 22:49, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
Comment: When one clicks on the linked pictures featured in the article, there is some biased language. The caption under the picture of Wallace Dodd Ford reads "Fraudulent FBI photograph of a man presented as Wallace Fard Muhammad," and the caption underneath the picture of Wallace Fard Muhammad says "This the actual photograph of Fard Muhammad. Presented to the public by Elijah Muhammad, who was taught by him for 3 years and 4 months straight." That leads to some confusion, especially since the article says that his identity is still disputed. Perhaps this should be changed for neutrality?
- Yes, I uploaded the image. Some anonymous person ([1]) added the caption. Paul B 15:45, 5 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] guilty of brainwashing
Mr. Fard Muhammad preyed on the minds of a people that were in search of hope selling them an unproven theory of his own ancestry the "white" race, due to his unfortunate imprisonment. Does that also mean that Mr.Muhammad is also evil? does this man really deserve praise for playing on the minds of a people that were lost and looking for the answers to their oppressions in the Americas?
I disagree on preying on those who are naive because he only brought out the truth. Also, look at the eyebrows of the two men their is quiet a difference of the two. Finally it clearly is stated that the two men fingerprint exist not the same identical fingerprints. P.S. look at the texture of their hair it is a difference.
mr.fard muhammad was a very interesting man, but it is questionable whether he was telling the truth or not. divine mahdi or not, the man may have been a charlatan, or some kind of "spiritual fanatic"..... But the fact he dissappeared without a trace is even more questionable....Jesus was resurrected and he dissappeared without a trace, just the removed stone was the clue. so compare Jesus's disappearance with Master Fard's dissapearance.....-R.C Ahmed
[edit] Master Fard?
I go to an Islamic school though i am not a muslim. it is actually a Nation of Islam school, and i go for the education. i beileive what minister farrakhan and elijah muhammad are saying, but im not so sure about fard. they say in the nation that he is god in person, and that he is in a giant flying space ship with elijah muhammad. they said that neither of them died, and soon they will burn america for 300 years for her sins. i think its all just to much junk. not that i dont believe it, but then again not that i do. but i do beilieve in god, and thats all that matters is that i stay on the path with god...-Richard —Preceding unsigned comment added by user:Blubbernugget (talk • contribs)
- I somehow agree that Blacks are Asiatic, but what about the so-called "White Man" of America ? Did you know that Blacks and whites are both Asiatic ? this is because they both come from around the same places...Not every white man is "truely Caucasian", they can claim to be though. I'm Caucasian but I'm also 1/8 Native American in descent, I consider myself Asiatic.Just My theory, what did you think ? By the way,Why would a man like Mr.Fard say that all white people are pure evil and can't repent ? I realize my sins but this man lied and HE IS NOT JESUS OR "ALLAH-IN_PERSON" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.173.95.238 (talk • contribs)
- There is no somehow agreement that blacks are Asiatic, why, because we come from the continent East Asia, which is now known as Africa. No Master Fard Muhammad is NOT Jesus and no one ever said he was. He is Allah in the Person and he doesn't lie. How dare you spit on the Saviours statements. You can repent but you are not saved. Whites are just a part of the black man so yall will end up gone and once again only a part of the black man like how it once was. Yall will only be in thought and spirit without form. Sorry but it is Allah's will. You will get spared during the war of Armaggeddon though. I'm not knocking that, i'm just saying in the long run yall will decease. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 209.254.250.9 (talk) 01:12, 12 December 2006 (UTC).
to the person before me. wow. That isnt your place to say. God spares who he spares and take who he takes. are you god? no. So you dont know. -Richard
I'm not saying God won't spare anyone, obviously he will, and he'll probably spare a lot of people that we all thought should've been thrown into the lake of Fire, but if the sun itself is chemically causing whites to becom steril and decreasing their birth rate then eventually they will all cease to exist. Now ask yaself why would God bring them on this planet and genetically make them subseptable to the sun so that eventually hey will die out? What's the reason behind that, ask in the best of manners and the answers will come.
what proof is there that the sun is making white people steril? What scientific expiriment did someone do to prove thaT?? No, and there is no proof. i know, now im going to get a response like : Cause MFM (fard) said it, or farrakhan said it, so its automatically true. Well, show me the truth, PROOF. And dont just say there are less white people than everyoe else on earth because they arent, and even if they were, thats no proof. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.251.152.237 (talk) 22:37, 24 September 2007 (UTC)
Ha ha ha, yes you are sadly mistaken in your knowledge but your passion is admireable, i do say that. First, are u a scientist? Have you looked at the fact that you need melanin that is found in the pigmentation that is in brown, yellow red or black skin in order for metabolization of Vitamin D and calcium. You get most of Vitamin d and Calcium from the suns rays, that was a question i had in 4th grade, what vitamin does the suns rays give off? I remember the answer now because i was so mad at the time that I got the answer wrong, but vitamin d comes from the sun, milk too but much of it comes from the sun. What is the rule of heat and colors, dark colors absorb while light colors reflect. So instead of absorbing the necessary Vitamins from the sun white skin reflects it because of it's light pigmentation. This leaves a depletion of calcium which the body tends to draw from the bones and sperm, making the bones frail and making the sperm count dwindle. The population of white in the entire world is about 500,000,000. while the population of blackls all over the world is about 4,420,000,000, from those numbers i would have to say that there are more black people. I got this from white scientists, it's amazing what you find when you actually are open to things. Have you not heard of how whites birthrate in America has a 0% increase in the past 4 years? They, (The racist ones and ones in high position) have said in around 20 to 50 years America will be a brown nation, instead of the majority by whites, and that's not including the immigrants immigrating so-called illeagally, they didn't account for them because they aren't counted. Look this stuff up, it's quite obvious really, if you want to know. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.205.99.222 (talk) 01:36, 29 October 2007 (UTC) what ever, im done with this. Your answer was retarted and so are you. your just another racist a-hole who has nothing better to do but f up the world. Everyone is equal. and btw, riiight.... white birth rate is 0%... smooooth scientist. Im sorry, do you not see all of the pregnant women out there. right, birth rAte is at 0% -Richard, aka Sybil, aka Bob
Yea i see pregnant women but you didn't specify that they were white. When the birth rate is at a 0% that means it's increase is 0%. It didn't improve from one year to the next which would be odd if people are being born right. Really your people proved it for me so those facts you have to take it up with your scientists alright. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 167.73.110.249 (talk) 23:29, 5 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] changes by Co Yep
Hi, I think we need some references for the many assertions you are adding. In one edit summary you say "According to Hazel they divorced because he was "temperamental" (p.5/p.74))". So that's p.5 and p.74 of what? Footnotes in the article need to be added. Paul B 15:10, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
It's all taken from the FBI file. Informations about their marriage are on page 5 (p.5) and Hazel's comment about divorcing Wallace because he was "temperamental" is on page 74 (p.74). CoYep 15:49, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
- Thanks. We should attribute this info to the FBI file, which is rather contradictory about his actual relationship to Hazel Barton, who is described as his "common law wife" (i.e. live-in lover of long standing) and their son is said to be illegitimate. In the next para it says he married but abandoned her (p.8 of PDF). Paul B 17:30, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
Yes, I noticed that one too, that's why I searched for another reference concerning their relationship status, which I found page 74. I assumed it's contradictory because they married after the son was already born (First common law wife -> then wife -> then ex-wife). But your edit is a good solution. CoYep 18:50, 13 July 2006 (UTC)
- Fair interpretation - buty I think it remains unclear. So where does the information about Fard as "David Ford-el" come from? It does not appear to be in the FBI file. Paul B 15:59, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Deleted
This page is full of errors. Where are the real references to his suppsoedly son and wife? And parents? Just get rid of the whole article while you are at it if you want to lie on somebody and tear them apart. Yall are full of it. My article was deleted but this piece of junk BS is still up. No one knew the man, or have actually proof from his own mouth. Why not delete it? Besides I find it extremely offensive since my parents follow this religion.Cococanelle
- The references to his wife and parents are fully footnoted. Check them out in the FBI files and in historical literature on Fard. However, I'm rather doubtful about the claims concerning his alleged "David Ford-el" persona, as you can see in the discussion above this one. Paul B 08:44, 23 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Deleted
I removed the discussion thread entitled "call a spade a spade", due to it being racist spam. Chairman_Sharif
- "Call a spade a spade" is an old saying which has absolutely nothing to do with so-called "racism." It probably (I said probably) appeared first amongst poker players, simply because the spades outrank the hearts, diamonds, and clubs. (Thus, there can be no ties in poker hands. An ace of spades outranks an ace of hearts, which outranks an ace of diamonds, which outranks an ace of clubs. AKQJ10 of spades is the highest ranking hand in poker. It outranks AKQJ10 of hearts, which outranks AKQJ10 of diamonds, which outranks AKQJ10 of clubs).
- "Call a spade a spade" means "don't cheat" (by claiming that a card is a spade when is not a spade). Wherever and however the saying arose, it not "racist spam" — I had heard of it and "Wallace Fard" by 1955, 50 years ago. GhostofSuperslum 02:10, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
[edit] comment
What a disgrace for wikipedia to address Wallace Fard Muhammad as a criminal, not as a person. He is obviously persecuted in his time an now on. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 189.153.114.141 (talk) 22:41, 5 March 2007 (UTC).
"Fard" did three years in prison for narcotics, under his real name, Wallace Dodd.Verklempt 19:42, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
Fard never did time in prison at all. He was sent to jail in his 2nd or 3rd year of teaching and he was sent there for teaching black people a superior knowledge then what the world has ever had. Also for aquainting black people with the truth of their history. Not to say that blacks were always perfect but to give a better view on black people after feeling as if there was nothing for them that they were able to do. He used history to encourage, and the natural law of evolution means that black people would be smarter and better today then back then, so they could easily get to and surpass the greatness that they had achieved in the past but with such ease in the present and future. Also his true name is Wali Fard Muhammad, and really he calls it an attribute because names are supposed to be an identifyer of your attributes, or characteristic. His name means a protecting friend (Wali) that is obligatorily (Fard) worthy of praise (Muhammad).
[edit] Black?
This is ridiculous, many 'blacks' do not have dark skin. Also why is the standard for external links on this article unlike the standard used in other articles such as 'Yogananda'? In other words the Yogananda article (like many others) include links to organizations which spring from that subjects disciples. Yet in this article my attempts to post a link to a Buddhist organization which springs from Wallace Ford are always erased. Why?? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.75.15.57 (talk) 06:34, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
He's not black? Look at the blacks, they have dark skin, he could be Italian or a mixed, but he's not a black.
82.3.233.109 15:02, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
He was from New Zealand, probably of mixed parentage.Verklempt 19:43, 22 June 2007 (UTC)
Wrong, what do you call one that is light skinned, you call them black. They put down black when they tell of their race. If they are mixed America calls them black. Why? The black trait is a dominent trait in genetics so you have to go with that of which that is more dominent. Master Fard Muhammad (to whom be praised forever) is mixed, by a Black Original Man named Alfonso, and a white woman who was the most purified woman in the world. Master Fard Muhammad, Allah in the person is a Black Man.
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- Of course there is no evidence for your claims. He put himself down as white on the 1920 census.Verklempt 01:01, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
You are wrong in the date because they didn't take census that year. It was every 5 years starting in 1901, so you it would've had to have been in 1921, secondly who wrote it, Wallace Fard Muhammad or Wallace Dodd Ford because these are two different people.
- Is that so? Perhaps you shold read the 1920 US Federal Census. Paul B (talk) 00:04, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] his bibliography?
How many book(lets) is he known or believed to have written besides the Secret Rituals of the Lost-Found Nation of Islam? Do they remain in print? Шизомби (talk) 20:03, 20 April 2008 (UTC)
