Talk:Volleyball

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Contents

[edit] Archives

[edit] Begining Paragraph

Removed begining paragraph because it was too POV

Volleyball can be a very active sport. Because many offensive plays involve contacting the ball above the top of the net, vertical jumping is an athletic skill emphasized in volleyball.

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by Drgnaw (talk • contribs).

Realistically, I don't think that's too PoV. I have re-added the sentence and included a reference to a paper. --Pak21 17:02, 1 March 2007 (UTC) The volleyball hall of fame states that Volleyball is the second most popular sport in the world behind soccer. While it has not flourished in the united states as it has in european and other foreign countries, it remains second to soccer through-out europe as seen in all the professional leagues developed there.

[edit] beginning

[edit] Kills

What exactly, is a "kill?" I see it on a lot of statistics as something separate from a point and I have no idea what it is. I was surprised to see no mention of it on here. I'm assuming its another name for something already listed, but that would be good to include this as an alternate name for it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 128.97.253.2 (talk • contribs).

See Volleyball jargon. Unfortunately, people have trashed that page again by adding in huge amounts of non-notable jargon but kill is still there. --Pak21 08:46, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

A kill is a spike/hit that earns a point. A point in general can be earned in various different ways, a kill being only one of those ways.

[edit] Semi-protection

I'm starting to feel that it may be time to ask for semi-protection for this page, as almost every edit seems to either be vandalism by an anonymous IP, or a reversion to undo that vandalism. Any opinions? Cheers --Pak21 08:19, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

It's not as bad as some (suffers vandalism only several times per day) but yes, with no content edits for a while, it might be worth it for some time. Icemuon 10:12, 28 March 2007 (UTC)
Whoa, just looking at my watchlist after being gone for a day and seeing this page being vandalised constantly leads me to agree completely with Pak21. I'm in favor of semiprotection.. Cheers, PaddyM 03:07, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
Requested Cheers --Pak21 08:18, 29 March 2007 (UTC)
Well, that got rejected pretty quickly. Guess we'll just have keep on watching it. Cheers, PaddyM 13:46, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] starting paragraph

I was thinking about changing the lead of this article in three ways. 1) There is a redudancy in the ways to score a point. According to the rules a team scores a point if a) balls hits ground b) opponent makes fault (this includes not bringing the ball back correctly!) c) the opponent gets a penalty (for behavioral reasons). I propose we mention either these three or skip the last one. but since the third possibility mentioned now is part of the second I propose we at least strike that one. 2) There is not really a point in mentioning that vertical jumping is part of volleyball. I would personnaly never explain volleyball in two sentences to anybody and then choose to mention the fact that the athletic skill of vertical jumping is very important. (if we put this down here, it may for example also warrant the inclusion of the fact that a lot of volleyball players at high levels are very long because the game involves hitting the ball above the net.) I opt for removal. 3) Lets include here the concept of 'to volley', and specifcy, not necessarily in too many words the 'way' the ball is supposed to be touched, which is integral for the sport. If there are no strong objections I will go for editing. Thanks for your time! -Catneven 08:02, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

I agree the lead probably isn't optimal. Perhaps if we look to similar sports articles like Association football or Baseball we might find ways we might change, and even expand, the lead here. The goal is to provide a basic understanding in simple terms what the game is to someone who may never have seen it before. AUTiger ʃ talk/work 16:39, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
I opt for using a style like the one used in basketball. Seems more comparable, because it is also a small-team, indoor, ballsport and I like the style of of the lead.
changed the lead, anybody is welcome to contribute!-Catneven 09:13, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Reformatting

In order to get this articles quality up, I propose we are going to employ a structure as in soccer, which is a featured article.-Catneven 09:12, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

I propose we lose the major part of the strategy and technique part and put that into a secondary article, covering only the basics in the main article.-Catneven 10:16, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "seperated"

The word is "separated"

what's the point of specifying that here. You could just have changed it, unsigned user. Thanks for the help anyway.-Catneven 00:01, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Volleyball WikiProject and rules of the game

We're working on creating a section of Wikipedia for the rules of volleyball for the Volleyball WikiProject Each rule will have a separate sub-article (like Baseball rules. At some point, we'll take the majority of "rules of the game" and split it into the specific rule article. If anyone thinks this is a bad idea, or if you think it's a good one, please discuss it here. BrianZ(talk) 01:03, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

This is a good idea, in my opinion but the change of one of this article's paragraphs should be discussed here.-Catneven 09:48, 7 June 2007 (UTC)
We also need to distinguish at what level and with what organization these rules apply. At the moment, some of the statements indicate that these are rules at all levels when in fact they are not. Vbofficial 03:18, 27 June 2007 (UTC)
Well, that ties in nicely with the Volleyball in Xxxx discussion below. The main volleyball (and Volleyball rules) article should reflect the most widespread ruleset, that being the FIVB rules, for NPOV. US high school or college rule differences, being simply a regional variation specific to an age group, could be handled in the Volleyball in the United States article (which needs to be expanded/cleaned/etc).AUTiger » talk 03:32, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Volleyball in...

Somewhere along the way (probably while I was on a wikivacation) the link to the sub-article Volleyball in the United States, to which the most US-centric content of earlier versions of this article was segregated, was lost. Curious about ideas for the best place/way to reintroduce the link as well as those for similar articles like Volleyball in Poland, Volleyball in Spain, and Volleyball in France. Perhaps in the subsections of History, or a separate subsection under history after the Olympics sub-section. Thoughts? AUTiger » talk 22:26, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

I think this is a good idea and as part of the Volleyball WikiProject, I'm trying to make the entire scope of Volleyball more global on WP, (including bios of top professional teams and players in the world, etc.) not just USA volleyball. This article needs a major overhaul and I applaud anyone willing to start it. One way to integrate the "Volleyball in <country>" links is to wiki link them in a table of popularity of the sport in the specific country. However, this might be too much since there are hundreds of countries and a lot of research must be done as these rankings are not officially published. We could start with an infobox with all countries with the Volleyball in <country>" article and label it in the See Also section. Just my humble opinion. I actually haven't even thought about revamping the article or looked at it in detail lately, other than to control vandalism. BrianZ(talk) 22:53, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
Coincidently, I have the list of countries with a "Volleyball in <country" article: Argentina, Austria, Azerbaijan, Belgium, Croatia, Cyprus, France, Germany, Greece, Italy, Japan, Montenegro, Poland, Portugal, Russia, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, Taiwan, Turkey, Netherlands, Philippines, and The United States. BrianZ(talk) 23:01, 26 June 2007 (UTC)
I only found "Volleyball in <country>" for France, Poland, and Spain. Am I missing something here? Wiredcoach 17:25, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
I also agree that there should be a link in this general "Volleyball" article to "Volleyball in the United States". I think that a lot of people searching "volleyball" on Wikipedia will actually want to know about Volleyball in the U.S. AUTiger, maybe you could find the most appropriate place to put it back in. Wiredcoach 17:25, 2 August 2007 (UTC)
I just checked and the link to the US article is in here, at the bottom of the Volleyball in the Olympics subsection of the History section. I don't know that that is the best place for it, but I didn't really see any better spot in a review of History (which is my first instinct). AUTiger » talk 02:52, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 1 in 6 people watch volleyball?

The FIVB estimates that 1 in 6 people in the world participate in or observe indoor volleyball, beach volleyball, or backyard (recreational) volleyball - Surely a citation is needed here (and even with one I think this needs to be more specific - there may be many people who watch beach volleyball on TV but have no interest in the sport!)

More specifically this is a meaningless and unreliable figure, a) because it comes from a governing body who have a vested interest in the figure and b) because it is a speculation without hard facts and therefore does not belong in an encyclopaedia.

Greynolds999 17:57, 8 July 2007 (UTC)
A quick Yahoo search shows that many MANY sites use the EXACT phrase we used. So they most likely took the line from this article. Considering I couldn't find it on the FIVB site itself, I'd call it untrue. I have removed this line. Seek Bar 01:03, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

According to this site, the FIVB did make the claim, but backed off from it when pressed. Rracecarr 02:14, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Citation

There is NO citation whatsoever in the Origin of Volleyball section. A lot of the information found there can be confirmed here. I'd cite it myself, but it's semi-protected and I'm a new user. Seek Bar 01:59, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

Good point. I'm a bit hesitant about the source you mention, so I added two other sources which look a bit more official. I also removed the protection. -- Jitse Niesen (talk) 05:11, 21 September 2007 (UTC)
Sorry, first Yahoo link, and I trust about.com. Anyway, thanks for the help. Seek Bar 00:16, 22 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 3 hits

A block is not counted as a hit (contact). If the ball is blocked, the next touch actually counts as contact number 1. Also, if the ball is blocked, the same player can contact the ball again.Skdrew 02:08, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

See note 2 under "Errors and faults". --Pak21 06:44, 15 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] British vs American English

This string of edits in May changed the long-established use of British English in this article to American English. WP:ENGVAR suggests that, in the absence of a strong reason for doing otherwise (which I don't think there is here), we should use the form of English used by the first major contributor. What would people's views be on changing this back? Cheers --Pak21 08:20, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

The primary argument I can see for it being in American English is that the sport originated in the US which could be considered a "strong national tie". AUTiger » talk 14:46, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
Accepted, but it's now much more a worldwide sport than an American one; the FIVB rulebook uses "metre". --Pak21 14:48, 24 October 2007 (UTC)
While I would prefer AmEng (per the origination arg.), its not something I had felt so strongly about as to make the change from BrEng. The spelling variants in this article are a pretty trivial issue. AUTiger » talk 15:12, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

Volleyball was called mintonette before it became volleyball, —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.60.190.76 (talk) 22:13, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Recent Changes

It'd be nice to have some insight into the motive and reason for the more relatively recent changes to the rules.

--76.66.193.188 (talk) 03:24, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

The motive has in general been to make volleyball a more spectator-friendly sport. The change to rally scoring was made to make the length of games more predictable for TV purposes, and to make the scoring easier to follow for spectators. The let serve, and looser rules about how to contact the ball were introduced to encourage spectacular rallies, which presumably makes the game more fun to watch. I don't know quite how to cite this, but FIVB makes its interest in attracting spectators quite explicitly clear. Rracecarr (talk) 19:03, 13 February 2008 (UTC)


[edit] Lift (/carry) rule abolished

Has the lift rule been abolished? I have just finished Nationals in New Zealand and was informed that the rule is now referred to "catch and throw" / "caught and thrown". We need to update the page to show this. Kennedy (talk) 09:36, 7 April 2008 (UTC)