Talk:Vodka

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This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Vodka article.
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Vodka was a good article nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There are suggestions below for improving the article. Once these are addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Reviewed version: August 25, 2006
This article has been reviewed by the Version 1.0 Editorial Team.
Version 0.7
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Contents

[edit] Rearranging history section?

The first paragraph somehow seamlessly moves from alchemist destillation to the development of rectification and machines in Western Europe. Thus as I read it looks as vodka was developed in western europe. Shouldnt it be moved to the end after description of the traditional making of vodka in countries such as Russia and Poland? It would be also useful to know when the modern technology was imported to those countries? Koliokolio 00:00, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

You would not find any good proof of any of this story I am sure. It was too many years ago:) Just rumor... ( I am Russian)Qqzzccdd 21:22, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] This is what thirst of vodka did to Russia!

See: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6099906.stm

No wonder russians are predicted to disappear entirely by 2125 (by 2050 they will be a minority in their own land to chinese immigrants). 195.70.32.136 18:30, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Almost free vodka for poor russians, manufacturers propose to stop metanol deaths:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6157015.stm

This is obviously placed here by some deranged person ( Polish maybe ?), and it should be deleted ASAP —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.81.5.211 (talk) 15:50, 22 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] US Federal Law... not necessarily 40%

I believe that this line may now be incorrect...

"Under US Federal law, the minimum alcohol strength of vodka is also 40% by volume..."

The current trend for "flavored" vodkas is 35% ABV, yet they are still considered vodkas. Just my 2 cents...

I agree. I've removed that part and added a reference for the EU minimum that I found from the Gin and Vodka Association (which might be a good general source for this article, should it need it). [1] Eric (EWS23) 23:15, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Percentage of ethanol obtained by distillation

I'm quite sure that this sentence is wrong : "Currently, such machines can work continuously and produce beverages containing almost 97% of alcohol without any taste or smell. This allows for production of pure vodkas.". The fact is, when percentage of ethanol reach 95.6%, it forms an azeotrope with water who boils at something like 78°C. By using only distillation, you can't reach more than 95.6% ethanol. If those "machines" can reach almost 97%, then it must not use only distillation. Please clarify...

Agree, this is not true. Qqzzccdd 21:24, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Stalin

Didn't Stalin institute a period of prohibition and outlawed vodka, but after a few years he realized vodka's 'instrinsic cultural value', repealed the ban and actually promoted it? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 64.75.187.195 (talk) 08:33, 28 March 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Etymology

This article lists both водить and разводить as meaning "to dilute." As far as I know, водить means "to move" and has no connection with разводить other than the obvious root. Unless someone disputes this, I'll be changing it soon.--Sidhebolg 07:44, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

To dilute: разбавить, разводить is "to separate" according to AltaVista. Rklawton 16:35, 1 June 2007 (UTC)
According to Langenscheidt, разводить means a number of things, "to dilute" included (I'd say the more common use, though, is "to divorce", as that is how I learned it). While разбавить also means "to dilute", it is the perfective form of разбавлять, and I would think that the imperfective aspect would be better to use in an etymology section. However, I would really like to see someone come forward with a source for this section, as it would clarify a great deal.--Sidhebolg 08:03, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

In Polish wieść (<*ved-ti)means to lead, while wodzić (vod-i-ti) is a kind of continuous aspect. I think its similarity to vodka is a coincidence. To dilute would be rozwodnić (make it apart roz- by water -wod-), clearly derived from and not a source for woda.


[edit] 0.7 pass

This article has been passed for inclusion in Wikipedia 0.7. Funpika 23:02, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Votka

The Crystal Holy Water for men with the brains.

The Russians cannot live without it. The Finno Ugrians cannot live without it. It is estimated that one quarter of Finno Ugrians and one third of Slavonics are using it daily instead of milk.

Too much is always too much, but moderate is always less enough. He drunk less he wanted, but more than his foots could bear. Only few of the drunken Finns and Russians collected by Dr. Ilmari Susiluoto in his magnificent book "Vilpittömän Ilon Valtakunta" ( A Sincere Joy of State).

Why the Thuhnas always find their way back to home, but the Russians not? Why the Thuhnas do not sell their last shirt to have more votka, but why we do so?

Why the Musulmian faith was not accepted by Kijev Rosh? Because it did not allow the drinking of the "Holy Water". Why not Roman Catholism? Simply, it did not allow the priest run after woman flesh. Thus the Byzantium faith, the only right and only was adopted.(not quite: baptism of Russia 988, the schizm 1054; Bizantium was closer than Rome)

Only twice the offical Russia have tried to restrict the sales and drinking of vodka. First time by Nikolai II in 1915 and second time by Mihail Gorbatshov. Both cases ended to diaster. The fall of Imperial Russia in 1917 and the fall of Soviet Union in 1991.

In fact the votka came to Rosh plains by Persians in 600 AD as a medicine and Poles (Wastern Slavonics) had nothing to do with it. Then adopted by Finno Ugrians (made from grain) and then by the Russians. Even Mongols drink it in 1238 and afterwards. It was a "Drink of Joy" during the Mongol "yoke" in Russia and for Finns (men) the way to escape the conflict with the "ruler of the household" (woman) to drink so much that they only slept when they arrived home.

Unfortunately this book is not transliterated to other languages.

JN

[edit] Sandomierz

Please provide a real good, first hand scholarly reference, not just some vodka-selling website, which I could have done myself. So far I failed to find anything meaningful beyond "1405... Sandomizerz...bla bla...", with no first-hand references and no explanation in what context and how the word was used. `'Mїkka 23:56, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

It is not true there was no Poland at the time (1405). Poland was divided into virtually independent feudal duchies 1138-1320, and completely partitioned between Prussia, Russia and Austria 1793-1918 (except short lived Duchy of Warsaw under Napoleon and so called Kindom of Poland 1815-186? ruled by the tzar, autonomous 1815-1832). In 1405 Poland was ruled by a Lithuanian duke, but that did not mean subjection to Lithuania, he was simply invited to rule (and respect all Polish institutions) since the previous dynasty lacked a male heir. More under: Jogaila.

In 1405 was no Poland?? No comment...
If it goes for Sandomierz (Sanodomiria), it was some court document, i`ll do my researche on this matter and try to provide reference, better than some vodka selling website. Btw. if we want to look after reference for every claim in this article, i want to see some about "breed wine" or "horilka" (Polish: gorzałka), i mean real reference, not soviet "science" institute or something like that. Mikołajski (talk) 22:17, 18 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Other language - false statement?

Mikka, i added: "According to Chernykh's "Historical Etymological Dictionary of the Modern Russian Language", the word vodka in Slavic languages other than Russian refers to Russian vodka."

You removed, saying that it's a false statement.

It is not false - please take a look at this dictionary, page 159. --Amir E. Aharoni 21:14, 14 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm really not in the mood for edit wars. Will you at least explain why are you removing it? --Amir E. Aharoni 22:14, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
Before writing wikipedia it is recommended to read wikipedia. Because the statement in the dictionary is not confirmed by historical examples. In Russia first known record of the word vodka is dated by mid-17th centrury. Poland claims the record of the word "wodka" dated by 15th centrury. We don't have to fill wikipedia with examples of unconfirmed dictionary definitions. Wikipedia simply writes that the orign is not estabished with any reasonable certainty. `'Míkka 02:27, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "National" origins

The section on Russia contains this passage:

"Russia A drink similar to modern vodka first appeared probably sometime in the 950-1100.[citation needed] It was not originally called vodka — instead, the term bread wine(хлебное вино) was used."

There was no Russia at that time. There was no recognized state in the area. There was Rus, a land of many tribes and ethnic groups, most of them (but not all) of Slavic origin. And it would be advisable to add where the drink appeared.

As the name indicates the bread wine(хлебное вино) seems to be just a kind of barley wine. Vodka can be distilled of that. So the passage above is baseless.Yeti (talk) 18:12, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Merge in Vodka infusion ?

I'm not sure what scope there is to expand the Vodka infusion article, I'd be tempted to merge it in here and then splinter it again in future if need be - views? FlagSteward 16:51, 23 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] ExtraSept is polyhexamethylene guanide hydrochloride(a disinfectant)

Please write it in the article otherwise nobody would know what you're talking about. Thanks :) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.88.254.109 (talk) 14:26, 12 March 2008 (UTC)