Talk:Vernichtungsgedanke

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

	Germany Portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Germany, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to articles related to Germany on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please join the project and help with our open tasks.
Stub	This article has been rated as Stub-Class on the quality scale. (If you rated the article please give a short summary at comments to explain the ratings and/or to identify the strengths and weaknesses.)
Additional information: This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-Class status: Referencing and citation: not checked Coverage and accuracy: not checked Structure: not checked Grammar: not checked Supporting materials: not checked To fill out this checklist, please add the following to the template call: <!-- 1. It is suitably referenced, and all major points are appropriately cited. --> |B-Class-1=yes/no <!-- 2. It reasonably covers the topic, and does not contain major omissions or inaccuracies. --> |B-Class-2=yes/no <!-- 3. It has a defined structure, including a lead section and one or more sections of content. --> |B-Class-3=yes/no <!-- 4. It is free from major grammatical errors. --> |B-Class-4=yes/no <!-- 5. It contains appropriate supporting materials, such as an infobox, images, or diagrams. --> |B-Class-5=yes/no

	This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see lists of open tasks and regional and topical task forces. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.
Stub	This article has been rated as Stub-Class on the quality scale.
Additional information and associated task forces: Associated task forces (nations and regions): German military history task force

[edit] Old talk

And it is precisely here that we encounter one of the century’s great military myths. For a perfectly adequate recitation of this mistaken vision of the doctrinal revolution wrought by Germany in the Second World War, consult the article about “Blitzkrieg”.

These German military thinkers, chief among them General Heinz Guderian, did not invent anything called “Blitzkrieg”. They did, however, refine and perfect a concept called “The Armored Idea?”.

Well duh, the article in question does not claim that Guderian did anything of the sort, in fact his name does not appear once in the article. IIRC the term was actually a British invention. The key to the article appears in this statement:

The key to Blitzkrieg was to organize the troops into mobile forces with excellent communications and command, able to keep the momentum up while the battle unfolded. The basic concept was to concentrate all available forces at a single spot in front of the enemy lines, and then break a hole in it with artillery and infantry, easy enough to do even in World War I. Once the hole was opened, tanks could rush through and strike hundreds of miles to the rear.

Somehow I doubt that the use of tanks was included in vernichtungsgedanken.

It looks to me like it is obviously a PRECURSOR to Blitzkrieg (which wasn't invented from thin air, obviously). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 09:24, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Move

The current name is unpronoucable and not understandable in English. Unless it is the common name in the military science English books, I propose to move this article to 'annihilation thoughts doctrine' or at least to 'Vernichtungsgedanken military doctrine' (or something similar). --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus Talk 09:24, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC)

This name is more common than the alternatives. 119 05:43, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC)

• I strongly disagree with any move, Piotrus. Vernichtungsgedanken (Phonetically: Fehr-neekt-oongs-geh-dahnk-ehn) is pronounceable, it is understandable and recognizable among those who know military theory, and simply there are no alternatives. Several German concepts (like Weltanschuung, and other words and concepts that just don't have equivalent translations) just are more recognizable when left untranslated. And continued study of the theories in politics and military texts offer a whole slew of these words. —ExplorerCDT 06:08, 30 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Vernichtungsgedanke

The concept was of course that of the Vernichtungsgedanke, the "concept of annihilation". So it is singular, not plural!--MWAK 08:57, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

"Gedanken" is not necessarily a plural form. It was in use as a variant form of "Gedanke" at least up to the 18th century, so maybe it is the originally used term. (Cf. the german words "Glaube(n)", "Friede(n)", etc.) Hylas 09:07, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

That's a good point. I'll try to find out what was the original term.--MWAK 12:42, 28 August 2006 (UTC)

Maybe, as a german guy, I may help to solve this problem: The german nouns usually show different endings due to case (Kasus: Nom., Akk., Gen., Dat.) and/or number (singular/plural). So if the term Vernichtungsgedanke turns up as a singular, it still can vary its ending due to its function/use in the sentence. If you use the term as a lemma, you normally use the nominative singular and this surely is Vernichtungsgedanke. So, imho the lemma used is correct! --MWB (talk) 13:35, 4 March 2008 (UTC)