Talk:Vegan nutrition

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[edit] Calcium

I removed this statement: "For example - the lack of dairy foods within a diet could lead to minor malnourishment, due to lessened amounts of calcium and riboflavin. There is research which shows that vegans have lower levels of calcium in their body, but this is not supported by any research to show that these low levels are harmful. It is thought that vegans are better able to maintain calcium levels in their body than those following higher protein diets (see Langley, 1988, page 77), although, it is unknown to what extent this is true."

Because it is NOT an example of how vegans cannot get a nutrient from plant based foods, as the sentence preceding it claimed. There are numerous sources of calcium throughout the edible vegetables.--70.224.15.98 18:34, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

I just went ahead and removed the preceding sentence, since it made no sense on it's own. The only nutrient known to be exclusive to animals is arguably B12. That's arguable, because it all depends if you consider bacteria animals.--70.224.15.98 18:34, 24 January 2006 (UTC)


I just removed the comment about the USDA's research on protein induced hypocalciurea and vegans in reference to calcium intake. This source is not credible for this site. the USDA's research techniques can be questionable, since they are the United states department of Agriculture and not an unbiased research facilicy. They have special interests. Allowing that 'study' to post would be like accepting reasearch on a page about smoking ciggarettes that says smoking doesn't cause cancer from the tobacco industry! Its logical that the USDA wants vegans to be malnurished so they go back to dairy to support the companies they represent. Please dont repost that, its a conflict of interest, and against the rules. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.211.117.116 (talk) 01:50, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Despite your opinions on the USDA, they still meet the Wikipedia requirements of a reliable source. All scientific research has some conflict of interest - the way research is set up is supposed to mitigate these. Perhaps a better edit would be to add some information from other reliable sources disputing the USDA's studies. Natalie (talk) 01:53, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Obtaining adequate nutrition

I have mild issues with the following sentence 'Since choice is more limited in a vegan diet than in an omnivorous diet, vegans do need to pay more attention to what they eat to avoid nutrient deficiencies.' While true that the vegan diet selects from a proper food subset compared with omnivorous diet, the sentence seems to imply that in practice a vegan diet is more limited as well. I am not sure such a claim can me made. Through years of my own observation I would say, if anything, vegans eat a far greater variety of foods compared to standard Western diet, however this constitutes original research, which is why I do not change the article. I propose that the sentence be reworked or removed entirely. With the exception of B12, the rest of the article mentions no lack of any essential nutrients in the vegan diet. Such lacking nutrients need to be included for the quoted sentence to have any relevancy. Shawn M. O'Hare 16:03, 15 November 2005 (UTC)


The sentence that Shawn took issue with has been reworded to:
"Vegans should pay attention to what they eat to avoid nutrient deficiencies, as should everyone."
However, this is somewhat obvious, and could also be completely removed. clickman 22:00, 23 November 2005 (UTC)
I have edited the last few sentences in that paragraph to reflect to body of the article. It now reads, "The vegan diet has the advantage of avoiding the health risks associated with excess intake of fat and cholesterol present in fatty meat, cheese and eggs. However, vitamin B12 (Cyanocobalamin) is not readily found in most plant foods, and thus enriched products or suppliments should be consumed." I am unaware of other nutrients specifically lacking in vegan diet, hence the mention of B12 and not a sentence about a general lack of nutrients. Shawn M. O'Hare 19:03, 27 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Move of subject matter from main Vegan page

Hi, just to give you guys a heads up; for the sake's of mutual benefit, we have been talking about moving over the content relating to nutrition from the main vegan page, see here ;

195.82.106.127 05:16, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Misconstrued information

Hello there. I've looked and changed a bit of the article, and will be rewriting it soon. A lot of information is along thr right "lines" but still has a somewhat misconstrued point. For instance, it is noted that such substances in over or under consumption can be "dangerous"; dangerous is a word which is used somewhat seldom in the dietary community, unless it refers to diets which, if continued will indefinately lead to morbidity, or in other words - death.

Although it seems to be wrote from the perspective of a vegan, it is important to note that the term "Vegan" also changes from country to country and person to person; be it their beliefs in religion, their stances on slaughtering, or simply through their dislike for eating meat. Similarly, as a dietician, it is reccomended that patients are reminded of what deficiency means within a vegan diet. For instance, many vegans have the misconstrued idea that veganism means eating nothing but fruit and vegetables. Although significantly more healthy that eating heightened amounts of protein, this idea is somewhat along the wrong lines.

The idea is that protein is "replaced", not "removed" from the diet, and that those protein sources must be attained from somewhere, because in actuality - proteins are essential for the body as they are the precursors of the amino acids, which are dubbed "essential", and rightly so. The effort, however, on this article is very much appreciated and if youhave any collaborative input you wish to supply, then i would be more than helpful to you.

In response to 195.82.106.127, who posted on my talk page; It would be mucheasier if you registered a user-name, particularly because then i am assured that you are not on a shared-IP-address,and that i am talking to you.

Thanks, regards, etc.

Spum 22:06, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Lack of Protein comments

I removed a few sentences that were either erroneous or not pertinent. This article, as well as the general vegan article, reflect a strong view that probably will not be recognized by the majority. Essentially it assumes that a diet that includes animal products is inherently the healhiest, and diets that deviate from a high proportion of animal product consumption are automatically lacking and need to be more planned. My aim though is not to argue these points, though it would be interesting to see the number of dietary articles that claim vegetarian diets are fundamentally lacking, additionally how many show health *benefits* associated with moderate to high meat consumption (i.e., the standard western diet).

In any regard, a number of sentences cropped up in recent edits that refer to the intrinsic lack of protein in the vegetarian diet. Protein concerns really have not been a controversial topic for a number of years, mainly because 1) plants contain an abundance of proteins 2) Lappe's later recanted her idea of combining plant foods to achieve a complete protein. The truth of the matter is that most plants do contain all the essential amino acids and we tend to store them between meals.

Overall though recent edits make a better article. Shawn M. O'Hare 10:50, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] NPOV?

I was reading the article, and this sentence popped out at me.

"Furthermore, the US Dept of Agriculture (USDA), which exists to serve the needs of America's food producers,..." Should this be changed to "Furthermore, the US Department of Agriculture (USDA), which largely appears to exist to serve the needs of the United States' food producers,...", or is this a verifiable fact? Word. Zanturaeon 23:59, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

My only problem (and it was a big problem) was with the wording "serve the needs of". That makes the USDA sound like a lobbyist for the industry. That may be true, but saying so is not very NPOV. I replaced that wording with "regulate", which in an ideal world it does. Hope that sits well with everybody. --Coryma 20:24, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Lead Paragraph Needs Work

"Vegan nutrition encompasses the nutrients vegans require for a balanced diet."

Vegans require the same nutrients as everyone else. A "balanced diet" is a way to get those nutrients. So, "Vegan nutrition encompases human nutrional needs which are needed for the diet needed to needed them."?

"It is an important part of a vegan's life, as it is the foundation for determining which foods should be consumed based on their lifestyle choices."

"An important part of their life is the foundation for making choices based on choices."? So one thing is the foundation for doing something that is based on something else? If the "foundation" is "based on" something else, on what, erm, basis do we call it the "foundation"?

"Vegan nutrition usually refers to the intake and balance of nutrients throughout a day, and therefore is dually classified under dietary regimes and practices."

"What vegans do during the day is both what they do and what they do." For simplicity's sake, let's replace this with: "This sentence tells you what this sentence is about."
Sir, your comments don't make any sense. Very clever, but they don't make any sense. Could you maybe do whatever edits you deem necessary yourself? Only you seem to understand where you are coming from. --Coryma 20:03, 14 August 2006 (UTC)


I created this site a long time ago because I was upset with the philosophical rants and factless USDA contamination of the veganism site. The sole reason for the nutrition site was to include the VEGAN SIX FOOD GROUPS as derived from blood ane urine work done on vegans for the past dozen years by ongoing research. The food part has been erased from this site for some reason. I know we are dealing with people who dont believe protein can be obtained by non-animal sources. But why is there a modified food pyramid? If you follow that pyramid you will become malnurished by lack of omega 3s, and fat soluble vitamins. The vegan food groups are specific to plant based nutriton, you cant just make a protein group. There is no protein rich foods group. Angry people dubious of vegan health should not be editing this site any more than someone who were not kosher editing a kosher site. Can we please keep this site USDA free? Its laughable. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.211.117.116 (talk) 02:01, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Your comments show a basic misunderstanding of the purpose of Wikipedia. It sounds like you created this article as a POV fork - an article forked off of another article in order to promote a specific viewpoint. Anyone can edit any article on Wikipedia, as long as their edits are [[WP:N|neutral] and verifiable. There is no requirement that they have firsthand knowledge of the article subject; this is actually discouraged. It seems like you are editing Wikipedia to push a particular point of view - I would suggest that you read some of the articles at Help:Contents before you edit further. Natalie (talk) 02:07, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Iodine

I have seen reference to the UK having low levels of iodine in the soil due to the last ice-age, this reference comes from the Vegan Society. I have recently contacted them to see where they got this information, I received the following reply: "According to Stephen Walsh PHD in his book 'Plant Based Nutrition and Health' (The Vegan Society, ISBN 0-907337-27-9) "The iodine content of plant foods depends on the iodine content of the soil, which varies greatly from one part of the world to another. Iodine in the soil is low in many areas, including most regions that were covered by ice during the last Ice Age". (p106)". I have not been able to find an independent reference that confirms this. Due to conversations I have had recently with scientists I am inclined to be sceptical, does anyone have a link to a scientific paper or other research that confirms that there are low levels of Iodine in the UK soil. Thanks - Solar 08:35, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Serious Cleanup Needed

What a mess! We have a section on "Fatty Acids" and a separate section on "DHA". We have a section on "Protein and amino acids" and one on "Protein". We have "Vitamins and minterals" and "Calcium", "Iodine", "Iron", "Vitamin B12" and "Vitamin D". This needs major attention and combining that I don't have the patience for.

Also, we have repeated problems of this article conflicting with information in the Vegan article and the Vegan article having more information on this topic.

It seems like one of two things should happen: 1) merge this article into Vegan -or- 2) merge all nutrition info from Vegan

Otherwise, we'll continue to have two articles that will never agree. Mdbrownmsw 17:27, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Half of this stuff was moved from Veganism because it doesn't need to be on that page, but people insist that it should be on wikipedia somewhere. The veganism article was excessively long and doesn't require detailed information about every single vitamin and mineral that may be affected by a vegan diet. Thus, the articles should not be merged, but this article should indeed be cleaned up. Kellen T 11:21, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Health effects of going back to eating meat?

I've heard claims of adverse effects when a person goes omnivore after a period of veganism. People say that some sort of meat-processing bacteria in your digestive system dies or somehow becomes inactive if you don't eat meat, so that you can't go back to eating meat after being a vegan.

Is there a Wikipedia article in which this claim is discussed? I've tried a little searching but I've found nothing on WP. I've heard this claim several times, so if (as I believe) it's not supported by the facts, shouldn't this myth be debunked in (for example) this article? 88.112.7.166 (talk) 14:26, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Unless there is some source saying it is or is not just a myth, it is best just left absent. We shouldn't speculate here.  :) Djk3 (talk) 18:08, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Delete?

See Talk:Veganism#Delete_Vegan_Nutrition? KellenT 18:22, 20 May 2008 (UTC)