Talk:Vedanta University
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 |
This article is within the scope of WikiProject India, which aims to improve Wikipedia's coverage of India-related topics. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page. |
| Stub | This article has been rated as Stub-Class on the quality scale. (add comments) |
|
More information about this article...
|
|
 |
This article is part of WikiProject Universities, an attempt to standardise coverage of universities and colleges. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this notice, or visit the project page, where you can join the project or contribute to the discussion. |
| Stub | This article has been rated as stub-Class on the quality scale. |
[edit] Added later
I went through the article again and saw what you were saying. I edited the article to tone down some of the language used, so that it appears fully neutral.
A reference to the Zambian issue would be very welcome.
SDas 14:06, 10 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Comments on CSHS
It is easy to take a screenshot of the news article and upload it through www.imageshack.us . However, please don't bother. I'll take your word for it.
I am not the one insisting that "my views prevail". I only want items that are verifiable (as per Wikipedia's own guidelines) to prevail. Without any sources, what you claim to be "legitimate controversies" remained nothing more than your unsubstantiated views in the eyes of a neutral third party observer. Furthermore, I can assure you that although I wrote the Vedanta University article entirely on my own (sans a paragraph on controversies), I have no vested interests whatsoever, and my entry is certainly no PR exercise. There are several other wikipedia entries on academic institutions with an equivalent amount of (what you perhaps construe as) extolling. Do check the first paragraph on Duke or Carnegie Mellon for instance, the effusive language used by the Indian media covering the university project, or the description of the university in its own website before accusing me of providing unbalanced information. My language has simply conformed to what the Indian media has reported. But do I cherry pick what I deem suitable for Wikipedia? Possibly, but my judgement is entirely my prerogative (as long as it is verifiable)!
Yours is not the only one that I edited. Someone had posted a link to an obscure site goading people to get further information about the university. When I checked that site, I found no relevant articles. It was obviously there as an advertisement. People use vehicles such as wikipedia unethically in order to gain visibility for their viewpoints/websites. Kindly realize that since you did not add the Zambian issue in the far more pertinent Vedanta Resources wikipedia entry, your intentions were suspect too. As such, a criterion for inserting text into Wikipedia is that it must be verifiable and it also allows for edits without sources to be removed.
Here is the policy in the clearest possible terms:
|
Please also be aware that Vedanta's Zambian activities are only a very small part of its global operations. Vedanta resources is involved heavily in mining activities in Australia too, but its main sources of revenue are South and East India. Based on these observations, it is hard to see any real nexus between Zambian mining (or Australian mining) and Vedanta university. In sharp contrast, the link between its mining activities within the state of Orissa and the university are much more apparent.
However, since you have now said that the issue did indeed appear in a prominent Zambian daily, I too agree now that it should be mentioned in the controversies section. Being a denizen of the "third world" myself, I can see how views from some parts of the world are regularly eclipsed by the international media's obsession with the west, and it is not utterly inconceivable that Indian views could be occluding African ones as well. Hence, a single report from Zambia is good enough to warrant mention in this wikipedia entry.
An entire paragraph would make the section on controversies rather lopsided; a sentence would be appropriate. I would also encourage you to cite the newspaper article in the list of references even if no link is supplied.
I did add two of your earlier sentences on this issue. The correct procedure as per Wikipedia's guidelines would be to allow you time to produce a source before deleting it. Although I do not intend to delete it anymore, I did place a "citations needed" tag as I feel it is the appropriate thing to do. Unfortunately, that is enough grounds for another editor to delete it later as per the guidelines.
SDas 14:51, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Comments on SDas's comments
Thanks you for your further comments. I do suggest that you check out the Wikipedia policies on mature debate and the need for building consensus rather than insisting that your views prevail.
The references you may require appeared in the well-regarded Zambian independent newspaper The Post on 12th September this year, in a column entitled "Chingola University". Chingola is the town where Vedanta resources has its main activities in Zambia. Unfortunately the Post website is not free; if you would like me to e-mail you a copy I can try to contact the author to see if I can get a copy.
I remain absolutely convinced that the Zambian perspective should be included amongst the controversies concerning the University. It does not merit being the first and only point, but is a legitimate controversy here in Zambia that should be reflected even in the addition of a simple couple of sentences. I am disturbed that my legitimate edit is being censored, apparently in the attempt to ensure that the page remains a one-sided public relations exercise.
CSHS 08:17, 3 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Comments on CSHS's issues
The proper place for CSHS's comments is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vedanta_Resources And I am surprised why he/she never bothered to put it there.
Criticisms are welcome in the article as long as they are backed up with evidence (even an iota will do). What was entered earlier were unsubstantiated claims. Furthermore, I do not see why that should go to here (Vedanta University) instead of an article on Vedanta Resources or even one on Agrawal himself! Newspaper articles specifically linking Vedanta University (not Vedanta Resources) with the exploitation of Zambia's resources will suffice! Just a single one will be good enough to merit having a sentence or two on Zambia in this article!
I even did a google on "Vedanta University" and Zambia for news reports, and I was unable to find even a single one. Google returned: "Your search - Zambia "Vedanta University" - did not match any documents.".
Without any evidence, the notion: Zambia is getting exploited by Vedanta Resources -> Agarwal made his personal fortune through Vedanta Resources -> Agarwal used that money to donate to Vedanta University, is a little too far-fetched!
The Vedanta University article provides a fair coverage of the project. It has an entire separate section on criticisms (even if it is an entry for a university!). As a matter of fact I have removed an earlier sentence that Ihad written myself on the equivalence of Vedanta University with some American schools, when someone posted that citations were missing.
SDas 20:01, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Comment on edits by SDas
I am concerned that the piece on Vedanta University is being regularly monitored and edited to provide unbalanced information, contrary to the goal of the collective pursuit of improvements to Wikipedia articles. Whilst the University is undoubtedly an impressive project and philanthropic use of Agarwal's personal resources, the controveries associated with the project should be reflected adequately in order to meet Wikipedia 'neutral point of view' standards.
Since Agarwal is a substantial shareholder in Vedanta Resources, the origin of his personal wealth and the actions of Vedanta Resources are intrinsically linked. Since this activity is happening today, the controversy has much greater relevance than perhaps that concerning Yale University, and should hence be reflected.
I therefore would appreciate if SDas could permit the more open and inclusive development of this page, which already gives great applause to the new University. Adequate discussion of the criticisms of the University and of the activities that have funded it are required to provide a balanced and overall neutral viewpoint. The substantial contribution of its Zambian operations to the Vedanta Resources group turnover means that our views are part of the overall picture.
I therefore intend to revert to the main Vedanta University page and re-insert the Zambian issues into the contraversies section.
CSHS 12:23, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Edits by 62.128.167.30
The following had been added by 62.128.167.30, which I deleted:
"However, critics of Vedanta's investments in Zambia have queried the vast benefaction to the students of Orissa. Thanks to substantial tax concessions awarded to the company, Vedanta's externalised profits from their copper mining activities exceed the entire annual Zambian education budget. With Zambian miners earning low wages, their children have difficulties accessing even primary school. Other areas of social expenditure previously met by mining companies have been cut back. The low level of Vedanta's engagement with development issues in the Copperbelt area raises questions about whether this impressive university project is being made possible through the exploitation of Zambia's naturaland human resources."
While I strongly sympathise with what may have happened in Zambia, Vedanta University is directly financed from Agrawal's personal funds. It is NOT funded by Vedanta Resources. Hence there is no relevance to that controversy in this article. Furthermore, the claims are far-fetched. "Raising questions" about something "being made possible" is not substantial at all.
Elihu Yale made a fortune directly from loot obtained from India. That is a well known fact, not an unsubstantiated claim as in this case. That does not mean that a paragraph about how Elihu Yale exploited India will be posted in the Yale University web site!
The other controversies are ones that are being discussed by politicians and therefore have some degree of relevance. As the controversies subside, those will be deleted.
[edit] Edits by 86.133.84.39
The following paragraph was added: "It is also important to note that Vedanta is heavily involved in a number of controversial mining ventures in India, including heavy investments in Orissa. The company took over NALCO, India's major aluminium mining and smelting company a year or so ago, and is also working on other projects in the State. Like many big mining companies, Vedanta has been criticised for evading pollution controls and ignoring environmental protection regulations, particularly in Tamil Nadu but also in Orissa. There are vested interests on both sides of such disputes, but it is important that news about such ventures as the Vedanta University should go beyond company press releases and mention other aspects of their operations."
I am trying to develop this site as a reference site for Vedanta University along the same lines as those of other universities (check the IITs or Harvard or Stanford etc. in Wikipedia). Perhaps any controversy about the company should go elsewhere.
However, I have retained that paragraph and added some of my own under a separate section "Controversies". Perhaps this issue is important before the inception of the university.
SDas 10:08, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:VedantaUniversityOrissaLogo2.jpg
Image:VedantaUniversityOrissaLogo2.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot 05:24, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
- Added rationale for using the image. It is a logo, and low resolution logos of educational institutions do not constitute copyright violations. SDas 14:21, 14 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:VedantaUniversityOrissaLogo2.jpg
Image:VedantaUniversityOrissaLogo2.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot 04:47, 20 July 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:VedantaUnivOrissaAdvt.jpg
Image:VedantaUnivOrissaAdvt.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.
If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.
BetacommandBot 20:33, 3 December 2007 (UTC)
