Talk:Uriel

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Contents 1 The film "Fallen" 2 Associations 3 Cherub 4 Much work needed 5 Raphael 6 Catholic?

[edit] The film "Fallen"

Could someone, please, give me some more info on the film "fallen"?

--Tokle 16:16, 5 Apr 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Associations

"He is sometimes associated with the color Green, the direction North, or the element Earth." Sometimes? What does "sometimes" actually mean in this sentence? What does "associated" mean in this sentence? Is this "Free associating"? Whom are we talking about here? Who's doing this "associating"? Devotés of séances? Ouija-board parlour sibyls? Edward Gorey fans? What up wid dis? --Wetman 04:05, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)

He is associated with these by practioners of various occult practices, notably Golden Dawn. Same for the assocations with Michael, Raphael, and Gabriel. "Sometimes" pressumable refers to the fact that only they do and not the relgions that the archangles belong to. Associated means that if you wanted help with something related to the element Earth you would call on Uriel as opposed to Michael (who would help with Fire) --Crowley 10:30, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)Crowley

"Hermetics" suggests that the association is made in the Corpus Hermeticum. Is this a fact? Can we get a quote, to give the statement some context? The statement as it stands has no more logical information than the identical statement "He is sometimes associated with Raspberry Sherbet, the New York Yankees and the Sargasso Sea." --Wetman 15:05, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I looked through what I have on the Golden Dawn and found the North association in the Lesser Banishment Ritual of the Pentagram (LBRP), which invokes Uriel in the North (Well it places Uriel on the left while you are facing East, which means Uriel is at the North) (Note, obsevant readers may spot that you appear to be facing North before invoking the archangels, but as you are making a circle around you, you have to end where you started back in the East). The other Archangels I mentioned are also mentioned in the places that other have put them on their respective articles. http://www.sacred-magick.com/pdf/Files/Ceremonial/LBRP.pdf --Crowley 18:38, 18 Apr 2005 (UTC)Crowley

Perhaps you'd edit this into the article's text. Better give it a subsection heading, to identify the rather specialized modern context. --Wetman 04:15, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I've created a new section based on the wording of the other three articles, which appear to be more 'informed' about where the associations come from. They at least have sections of their own on occult/kabberlistic associations. Do let me know what you think ;) --Crowley 13:51, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)Crowley

Definitely improved. The article is getting a sense of the expansion and development of these conceptions of Uriel's role, which is the main interest for the reader. "Sources depict him as the destroyer of the hosts of Sennacherib, as well as the messenger sent by God to Noah to warn him of the impending deluge." There's a mention of Uriel as warning of the Deluge in the text already. Is this in Book of Enoch? Can we get a location for it or even better a quote? How about Uriel and the hosts of Sennacherib here? Can we have a source and return it to the text? Babylonian Talmud maybe? --Wetman 06:08, 24 July 2005 (UTC)

Yes it is 1 Enoch he is mentioned a great many times in Enoch feel free to mosey through to add more stuff, perhaps hes in 2 and 3 Enoch as well? Their is a link to download Enoch on 1 Enoch which you could use. I've added a quote for you about the flood. -- Shimirel ^(Talk) 19:28, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

If anyone finds any links between Uriel and Zuriel let me know I've found "An angel who rules over the month of Elul (September) in the Hebrew calendar. Usually the ruling angel for September is Uriel (Zuriel)" on the net while doing research, but not sure if its true or not would appreciate any input you may have. -- Shimirel ^(Talk) 19:28, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

This text has not been sourced after all: "Uriel is associated with the color Green (or Black), the direction North (or East), the element Earth." Please find a reputable source for these assertions and return them to the article. --Wetman 05:07, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

Well we know that the North part is legit see above, I think the element Earth is from "The Hierarchy of the Blessed Angels" basicly the same as the Angels of the Four Winds... I would be willing to bet the color stuff isn't taken from religious texts but that book I wrote an article about a while ago. Found it Archeia I bet the color thing is either from something like this or an occult reference? The archeia source details all kinds of stuff like angels colors and bits and pieces. When people look up details on the net I thought the article would be useful to prevent people thinking that archeia related bumf comes from some kind of religious source. You see this info all over the net in relation to the well known angels. -- Shimirel ^(Talk) 15:29, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

No its not the Archeia material that lists Uriel as being the angel of "Purple and Gold". -- Shimirel ^(Talk) 15:54, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cherub

Uriel is often identified as the cherub who "stands at the Gate of Eden with a fiery sword," Nope, that's Michael.

thats not exactly true I can think of half a dozen angels and others that are supposed to be the guardians of Eden. Proving that any one angel is the real one well thats something else again! ;^)>

[edit] Much work needed

This article is unreferenced and very poorly organized. Extensive "weasel wording" conceals the sources of much of the information presented, so a reader often has no clue whether a particular idea comes from Christian, Jewish, mainstream, or occult traditions. Ancient traditional accounts are freely mixed with more recent fictional stories. There is a huge list of "References" for such a brief article, which cannot all have been consulted -- it's as if someone just listed all the "angel" related books they knew of whether they were actually used for the article or not. A near-complete rewrite is called for, I think, but I unfortunately have only limited resources for it myself and can only write from a limited perspective. TCC (talk) (contribs) 21:04, 1 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Raphael

This article says that Raphael is mentioned in the canonical Scriptures. I am fairly certain this is not true, but I don't want to edit in case I'm wrong. Anyone?

I've shifted this thread to the bottom, which is where new threads ought to go. When you want to start a new one, just click on the "+" next to "edit this page", and you will get a prompt for a thread title and content. It will be added to the bottom of the page automatically.

Raphael is mentioned in the Book of Tobit, which is rejected by Protestantism and Judaism but is accepted as canonical scripture by a large majority of Christians. TCC (talk) (contribs) 21:04, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Catholic?

Hi I'm getting my Confirmation this year and I was wondering if anyone could tell wether Uriel really exists in Catholic religion...?-Connor 1:21p.m. September 13, 2006

Please don't put that big line across. It messes things up.

This talk page is for discussion of article content only. Even if it were for general discussion, it would be necessary for someone Catholic to be watching here, and I don't know if any are. The appropriate forum for your question is The Reference Desk. TCC (talk) (contribs) 22:38, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

Uriel is not mentioned in the canonical books of Sacred Scripture recognized by the Catholic Church but is mentioned in Enoch (recognized by Ethiopian Orthodox) and in other sources. Uriel was popular and revered by Christians prior to 745, after which the Magisterium limited the reverence of archangels to the three recogized in scripture (Michael, Gabriel and Raphael). Catholic scripture suggests there are at least seven archangels (Revelation and Tobit) but only three have names recognized by Catholic scripture or tradition. Mamalujo 20:44, 25 September 2006 (UTC)