Talk:United Fruit Company

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Contents

[edit] "According to some sources"

According to some sources, the Guatemalan government of Colonel Jacobo Arbenz Guzman was toppled by covert action by the United States government in 1954 at the behest of United Fruit

What's with the "According to some sources"? I have never read any recount of the overthrow of Guzman that does not mention United Fruit's involvement. Is there any source that actually claims they were not involved? Mprudhom 20:16, 21 Jan 2004 (UTC)

"Some" sources - some historians, especially Guatemalan radical historians and conservative American historians believe that the overthrow of the Arbenz government would have happened anyways because of growing discontent with his economic policies, the divisions that agrarian reform created amongst his base, and the large economic downturn (because of the U.S. embargo, which was a non-covert action). Remember, the coup was nearly bloodless. User:146.151.47.114 03:52, 8 November 2005
Well their saying "[it] would have happened anyways..." is not saying United Fruit "were not involved" - in fact it obliquely acknowledges their involvement and attempts to justify it, you can judge for yourself the morality of such a defence. And as for the coup being "nearly bloodless", well spare a thought for the subsequent civil-war. - LamontCranston 17:54, 07 Dec 2005 (UTC)
This is true, the CIA did cause the revolt in guatamala. I just learned it in my ENVS80A class See: Breaksfast of Biodiversity (The Political Ecology of Rain Forest Destruction) ISBN 0-935028-96-X Add it ;) Captain Barrett 07:03, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Honduras in 1910

The revolution in Honduras in 1910 wasn't United's doing, it was the handiwork of Sam Zemurray, who would not sell his company to United until 1927. See Thomas P. McCann's On the Inside (1990) p. 18. PedanticallySpeaking 17:14, Sep 10, 2004 (UTC)

Yes, was that Cuyamel Fruit Company at the time? The article is not as clear as it should be in differentiating various companies that would later become United Fruit from the entity actually known as that. Ideas on the best way to restructure this? I'm not sure that seperate articles would be better, as one article discussing the subject of the U.S. Fruit Companies in Central America can be discussed as a general topic, but calling everything United Fruit may not be the best way to organize it. Pondering, -- Infrogmation 17:24, 17 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Right, Zemurray was Cuyamel. I think we ought to keep all the material together because United Fruit is where people are going to go first, just as I consolidated the material on various dictionaries at Webster's Dictionary because that's what people would probably look for despite the official title of the book. PedanticallySpeaking 17:29, Mar 17, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Cleanup on Aisle 5

Somehow, several sections of the article have been duplicated. Before making any further edits, the article should be cleaned up. Willmcw 00:02, 24 Nov 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Arbenz government

I would like to change the phrase "The Guatemalan government of Colonel Jacobo Arbenz Guzmán was toppled..." to "The Guatemalan, democratically elected, goverment of Colonel Jacobo Arbenz Guzmán was toppled...". It reminds us that although the U.S. pays alot of lip-service to supporting democracy in practice it has not done so. Quite the contrary actually, a right-wing dictatorship seems to have been the most favoured type of government by the U.S. I understand that my motivation for wanting to include this change might be suspect according to Wiki-rules but that doesn't mean it's less true. I would also like to add something about the fact that Arbenz in his attempt at expropriation of United Fruits unused land offered the same amount of money that United Fuit itself valued the land at when paying it's taxes. Thus further showing United Fruit, CIA and Dulles for the scum they truly were. Finally some more information about United Fruits business practices, it's labour practices and the use of dangerous pesticides that left alot of their workers sterile should be included. Their corporate history should also include info about their chnge from United Fruit to United Brands and finally Chiquita Brands. Maybe tie in, at the end of the article, the dispute Chiquita Brands has with the Europan Union. I'm new to wikipedia so thats why I haven't changed anything, I thought I'd aske first to see what people think. If the respons is favourable I take it upon myself to right more on this article as outlined above. I will try to keep it balanced and not let too much of my emotions get in the way. / Guillermo 03:14, 26 October 2005 User:213.114.166.248

"...dangerous pesticides that left alot of their workers sterile..." Would you be refering to Nemagon with that line, or was there more than one pesticide in use that had that 'side-effect'? - LamontCranston 17:57, 07 Dec 2005

[edit] Balance?

This entire article seems rather heavy-handed, favoring a particular political point of view. As such, it's difficult to take any of it seriously. A more balanced presentation would help. User:128.95.135.58 03:31, 19 November 2005

That would be a rather difficult task because United Fruit really did do all this - and more. But hey, feel free to look for and include in an "alternative viewpoint" section the fiction dreamed up by various people, groups & think-tanks that clears United Fruit of any and all wrong doing - LamontCranston 18:00, 07 Dec 2005
The Shadow knows and I agree. PedanticallySpeaking 17:09, 30 December 2005 (UTC)
Uh...thanks, I guess. LamontCranston 19:04, 07 January 2005 (UTC)

I've done some editing on the article. For instance, I removed the following paragraph:

If a particular government or a particular leader disagreed with UFCO tactics and refused to give them what they wanted, UFCO usually took steps to have the government undermined, discredited, or removed altogether. As a result, the UFCO became a political force opposing democratic social and political reform whenever and wherever it developed in order to preserve its dominant place in the banana trade

This extremely broad statement used to be supported by the story of the coup that returned Manuel Bonilla to power in Honduras in 1910. The trouble was that, as discussed at the top of this talk page by others, that coup was sponsored by Sam Zemurray, who then owned Cuyamel, a rival of United Fruit. It was only 20 years later that United Fruit bought Zemurray's company, and 22 years later that Zemurray staged a hostile takeover of United Fruit.

The other example of UFCO's purported government-changing policy was Operation PBSUCCESS. I've also done a little editing on that part of the article. The CIA intervened in Guatemala because they feared Arbenz, an avowed leftist, was also secretly a Communist (one of his hangers-on, for example, was the then obscure young Argentinian doctor Ernesto Guevara). UFCO might have lobbied to convince the US government that Arbenz was a Communist because they feared land reform, but the classified documents recently released by the CIA suggest that UFCO's role was minor, and that the CIA needed little convincing the Arbenz was secretly pro-Soviet (in the same way that, shortly afterwards, Fidel Castro, unbeknowst to the US government, turned out to have been secretly pro-Soviet). -- Eb.hoop 19:20, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

True. The CIA's declassified Freedom of Information Act files on Guatemala, found at http://www.foia.cia.gov/guatemala.asp, indicate that UFC's role must have been quite small. The only documents which I could find of much substance upon searching for "United Fruit Company" indicate that the CIA believed that the Arbenz government was attempting to plant weapons on UFC grounds in order to justify expropriating UFC's property. Appropriate changes should be made in order to highlight the fact that this is not fact, and a more balanced profile of references should be provided. User:Jackson744 07:01, 6 February 2006
  • my 2 cents: Worth of note, re: the CIA and United Fruit. During the Guatamalia period the principle legal agent for the United fruit Company was John Foster Dulles of the Sullivan and Cromwell Law firm His brother was Allen Dulles the head of the CIA (ref Breaksfast of Biodiversity). So though I'm sure FOIA indicates minimal involvement of the UTF with CIA, this personal relationship is telling. Captain Barrett 07:09, 12 February 2007 (UTC)

Concerning balance, the United Fruit Historical Society (external link), in their chronology, actually seems to tell both good things and bad things the UFC and other banana companies have done, although the impact of the misbehaviour would appear to be be greatest on life & politics in Central America - whereas the "good things" are of the kind that would inevitably have happened anyway and should not be attributed to the companies without context, as it appears to me. 83.253.231.49 05:52, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Refs

Chomsky, Neruda, Schlesinger, Che... now all we need is Fidel Castro to make this article complete. User:65.185.190.240 01:22, 23 February 2006

The right really doesn't like to talk about a murdurous company they supported. Blue Leopard 04:51, 2 March 2006 (UTC)
There is a problem, however, in that denunciation of UFCo. was at one point a central component of Communist propaganda in Latin America, and some of these references are therefore probably biased. I am sure someone can find a few mainstream academic studies to include here, by people who were not promoting a particular political cause. (BTW, the first unsigned comment is not by me). -- Eb.hoop 12:20, 2 March 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Merge Keith article into this?

Oppose. Keith was dealing with the Costa Rica government for almost thirty years before founding UFC.--Wehwalt 20:23, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Remarks by 66.183.143.44

According to some sources, Ask or read the history of Costa Rica! The United Fruit Company and the USA invaded Costa Rica and were turned back! Your artical makes it sound like a little walk in the park. The following, copied from - http://www.mssu.edu/international/mccaleb/CostaRica/abuses.htm 66.183.143.44 21:25, 18 November 2006 (UTC)Erase it if you will, but it makes the point. . . .

Consider these examples. Guatemalans lived under the thumb of the American-owned United Fruit Company for decades. The company owned 40 percent of the fertile land, a portion of railroads and port facilities, maintained a monopoly on electricity production and had a powerful influence on political matters. The U.S. government instructed troops of several countries in counter-insurgency tactics, which included the use of napalm and death squads. The death toll in Guatemala alone reached nearly 30,000, mostly civilians. In Nicaragua, the United States prolonged the civil war by funding guerrilla rebel attacks against the communist government. This manipulative intervention did not only occur in Central American countries. The U.S. School of the Americas trained thousands of soldiers from 22 Latin American countries who were later found responsible for some of the worst human rights abuses in the region. The controversial school allegedly advocated tactics such as torture, false imprisonment and execution. Consider one example which is reflective of many U.S. policies toward Latin America. In 1865, American William Walker and his filibusteros attempted to take over the region. Filibusteros are soldiers of fortune who attempt to enrich themselves by conducting unauthorized warfare against countries that are at peace with the United States. Convinced of his superiority by Anglo-Saxon ancestry, Walker felt justified in exterminating cultures and enslaving people for the economic gain of the United States. Walker was determined to annex the region to the United States. First, he and his filibusteros sailed to Nicaragua, and he later declared himself commander-in-chief and legalized slavery. Shortly after, Walker and his 250 men entered Costa Rica in an attempt to seize the land. Costa Rican President Juan Rafael Mora gathered nearly 9,000 men from around the country to come to Costa Rica's defense. During a battle at Santa Rosa Ranch, Walker was forced to retreat to Nicaragua and partake in another bloody battle in the town on Rivas, which resulted in the death of about 1,000 Costa Rican defenders. During the last battle, a peasant boy named Juan Santamaría courageously attempted to set fire to Walker's fortress. Immediately after torching the stronghold, Santamaría collapsed and died, being attacked by gunfire from Walker's men. Walker and his filibusteros took shelter and fled during the night. Faced with militant opposition in Central America, Walker returned to the United States in 1857. Shortly after, he returned to Nicaragua and was captured by the British, who also had interest in Central America. William Walker was turned in to Honduran authorities and quickly executed. 66.183.143.44 21:25, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Sure, this article needs to be greatly expanded in this regard, as the story of Chiquita/United Fruit Company is a story of colonial invasion and economic warfare, and the virtual enslavement of people in numerous countries in 'Bananaland' User:Pedant 17:16, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Neocolonialism on Wikipedia?

Is there any particular reason why seven paragraphs of real estate on this page are taken up with a verbatim quote from a book written by a UFCO apologist? Diane K. Stanley was, in fact, born in a UFCO hospital, not as the child of an actual agricultural worker, but as the daughter of a Welsh UFCO employee and his American wife. So her personal perspective on UFCO is that of an Anglo child of a UFCO executive. She then went on to work for the US Department of State during at least part of the time that both UFCO and the CIA were monkeying around in the region. Is anyone surprised that she sees UFCO as the great white light in the native darkness? Does anyone believe that she's anywhere near objective on the subject? So why does she get the huge coverage, while the contributions of others (including well-respected writers Pablo Neruda and Gabriel Garcia Marquez)get lumped together in a single paragraph? Is there an agenda here? Or is it just that Ms. Stanley's perspective is unique among the almost universal criticism of the company? OhSusanne 07:23, 24 January 2007 (UTC)


-- OhSusanne, I completely agree with your perspective. This is a flagrant violation of wikipedia ethics. Stanley's all-too-lengthy quotation should be severely, if not totally, stricken from the record.

Sstolper 20:54, 29 January 2007 (UTC)Sam

I have gone ahead and pared down significantly the extent of the quotation from Stanley's book. -- Eb.hoop 01:57, 30 January 2007 (UTC)


[edit] bay of pigs

what i seem to miss in this article is more information of their connection to the bay of pigs invasion becaus i don't see the fact that they borrowed their fleet to the cia for the invasion written here these are just not accusations this actually happened

[edit] merge

I support the merge proposal to Chiquita Brands International because Chiquita is the same company, with the same equipment and practices etc., it was merely renamed. User:Pedant 17:06, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

I don't support the merger. The UFC was an important actor in the history of Central America. Most readers searching for information regarding this history would expect to see a unique page. Many differences in how the two companies operate. Notmyrealname 17:42, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Oppose: A joint article would be too long. Also, the UFCo. historically played a role in Central America and Colombia which Chiquita no longer plays. -- Eb.hoop 22:59, 1 August 2007 (UTC) I don't support the idea either, and I'm going to remove the tag. Postlebury 13:08, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Communist affiliation of critics

Notmyrealname has removed my statement that the Latin American authors cited as critics of UFCo., Fallas, Amaya Amador, Asturias, García Márquez, and Neruda, were communists. Fallas was a prominent activist in Vanguardia Popular, the Costa Rican communist party. Neruda served as a senator for the Chilean Communist Party. Amaya Amador emigrated to Czechoslovakia. Asturias was a member of the communist Partido Guatemalteco del Trabajo [1], accepted the Lenin Peace Prize in 1966, and his son became the head of the Guatemalan Marxist insurgency. García Márquez joined the Colombian Communist Party in 1954 [2] and has long been a prominent supporter and close friend of Fidel Castro. Their work reflects a Leninist understanding of imperialism. I think that their identification as communist is relevant and objective.

It's true, of course, that communists were not the only critics of UFCo., and the article cites several of them elsewhere. But I think it should be made clear that part of the reason why UFCo. is so much more notorious than other powerful transnational companies is that it was a leitmotif of Latin American communist discourse for many years. -- Eb.hoop 19:06, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

I have issues with some of the individuals affiliations (is Marquez still a member of the Colombian Communist Party?), but a larger concern I have is that the whole leitmotif assertion (and the general act of singling them out from other critics) is original research. Schlesinger and Kinzer's book Bitter Fruit probably brought the issue to more English-speaking-readers' attention than the others you mention put together. Piero Gleijeses does an even better job in "Shattered Hope." In fact, just about any solid historical book on Guatemala takes a pretty harsh view of the company. I'm sure many communists agreed, but the current (unsourced) argument gives the reader the false impression that the communists made the whole thing up. Notmyrealname 18:52, 23 August 2007 (UTC)
Also, I as an uninitiated reader do recognise the communists without that being explicitly mentioned. More so, I even get the impression that if it weren't for the joint actions of banana companies and the U.S.A., some of them wouldn't even have become (that fierce) communists. So it could be a sort of "chicken and egg" question: which came first? If it is above any doubt they were pronounced communists from the beginning, it could therefore be worth mentioning IMHO, but I think this still would require strong arguments. /sv:Beryllium-9 83.253.231.49 05:43, 26 October 2007 (UTC)
I must also add that there is assumption that critics of United Fruit have an agenda, while defenders such as Diane Stanley do not have their political agenda questioned. I think a more legitimate point is that the majority of defenders of the company are Americans, not Hispanics, and that is just as relevant if not more so than political orientation. The fact that this article gives so much room to United Fruit apologists, who are a minority among those who have written about the effects of United Fruit on the region, is unacceptable. ~~ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.129.156.240 (talk) 02:55, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Insert

Shouldn't this story be inserted, too #Overthrow of government of Guatemala?

Austerlitz -- 88.75.69.185 (talk) 23:36, 6 June 2008 (UTC)