Talk:Underoath

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[edit] They are SCREAMO

hey, have you ever visited UO myspace? on myspace the band chooses "Screamo / Rock / Alternative" as their genre of music, which means they think of themselves as a SCREAMO band. and Tim said on Taste Of Chaos DVD that the only genre of music they DONT listen to was METAL.

it seems that some of you guys believe UO is a metalcore band, but How can you say so?

do you really know about Heavy Metal? i cannot say exactly what metalcore sounds like but Im sure that we cannot put UO into the same category as Hatebreed.

anyway, they are screamo. thats no wonder. Period.

Myspace and the bands themselves aren't reliable sources. Inhumer (talk) 15:48, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

I agree. We can all make a band myspace account, then make the genre as "Screamo / Rock / Alternative", when we play a different kind of music. Just because they view themselves as that, doesn't mean they are. -Lindsey8417 (talk) 19:57, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

The most reliable recourse regarding a bands genre would be the band it self. Saksjn (talk) 18:07, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

Look if you go on Blessthefall's myspace it shows their genre as "healing and easy listening". Now, listen to their songs on there. Do you really think that that is what their music is? Riverpeopleinvasion (talk) 23:07, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Merge proposal

I think the article Old Underoath could be merged into this as a section. Axcess (talk) 03:54, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

I agree. The Underoath article needs quite a bit of work itself and there really isn't a reason to have an "Old Underoath" article. -Lindsey8417 (talk) 08:56, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

It appears that the Old Underoath article started as a blatant cut and paste of the original Underoath Article. Since both articles have been edited since then i think there is still information of value in the Old Underoath article, but I am unsure what. Axcess (talk) 17:33, 11 January 2008 (UTC)

It did look cut and pasted. Anyways, the Underoath article desperately needs a rewrite. The intro is way too short, and there are about 6 citations, so just about the rest of the article remains as POV and original research until proven otherwise. Also, am I the only one who thinks that the whole "Departure From Warped Tour and NOFX Controversy" is too long and completely out of place as the NOFX article doesn't even have a large section devoted to a largely overblown "controversy"? And the band members section... does it need to be so lengthy? Should there just be a 'current' and 'past' members part? -Lindsey8417 (talk) 08:17, 12 January 2008 (UTC)


I just redirected it to here.Inhumer (talk) 00:08, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

That wasn't exactly what I had in mind, there was a guy actively working on that page almost daily... I didn't want to destroy his work, after all that page had evolved much since the original cut and paste. - Axcess (talk) 00:28, 13 January 2008 (UTC)
Theres no need for any band to have two articles. Inhumer (talk) 00:39, 13 January 2008 (UTC)
I know... thats why i proposed the merge... but throwing all that information away isn't exactly a merge. - Axcess (talk) 00:51, 13 January 2008 (UTC)
Well, I started the re-write. It should be in some decent form by later tonight. -Lindsey8417 (talk) 03:09, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] New Stuff

I'm not very good at updating wikipedia or anything, but Underoath has a lot of new stuff going that should probably be added:

http://www.saintrocknroll.com/interview.php?band=Underoath&date=2007-03-23 <-- Small bit of info on a new studio album.

http://underoath777.com/news.php?id=137 <-- Underoath Movie

http://underoath777.com/news.php?id=138 <-- Live concert DVD 75.88.27.166 18:40, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

I added the first source in the future album part Riverpeopleinvasion (talk) 22:18, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Ridiculous Genre Debating

This talk-page is rather large, and mainly discussing what genre the band is. All said, you can't just call them or any band screamo, because of screaming vocals in their music. Their not really metal either. So, I propose instead of having 4 to 5 genre's on the bands page, and the respective pages for all the albums, the band is marked as "Deathcore (early)" and "Christian Metalcore (recent)" with the genre's listed on each album simplified respectively

this talk page isn't one of the lamest edit wars for no reason, the genre's need to be set and basically locked for editing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.253.33.97 (talk) 07:49, 1 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] They ARE hardcore

Although they are hardcore, they CAN also be classified as screamo, because most of the lyrics are screamed. I, unlike most people it seems, am against what has become a barrage of genres, sub-genres etc... 750hgn1md4 (talk) 10:08, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

Another common example of misuse of the screamo genre. ~Ambrosia- talk 07:04, 23 December 2007 (UTC)
The lyrics don't seem to have very emo themes IMO. Plus most hardcore/metalcore bands scream lyrics but are not screamo/emo (Botch anyone?) St. Jimmy 22:29, 13 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Genre, again...

Ok, I'm not here to get into an arguement or start something with the whole genre dispute because frankly, I don't particularly like Wikipedia internet conflicts. Moving on. So, I would just like to know what the other editors had "agreed" on for the infobox genres. Currently in there is: Deathcore, Christian Metalcore, Screamo, and Post Hardcore. I'm not sure I agree with Screamo (it was added in by an annon just a bit ago, and I'm not sure if it was re-added or the annon put it there on pure whim). Are those what was sort of silently agreeed upon? And if so, are there sources besides our personal beliefs? I'll be adding some references, but I'm not sure Deathcore is an appropriate genre - I'd have to agree more with Melodic death metal, which also has a source. -Lindsey8417 (talk) 00:31, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

It was added by Skateremorocker,Rockismorethanmusic, or whichever IP he uses because he think any band with screamy vocals is Screamo. Inhumer (talk) 05:09, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

Infoboxes are only supposed to have information in them that is already in the article. Thus if the infobox was removed no information would be lost. If he is going to add information to an info box, he should also add the appropriate info to the article and cite it. Axcess (talk) 06:28, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

Alright they are a Metalcore band and screamo. but how about this Since non of you think there a screamo band even though there myspace,allmusic,missling,and purevolume. lets just put them a Metalcore since that means Metal and hardcore together,and christian metal. Oh and some of their song are emo, i mean writting on the walls,a moment suppended in time,everyone looks go from here, and couple other songs sound emoish to me.User:Rockismorethanmusic

"In recent years, the term screamo has been very commonly used to describe emo, alternative rock, metalcore, or hardcore bands with emo influences.[3]" - Screamo Article.
If you want to put it all bluntly, screamo is music that is mostly singing vocals with screams added in. For isntance Emery, Kids In The Way's "Safe from the Losing Fight (only)," Swing kids, City of Catterpiller, etc. Listen to those bands, and the only thing that will make them related to underoath is the screaming style (to a point). Also, wikipedia goes by consensus, which I don't like as much as the next guy, but it has already been agreed upon that Underoath has SOME screamo qualities, which is while I kept it in the category. and NO, they are NOT Emo. Emo is styled with lyrics as well, their lyrics are very much anti-emo if you want to put it in those terms. Finally, "couple other songs sound emoish to me." Just because they sound Emo to you doesn't make them emo. You have to KNOW, not THINK. IronCrow (talk) 02:16, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Melodic?

how were underoath ever melodic death metal first of all the melodic version of death metal has more sung vocals than death metal, and underoaths first two albums, typically have 95% screamed vocals, and anyway if these are melodic, who would u call just death metal? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Thrice34 (talk • contribs) 17:05, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Musical style section proposal

Perhaps we can curb some of this by adding a Musical style section to the article itself. We should reduce the infobox to one or two genres as to Aim for Generality, and then take care of the dispute using a Musical style section such as is used in At the Drive-In and Fall Out Boy. Describing Underoath's sound rather than trying to sum it up with one word as a genre would most likely do more justice anyway. We could also say something to the order of "Despite having a highly metalcore sound, Underoath is often referred to as Screamo.", similar to the Musical style section in Fall Out Boy. Axcess (talk) 17:33, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Ok, I am out of my mind, we have a musical style section... But I still think we should narrow down the genres in the infobox and put the alternate genres in the musical style section, as well as something about screamo. Axcess (talk) 17:48, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
I agree. There's already some that has been agreed upon (for the most part), such as them being a Christian band (according to the band itself), and they are metalcore by definition. An overview of their style in a better... format (trying to find a word here) would be great. I think if we add Screamo, it'll make those biased towards screamo happy, but adding "elements of screamo" or something to that effect may help this insanely annoying edit war finally end (it's still going on, partially). IronCrow (talk) 18:13, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

here's my thing the band has openly said they are christian's in a band, but the band it's self says they are just a regular seular hardcore band with christian members in the band. so should we take christian metalcore off the genre and leave Metalcore. then on the sum up we can underoath metalcore band with christian members?User:Rockismorethanmusic. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Rockismorethanmusic (talk • contribs) 19:29, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

I had added a "Musical styles and influences" section and wrote a pretty basic two paragraphs. One about the whole being a Christian band, but moreso in the way they were influenced, and not their lyrics directly. The second paragraph still needs work, but its just a summary of the band through their albums and the shift in their musical style. I think that we should eventually add a paragraph at the beginning stating something like, "Underoath has been described as "*genre*", "*genre*", "*genre*", "*genre*", etc...." and after each genre would be a notable citation. -Lindsey8417 (talk) 22:46, 3 February 2008 (UTC)

Um you never really answer my quistion.User:Rockismorethanmusic —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.3.16.129 (talk) 22:14, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

If you read the Musical Style and influences section, there is a part addressing your concern.

However, as vocalist Spencer Chamberlain explains, "[Christian but in] a different way. We’re not like your average Christian band."[10] He further explains that Christianity is "backbone of our lives, especially in the way that we handle certain things, but it’s not so much the backbone of our lyrics."

In that Quote, Spencer Explains that they are a Christian band, but not your average Christian band. After seeing that quote it seems to me that Christian Metalcore is more accurate than just Metalcore. Axcess (talk) 16:26, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

They a say on this video that christian secnce is not important at all for their band [1] User:Rockismorethanmusic —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.233.232.52 (talk) 15:39, 15 March 2008 (UTC)

Please quit this. Edit wars made my head hurt, and Idon't want it to start up again. I think they've made it clear they are a Christian band with non-evangelicalistic goals. Much like most other Christian bands out nowadays. Tim in the video also said they do limit themselves to the Chrsitian scene. They DID NOT say they are not a Christian band, just that they are not limiting themselves to playing with just Christian bands. Infact, this video might be linked already in the article.IronCrow (talk) 06:58, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Act of Depression sales

I just noticed that under the Act of Depression title it says that the EP sold over 2000 copies.... But on the Act of Depression Page, and from whatever else I have read, only about 1000 were released? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 58.105.113.130 (talk) 05:57, 31 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] 2008 Album

The "Rumor" is that it will be called "I Am the Culprit"? Where is this rumor coming from...? Not to bash the person who wrote it but I would just like to have evidence before I go around spreading this rumor. So do you have a source? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.181.120.99 (talk) 01:56, 27 February 2008 (UTC)

I edited it out since no citation was made. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.199.23.231 (talk) 21:57, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Unblack Metal

Ok am i the only one that believes this is the genre underoath used to play, or am i the only one here thats even heard of it? i mean the sound follows every aspect of this genre.

Unblack Metal is like Christian Black Metal, the two used interchangably. When Thinking of Black Metal or Holy Unblack Metal, think of Antestor, Horde, and some aspects of earlier Extol albums. IronCrow (talk) 15:58, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

thats my point. they sound alot like those bands but with death metal and metalcore mixed in. listen to how the guitars are played and the sound of the vocals for other unblack metal bands and then compare them to one of underoaths songs such as "the last" or "walking away." they both use faint, far away sounding vocals and the guitars are fast paced and each guitar sounds very blended and smooth with a hard edge. what i have also noticed is that black metel uses the... um... i dont know what they are called but its the symbal like things on the drums,whatever those are called, but i have noticed they use it alot more than other genres. you aparently dont know what i mean when i say "aspect." every genre of metal has a patern it follows. (this is the reason nu metal isnt metal. it doesnt follow metal styles. it just sounds hard like metal.) Death metal for example, uses loud pounding guitars, a steady beat (unlike metalcore), excess or increased bass, and angry at-the-top-of-your-lungs, half yelling, half growling vocals. i havent heard one black metal influence in extol at all. the bands u mentioned are all european bands that have some different about them. european black metal bands are a bit different than american black metal bands. antestor was doom metal origanaly but became unblack metal later. to me they are just barely unblack metal. horde is synthetic. its a one man band basically either playing all the parts or using synthetic instruments.

I don't know. I don't think they sound like Antestor, and certainly not Horde. If you haven't heard any Black metal with Extol, listen to their ealier stuff. Antestor has always been labeled black metal since the beginning, not really "Doom Metal" (they called themselves Sorrow Metal). Horde is DEFINITLY not "synthetic," which I think the term you mean is "Industrial (Circle of Dust). Infact, Horde was the first Christian Black Metal band. You stated that with Underoath: "thats my point. they sound alot like those bands but with death metal and metalcore mixed in." then went off to state the bands mentioned were not Black metal/unblack metal. I don't understand what yuou are getting at. IronCrow (talk) 06:47, 23 March 2008 (UTC)

What about Melodic Unblack Metal??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.199.23.231 (talk) 01:38, 2 April 2008 (UTC)


i will elaborate more when i have the time. and what i mean by "they sound like those bands..." is that they sound like many of the bands on the unblack metal page. they all took influences from black metal. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.151.38.188 (talk) 03:03, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

That's where we differ. They sound as unlike as Nickleback and Relient K sound in comparison to each other. IronCrow (talk) 00:47, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

I think they sound Antestor-ish. Like Melodic Unblack Metal is what Id describe old UO. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.199.23.231 (talk) 14:18, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

That's opinion... judging that their instruments and vocals sohave compeltely different frequencies... I don't understand how you could think that... anyways, have a source? ¤IrønCrøw¤ (Speak to Me) 05:19, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

one of my sources "was" underoaths wiki page. quote: "... and in their earlier albums, swimming in the depths of black metal..." this stayed on the page for about half a year (starting from when i first read the page) up untill now. another of my sources are the reviews of their earlier albums on amazon.com. im not saying they were not dethcore, they were mainly dethcore in act of depression and then became mainly unblack metal in cries of the past. i listen to genres with a technical point of view, which is why we disagree. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.150.184.22 (talk) 21:46, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

A wiki is a user edited source so, technical? I listen to music as music.¤IrønCrøw¤ (Speak to Me) 22:30, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Sean Rood?

I looked here earlier today and the article said something along the lines of "On March 28, Underoath announced that Sean Rood would be joining the band, providing low growling vocals and double synth"

i notice it has since been removed, quite rightly as far as i can tell as I have found no evidence to support this claim

does whoever inserted the information have any? Or anyone else know anything on this matter? Smive (talk) 21:07, 2 April 2008 (UTC)

I'd say it's just vandalism or whatnot. ¤IrønCrøw¤ (Speak to Me) 05:19, 13 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Survive kaleidøscøpe

I glance at this page every once and a while, and lately I have noticed that Survive kaleidøscøpe jumps between main releases and dvd. In fact, right now it is in both sections. Perhaps this should be discussed on where it belongs to generate a consensus, and stop the constant movement. Fezmar9 (talk) 23:43, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Also, there are now TWO Survive Kaleidoscope pages: Survive, Kaleidoscope and Survive kaleidøscøpe. Fezmar9 (talk) 03:31, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Survive kaleidøscøpe redirects to the other. I can't say much about what it should be considered though, I don't know enough about it, but seeing as it isn't an album with all new songs... I dunno. ¤IrønCrøw¤ (Speak to Me) 02:31, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Well it looks like the second one got deleted and now redirects to the first - when I made that post there were two distinctly different pages for the same album. Problem solved I guess. I don't think the album belongs in the studio album section. I do now see how this page is set up with DVD's, and I can understand why it is posted in both DVD's and studio albums. The Underoath discography should correspond with the Underoath template and have a separate section for "live albums" with Survive being the only album under this category. Fezmar9 (talk) 03:05, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Underoath's style of muisc

Emo777 (talk) 08:51, 27 April 2008 (UTC)== Underoath's Style of music ==

Everyone keeps asking about they're genre, is it really that hard to figure out. First off they're not screamo, because screamo DOESN'T apply to all forms of screaming music, it only applys to the emo genre (look it up!). Also, I guess they're hard to define because they're style has changed so many times. I wouldn't call them hardcore or punk-rock. Right now I think I'd call them more towards Metalcore than anything, except their 1st 3 albums (Act of Depression, Cries of the Past, and The Changing of Times). Act of Depression and Cries of the Past sounded more like Melodic Death Metal or Deathcore. The Chaning of Times wasn't what I would call any form of metal. That was more just plan hardcore to me. But yeah, i'd call them (Currently) a Christain Metalcore band. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Emo777 (talk • contribs) 08:49, 27 April 2008 (UTC) Emo777 (talk) 04:40, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, technically (by definiton) they fit metalcore, however, I think the big deal is taht they don't sound like other metalcore bands.¤IrønCrøw¤ (Speak to Me) 19:35, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

Well the reson why many people still label underoath screamo is due to their last album. which had more emo elements to it. A real Screamo band is like Blessthefall, Emery, Scary Kids Scaring Kids, Red Jumpsuit Apparatus, A Day To Remember, Chiodos, Alesana, Haste The Day and many other bands. Underoath's style of music has change over time. It's gone from Death Metal/Black Metal to Screamo/emocore. Now their style is More Metalcore/Punk Metal/Post Hardcore, and Yes i would say the screamo and emo elemets are still their but not as much. I mean in Define The Great Line Spencer started to add some death growls, and they are starting to being the double bass back more. I mean how know their next album could be deathcore. I honstly i think we should Put Metalcore/Expermental Metal/Punk Metal/Christian Metal as their genre but thats just me.Skateremorocker (talk) 13:28, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

I wouldn't consider most of the bands you lsited as screamo either, cept Blessthefall and possibly Chiodos. Haste the Day is definitly NOT screamo, it's metalcore. Alesana I would say is, but I already argued with the so-called queen of the Alesana page over it's genre and just left it. And again, Underoath is still metalcore, they are by definition, however, they are more melodic I guess. Still, the genre isn't what is to be primarily focused on - It's the article itself. ¤IrønCrøw¤ (Speak to Me) 03:59, 24 May 2008 (UTC)

Define the Great Line did have some emo elements, but I don't think i'd call them screamo still, mainly due to the fact the screamo bands (usually) don't have deathgrowls in them. I wouldn't call them Unblack Metal either, mainly due to the fact that they're main metal sound was lost when Dallas Taylor and Cory Stager left the band. I think i'd call them Metalcore rather than anything else, but i'm not really sure due to the fact that they said that they're next album was going to be their heaviest album yet, so yeah, it's kinda confusing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Emo777 (talk • contribs) 04:37, 27 May 2008 (UTC) Emo777 (talk) 04:40, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

Yeah... there's a difference between Melodic and emo. Underoath = melodic. Emo = My Chemical Romance. ¤IrønCrøw¤ (Speak to Me) 22:32, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, that's a good example of it.Emo777 (talk) 23:35, 27 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Unknown Song

Hey I've found this song, it's called Failure, and it's by Underoath. The thing is I can't find it on any album, it's not a bonus track, can someone help? I'm pretty sure that it's them, it sounds more like one of their older songs, it's got Dallas Taylor doing vocals, and Cory Stegar on guitar. Any help would be useful, thanks.Emo777 (talk) 09:34, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

If you're refering to this then by reading the comments it belongs to Unearth. This is confirmed by going to The Oncoming Storm, it is the second track on that album and matches the song lengths. Riverpeopleinvasion (talk) 11:10, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, if you got it off iTunes, it's got a good chance of being mislabeled. By the way... that doesn't sound like Taylor to me, heh. ¤IrønCrøw¤ (Speak to Me) 13:40, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Yeah that's the song thanks. Oh, BTW, about the vocals sounding like Taylar, and the Guitar being Cory Stegar, I was in a hurry and didn't think. What I should have put was one of my friends said that it was done by underoath when Taylar and Cory was in the band. I wasn't sure cause it didn't sound like Taylor. And yes, one of my friends downloaded it for me, I don't know if he got it off of itunes or limewire though. Thanks again:)Emo777 (talk) 03:26, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Alright Genre

As of now the genre is Metalcore, Post Hardcore, (old stuff) Deathcore this is right. Many people put Screamo, Emo Now i can understand screamo since many sites label them as screamo. BUT PLESE HELP BECASUE THIS GENRE IS GETTING ME MAD.Skateremorocker (talk) 21:39, 2 June 2008 (UTC)

I agree that their not Emo or any of that but they are Christian so that should be added. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.161.128.207 (talk) 15:39, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

So we aren't labeling them as a christian band and yet its stated that define the great line is the highest charting christian album since 1997. Someone please explain. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.158.67.218 (talk) 06:18, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Well the band did say that they are christians in a band, and that they look at themselfs like a regular seuclar hardcore just with christian members. it says it in the article. so why do we need to post it all over the place. Their just a regular Metalcore/Hardcore Band.Skateremorocker (talk) 12:43, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Grant Brandell???

On the table showing member apperances, it shows that Grant isnt going to be on the next album. Is this a mistake or is it true??? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.199.23.231 (talk) 03:11, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

I noticed this. It doesn't have anything cited, nor does it mention anything about him leaving in the article... Hmm... Methinks it's a mistake. Can anyone provide a source?Mr bouregaurd (talk) 03:55, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

I can't find any source so i added him in for the new album. Took me a while to figure out how though. Damn me being sleep deprived. Riverpeopleinvasion (talk) 10:21, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

I would think if he was leaving they would have announced it on their myspace page.-Sector311 (talk) 14:49, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Pages to be deleted

Just so everyone editing Underoath pages is aware, it is significantly easier to rename a page than it is to create a new page on the same subject. There are two Underoath album pages (Untitled Underoath Album and Live (Underoath album)) that were created before much information was known about them. Once a title and more information was released, a new page was created leaving the old pages abandoned. I have proposed their deletion and alerted the author, the next step is to wait for them to be deleted by an administrator. Fezmar9 (talk) 18:14, 14 June 2008 (UTC)