Template talk:UKSkyscrapers

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[edit] Comments

I am unsure about this template. This can develop into something larger and may need a completely different format or style.

Also, at present, it only has skyscrapers in London and not any buildings outside of London, unlike what the template title seems to suggest.

Finally, what is the "British Skyscraper Series"? I have not come across this. I think this template needs an analysis or evaluation. - Erebus555 13:17, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Height cutoff?

I am confused. There have recently been some removals of building entries from this template as the respective buildings were "too short". Is there a defined height minimum for inclusion? If so, this should probably be worked into the template somewhere, similar to the layout used at Template:Buildings in San Francisco. Cheers, Rai•me 04:01, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Well, the term skyscraper does not have a specific minimum height, although is usually considered to be 150 metres (492 ft). But seeing as the UK has very few highrise structures of this height that are complete, under construction or proposed, I think this height limit is a bit too high. Maybe 100 metres (328 ft) would be a better height limit and would also allow this template to be expanded further. Thoughts? - Erebus555 (talk) 11:32, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

No, I would suggest that the 150m rule should be imposed here. That is the definition of a skyscraper to most in the "skyscraper world" (except the Americans who say 500ft, which is about 2m more). There are plenty of skyscrapers of 150m+ in the UK built, approved or proposed. Anyway, if the lower limit was put down to 100m the template would end up being too big. David (talk) 12:13, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Btw - that's 150m to the roof, not the top of some random spire! David (talk) 12:19, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Finally, if individual cities themselves have their own "skyscraper boxes" they can then include highrise buildings of between 100 and 150 metres. But this is the national box and should be kept to the "elite few" if you know what a I mean! David (talk) 12:21, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

I don't really agree that that is necessarily the "definition of a skyscraper". As long as a building "stands" out and rises higher than other structures in its vicinity, it could easily be considered a skyscraper. Using 150 m as the cutoff is fine, but I still think that it should stated, as we cannot expect the readers to infer that < 150 m ≠ skyscraper. After all, the definition given at skyscraper is:

A skyscraper is a very tall, continuously habitable building. There is no official definition or a precise cutoff height above which a building may clearly be classified as a skyscraper. However, as per usual practice in most cities, the definition is used empirically, depending on the relative impact of the shape of a building to a city's overall skyline. Thus, depending on the average height of the rest of the buildings and/ or structures in a city, even a building of 80 meters height (approximately 262 ft) may be considered a skyscraper provided that it clearly stands out above its surrounding built environment and significantly changes the overall skyline of that particular city.

. Cheers, Rai•me 12:22, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

But if we end up allowing this list being a free-for-all based on what local conditions are like we will have someone from a small town posting their local church onto it. And why not? Church spires are "skyscrapers" by that definition you just gave in many places in England. We need to have a cut off point and it's got to be reasonably high enough so that the list is concise and so that the real, tall skyscrapers of the UK are not devalued by being listed with some 60s tower block of 62 metres. David (talk) 12:38, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

I think listing a building due to it's impact on it's surroundings would lead to a free for all. This could lead to the likes of the Boyd Orr Building in Glasgow being included when its height is relatively unimpressive compared to other highrise structures in Birmingham, London or Manchester. However, I still stand by my point that the cut off limit should be reduced to allow the table to be 'beefed up' a little. Especially, considering that several of the buildings in the template as it is are below the 150 metre mark. - Erebus555 (talk) 12:56, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Okay, but then divide the table into "highrises 100m-150m" and "skyscrapers 150m+" in a similar way to the San Fransisco example given further up this discussion. David (talk) 13:40, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

I wasn't saying that we should include all skyscrapers by any standards; I was just saying that one's definition of a skyscraper will certainly not always be "a building higher than 150 m". I am in favor of a cutoff point, but it should be noted somewhere on the template. Church spires and "local skyscrapers" should be added on individual city building templates, not the national UK one. I agree with Erebus; enlargening the template would be a good idea. This is actually rather small as far as skyscraper templates go. But dividing the template isn't really necessary; it is already divided enough with all of the cities, and having two sets with each set then having more subidivions would look too messy, IMO. Cheers, Rai•me 15:07, 19 April 2008 (UTC)

Somebody keeps adding Liverpool's West Tower to the template and it really should not be on there. It does not even make it onto the List of tallest structures in the United Kingdom and if the list was expanded then the completed list would have to carry on with Broadgate Tower, One Churchill Place, 25 Bank Street, 40 Bank Street and 10 Upper Bank Street all within London.