Talk:Ugly American
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[edit] Comparison with Greene
Is there any relation here with Greene's The Quiet American? I've added a link for now. Deepak 18:51, 25 Sep 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Interpreting the term "Ugly American"
I strongly disagree with the interpretation of the term "ugly American" presented in the article:
- The term is actually, in the context of the novel, a positive one. The Ugly American in the novel is one of the only good characters contained therein. He is an engineer who helps the native people with irrigation systems. The authors chose to make a good character "ugly" to create a contrast with the pretty American ambassadors who in fact were not helping the situation at all.
In contrast to the chapters that describe helpful, generouus, modest, friendly Americans, the book also describes many Americans who were, greedy, short-sighted, bombastic and over-bearing. The book tries to pretend that they are atypical. I believe that almost all foreign readers, and most American readers, see the Americans with the ugly character flaws as the ugly Americans, not the engineer who was the subject of the ironically titled chapter.
Unfortunately, I think other foreign readers will find that Americans who are like the ugly characters the book presents as atypical are more common than the angelic fantasy characters the book presents as typical.
The current article describes the book as fact-based, as if there were no other possible interpretations. It seems to me that Lederer and Burdick are little different than snake-oil salesmen, who made a fortune by peddling the flattery their public wanted to believe.
The one-sided-ness of the current article presents a quandary. How to present alternate points of view without violently gutting the current article? Geo Swan 05:04, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)
- In my reading of the book, I believe their use of the title was meant to be more ambiguous than the current article lets on -- it referred both to the engineer (who was physically ugly but morally good) and to the others (who were physically good looking but morally ugly). They were all "ugly Americans" in a certain sense -- I'm not sure it is really correct to say that the term was "positive" in the book as it was clearly meant to be ironic. I don't know what you mean by snake-oil (Lederer and Burdick were clearly criticizing American foreign policy), but anyway I agree that this paragraph should be rewritten. --Fastfission 21:51, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)
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- For me the clever title has a double meaning which deals with qualities of physical and moral beauty in a cross cultural context. While the book is about Americans in other cultures, the basic plot and archetypal characters are not unique in the context of world history or even current events. I think there are two kinds of foreigners in the world, those who know it and those who don't :) At this point in my life, I am sort of convinced that the vast majority of both types of foreigners are always going to be morally ugly in a cultural context, despite any enlightenment. Lederer and Burdick are definately guilty of taking something old and repackaging it for a market that made it a best seller. I still like many of the parables in the book. But that is me and I am aware that the story might offend others. --Rcollman 12:57, 29 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Book vs Phrase
Perhaps the current conflict could be resolved by separating interpretation of the original source (the book) from the current colloquial meaning of the phrase- actual readings of the book could be in an article for that book. "Ugly American" definitely has a negative meaning, and I would argue the average user of the phrase has no idea what the original source is. brain 06:29, 17 December 2006 (UTC)
