Talk:Tuberculosis

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Featured article star Tuberculosis is a featured article; it (or a previous version of it) has been identified as one of the best articles produced by the Wikipedia community. Even so, if you can update or improve it, please do.
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[edit] TB and Sexual Intercourse?

Can a person suffering from TB conduct a sex life?? It would seem from such famous sufferers as Robert Louis Stevenson, George Orwell and Therese Marten that sufferers of the lung disease often survive for quite a few years before succumbing. Can they therefore maintain a physical relationship? Aside from the severe exertion that would lead to fatigue and, potentially, coughing fits, would there be a greater risk to the sufferer's partner due to the proximity of the pair when they would be breathing against each other? I would be curious to know if sexual relationships can be maintained at all, at least in the earlier stages of the disease. 08:31, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] 2003 talk

Center for Disease Control Division of Tuberculosis Elimination uses form "TB" rather than "T.B." (see link on Tuberculosis)

From the article:

Primary tuberculosis is a person's first exposure to T.B. Assuming the infection was not completely cleared by the immune system (which sometimes happens if the bacterial load was small enough), post primary tuberculosis can occur - this is a reactivation of T.B. following primary tuberculosis (symptomatic or asymptomatic). In 40% of patients with primary T.B., this may take more than 10 years.

The last sentence is strange and unclear. i also think it affects the liver. Certainly, in 100% of patients, this may take more than 10 years. But in what percentage does it actually take more than 10 years? Also, it is not clear what exactly this refers to. The post primary tb lasts for more than 10 years? AxelBoldt 21:06 Jan 2, 2003 (UTC)

It is unclear to me too. I've removed the 40% figure from the article and rephrased. I think part of the problem is the use of the term "post primary tuberculosis", (which first of all needs a hyphen), as opposed to "reactivation tuberculosis" which I think is clearer. Also added on some other missing info about staining characteristics, which remains an important diagnostic technique. Should add info about use of DNA testing of culture results, (permitting rapid, rather than 6 week cultures), too. -- Someone else 21:59 Jan 2, 2003 (UTC)

Few random questions that someone else (or indeed Someone else...) may have some insight into:

  • So what: "In Australia, the incidence of T.B. is currently 6 per 100,000, while for Australians born in Australia, the rate is 1.8 per 100,000."
Is this just giving an idea of what the infection rate in a first-world country is? Is this making a point about health factors for first-generation immigrants, and if so what? Is there something specific to Australia? For that matter, if anyone knows infection rates in countries in which TB is more prevalent, that'd be nice to know.
I've removed this statement, it does sound a bit Pauline Hanson. If they mean that TB is coming into countries with low rates from countries with high rates, then say it. Not just stats that could mean anything. (i'm not saying this was intended, but it's how it sounds). Tristanb 08:13 2 Jun 2003 (UTC)

TB is a disease of poverty, crowding, homelessness, social neglect, and inadequate public health systems. Persons inclined to blame immigrants and immigration for TB can find statistics to support their views: the Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA) <POV on>a rag, not a journal</POV off>claimed, in 1994, that the foreign-born living in the United States were responsible for sixty percent of the total increase in cases from 1985 to 1992. The New York City Task Force of TB's simultaneous analysis showed that increased TB rates were mainly attributable to HIV infection, homelessness, and inadequate health care, which affected immigrants disproportionately. The remedy proposed (on the one hand, to keep immigrants out, and on the other hand to assure them appropriate living conditions and health care on their arrival) depends more on the proposer's political views than on science. -- Someone else 08:27 2 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Is this in the human body, or is this in the lab. I know that TB takes a long time to grow in the lab (like 2-3 weeks to get a visible colony), but I thought this is because people don't know the optimal conditions in the lab -- and that it grows faster in its natural environment, i.e. humans. Seems to me that E. coli divides in about 20 minutes, and takes I'd say ~ 8 hours to form colonies. TB's division time is thus 60x longer, and 60*8 hours = 480 hours = 20 days = ~ 2-3 weeks. I'd suspect that the division time is different in human vs. in lab, but I don't know the #s. Anyone?
  • "For example, T.B. cases in Britain, numbering around 50,000 in 1955, had fallen to around 5,500 in 1987, but for 2001 there were over 7,000 confirmed cases."
This statistic is meaningless without knowing what the change in population in the UK was from 1987 to 2001. Anyone know cases per 100,000 in 1987 and 2001 (or other nearby dates)?
Speak the name of the devil, and he will drop by to italicize species names. <G>. Seriously, all good questions, especially the one on division rate (which varies (obviously) with the virulence of the various specific strains, and depends not only on in vitro vs in vivo, but also is higher in lungs in vivo than in other tissues in vivo, presumably as a function of oxygen tension, and one suspects therefore on a great many other variables), but sadly, no answers here. -- Someone else 00:44 Mar 27, 2003 (UTC)

P.S. FWIW: Infect Immun 1999 Jan;67(1):74-9 "Mycobacterium tuberculosis catalase and peroxidase activities and resistance to oxidative killing in human monocytes in vitro". Manca C, Paul S, Barry CE 3rd, Freedman VH, Kaplan G. [1] found doubling times of about 27-32 hrs intracellularly (in monocytes) and 16-22 hrs extracellularly (acellular culture medium). -- Someone else 00:58 Mar 27, 2003 (UTC)





ABLAHABLAHABLAH SIMRAN BHOGAL/ KING KONG IS LIKE TOOOOOOOOOOTALLY GAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ephney cheng (talk • contribs) 03:41, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Most common?

The first sentence of the article says that tuberculosis is "the most common infectious disease in the world today". Really? More common than the Common cold? That sounds astounding and counterintuitive. Some explanation, please! -- Wondering simply, Infrogmation 06:05, 22 Aug 2004 (UTC)

explanation and clarification - could have stated: most common major infectious disease (ID) in the world, (the top 3 ID killers are HIV/AIDS (3 Million), TB (2 Million), malaria (1 Million)), mostly in developing countries). Stats from WHO, one-third of world has infection (>90% latent TB infection LTBI), about 9 million new cases active disease annually (mostly reactivation from LTBI - 10% lifetime, if HIV 10% annually) with 2 million deaths. Since the common cold is actually caused by several different classes of viruses Virus classification and one-third of the world has been infected by only one species Mycobacterium tuberculosis, TB could still be called the most common infectious disease by a single organism. The adjective "major" has been added to the article. Petersam 09:08, 22 Aug 2004 (UTC)


I dunno how true this is... Check the WHO stats; I've found numbers attributing 8 million deaths per year to TB, which would coincide with the description (as per the WHO) of TB as the greatest killer worldwide..

The latest stats 2003 from WHO are 8.8 million new cases (incidence 140/100,000) with 1.7 million deaths (mortality 28/100,000). 2 billion worldwide are infected with TB, but only about 10% will die as there is treatment for TB (50% will die if not treated). http://www.who.int/tb/publications/global_report/2005/summary/en/index.html In 2003, AIDS/HIV has almost 5 million new cases with almost 3 million deaths, most will die within a few years because the expensive treatment is not available or accessible. http://www.unaids.org/bangkok2004/GAR2004_html/ExecSummary_en/ExecSumm_en_01.htm#P52_5995 TB has recently been surpassed by AIDS/HIV as the infectious disease killer. Also see Infectious disease for 2002 and 1993 data and trends. Petersam 00:16, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

[edit] X-rays (GNU FDL ?)

For a collection of interesting chest X-rays see pl:Gruźlica. They are probably GNU FDL unless employer can claim copyright on them. Kpjas 22:33, 22 Aug 2004 (UTC)

[edit] nominated for FA removal

See Wikipedia:Featured article removal candidates. --mav 06:58, 26 Aug 2004 (UTC)

working on this to address concerns Petersam 10:09, 26 Aug 2004 (UTC)
The 2 concerns raised have been addressed. Lead section is now 3 paragraphs. TOC is now down to 15 headings/subheadings. Tried to substitute HTML header markers H2, H3, etc for the various headings to preserve font size and boldness which reduced the size of TOC, but that interfered with section editing - when editing was clicked, a different section was selected. So now used wiki 3 aposthophes for bolding Petersam 09:03, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Need more photos?

On Polish Wikipedia: http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gru%C5%BAlica You can find some big, good photos, which can be good ilustrations of this article. There are PD or GNU FDL, so You can just upload it to en: server. 17:43, 19 Sep 2004 (UTC)

There are a couple that are, but the one thats currently being used is almost certainly not in the PD. This one [2] is, this one [3] isnt. I was going to swap them around unless anyone has some objections or an even better photo. Agnte 11:02, 13 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Reworded lead section paragraph for clarity

Originally the parts I changed were: "There is a 10 percent lifetime chance that it may progress to active TB disease in which, if left untreated, more than 50 percent of people will die. It is one of the top three infectious disease killers in the world..."

  • As it was, it implied that 90% of the time it is impossible to progress and 10% of the time it might. It should state that 90% it won't progress and 10% it will. As such "There is a 10 percent lifetime chance that LTBI will progress..." is more appropriate.
  • "more than 50 percent of people will die" edited due to passive voice.
  • TB is not a disease killer, it is a killing disease.

I'm no expert on TB, so I document these changes here in case I made anything inaccurate. 15:14, 26 Nov 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Morbus Hungaricus

The TB was known as "morbus hungaricus" throughout Europe in the medieval ages and baroque, because of its extreme prevalence among the magyar people. It continued to hit Hungary very hard until the early 1950's.

After the big WWII destruction the communist dictatorship immediately started a very ambitious anti-TBC programme and spent a lot on radiology equipment, x-ray buses and antibiotics. Mandatory chest x-ray for every adult every year and if a TB patitent failed to take the medicaton, police would throw him/her into prison hospital until totally cured.

It worked, by 1960 there were only two to three dozen deaths per year, instead of ten of thousands (pre-WWII) and the measures were maintained for 25 more years. Since communism fell in 1990 the regulations are no longer vigorously enforced and only 50% of people take the x-ray regularly. The streets are full of homeless TB-people in cities and more average citizens contact TB. There were about 130 TB deaths per year in Hungary in the mid-1990's.

Looks like TBC prefers democracy and that's a disturbing idea.

BTW, I heard russian prisons have the worst TB statistics in the world. Almost all cases are drug-resistant there.

[edit] TB may have killed off leprosy

Found this interesting "There is a theory that having one of these diseases protects a person against contracting the other one, which is called cross immunity. Some say this theory explains the rise of TB and fall of leprosy - more people caught TB and were therefore protected against leprosy." [4] The article is however about a research in progress, so such information wouldn't be acceptable in the front page, but may not hurt to note it here gathima 05:36, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)

[edit] TB vs Malaria

This article claims that Malaria kills only one million people a year, but most of the sources I've seen (including the wikipedia article on it) give two million or more - is it worth looking into further?

See WHO data at Infectious disease. It was 2 million in 1993; down to 1.3 million in 2002 Petersam 05:35, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)
The malaria article has been updated with the WHO Malaria Report 2005 with over 1 million deaths now; see the malaria talk page for references. Petersam 06:20, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)


[edit] TB - Abbreviation for what?

One of our Health Worker training teachers told us that TB stands for Tubercle Bacillus. But Wikipedia says that TB is for tuberculosis. Which is right? 61.0.164.148 06:08, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Both are right, depends on the context. Clinically, it refers to the disease; in microbiology it refers to the tubercle bacillus. Merriam-Webster Online for TB] - Etymology: TB (abbreviation for tubercle bacillus), Definition : TUBERCULOSIS Petersam 21:41, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Thanks! In that case please insert the first abbreviation also. 61.0.164.186 00:54, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Be Bold, you can do it yourself. Petersam 07:24, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Done. 61.0.164.194 16:39, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)
I think both information should be inserted into the article. Troop350 10:52, 9 September 2007 (UTC)

The article starts using 'TB' before it is explained what TB is. I don't like it. -- CraigKeogh 08:25, 4 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Change made to measurement guidelines for tb skin test

I changed the measurement guideline for tb skin test to reflect the actual figures healthcare officials have to go by, i had a tb skin test performed yesterday and talked about the different ways the results are handled. Since i work in the medical field i thought i could help clarify some of the information, also i did not remove the other facts from this section but modified there position and context. 68.153.29.23 - 07:54, 2 July 2005

The complete CDC guidelines for "classification of tuberculin reaction" are listed in the Tuberculosis diagnosis sub-article which was created because the main TB article was getting too large. The changes you added do not apply in the section dealing with "Prevention - BCG vaccine and tuberculin skin test", so I will revert to previous edit. Your edit does point out that the section on "Diagnosis" needs to be expanded a little more so readers know that there is a measurement guideline in the TB diagnosis sub-article. Petersam 3 July 2005 06:16 (UTC)
I moved the "BCG vaccine and tuberculin skin test" subsection out of the Prevention section to Tuberculosis diagnosis. The subsection deals mostly with TB diagnosis and not Prevention. Petersam 3 July 2005 06:59 (UTC)

[edit] national arrogance

It was first used on humans on July 18, 1921 in France, although national arrogance prevented its widespread use in either the USA, Great Britain, or Germany until after World War II.

Is "national arrogance" really Wikipedia:Neutral point of view? Perhaps a brief description of the relationships among the countries is in order, or just remove the phrase entirely "although it did not have widespread use in the USA, Great Britain, or Germany until after World War II." Podkayne 00:20, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

An article entitled "Hypervirulent mutant of Mycobacterium tuberculosis resulting from disruption of the mce1 operon" appears to corroborate this claim. However, I'm not a doctor!

[5]

[edit] genetically modified TB

"In 2003, by disabling a set of genes, researchers accidentally created a more lethal and rapidly reproducing strain of tuberculosis bacteria."

This single sentence paragraph appears with no citation whatsoever. What are the implications? Consequences? Did this really happen? Was it just in a lab?

It is a rather suspect claim, I think.

[edit] Trivia overload

The section "Tuberculosis in art, literature, history and film" is getting severely overloaded with trivia, e.g. minor characters in books of marginal notability. Can we arrive at consensus as to what should be included? My rule of thumb is that if an appearance in popular culture has made a lasting contribution (even if erroneous) to the public perception of a condition, it is includable. JFW | T@lk 19:24, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

No apologies for the slashing that is about to take place. JFW | T@lk 02:33, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
I have split the section in "historical people" and "portrayals". In each I have grouped the items by subject area. This will make it easier to judge the relative prominence of each item. Could others have a look and decide what the parameters for notability should be? JFW | T@lk 02:50, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Isolation

Isolation of TB Patients, Sanatorium therapy and avulsion of the phrenic nerve of the individual to immobilise the diaphragm and give rest to lungs (as it was thought that rest heals the lungs) were the treatment of the past. The present concept is domicillary therapy and active lungs. Hence I am of the opinion that the following line may be edited as it gives a wrong concept to non medical people. The chain of transmission can be stopped by isolating patients with active disease and starting effective anti-tuberculous therapy. Nowadays Isolation is NOT practised as a rule

[edit] Infection rate

I'm not a doctor so maybe I'm missing something here, but this sentence:

"(typically 22% infection rate but everything is possible, even up to 100%)"

Doesn't seem to make sense to me - what does it mean, "everything is possible, even up to 100%"? I assume what is meant is the probability that contact with an infected person will result in you being infected too - so isn't that just one straight probability figure?...

I agree; that statement sticks out like a sore thumbsmollock. I'm going to be bold and remove it, and hope that it'll only go back in if someone can provide a reference supporting that 100% statistic. dfg 16:43, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

I'm not a mathematician, but the maths don't seem to add up here.

"infecting two billion people or one-third of the world's population. Nine million new cases of disease, resulting in two million deaths, occur annually"

At a rate of only nine million a year, even if everyone with TB lived to be a hundred, there'd be only 900 million cases.

My knowledge of TB is a little rusty, but I believe that many people infected with the TB bacterium do not develop the disease. Thus, 1/3 of the world could be infected with only a much smaller number actually becoming sick.

[edit] Symptoms

Shouldn't there be a section outlining the symptoms of TB? And is it really trut aht 1/3 of the people on the earth have this disease??? Arundhati bakshi 16:33, 27 March 2006 (UTC)

Symptoms are in the section The disease / Progression - 5th paragraph; Also in Tuberculosis diagnosis. 1 out of 3 people worldwide have the infection (Latent TB Infection), not the disease; 10% of those infected will develop the disease later in their life (see 3rd paragraph in lead section) . See article for differences. Petersam 19:40, 27 March 2006 (UTC)
Source WHO TB web site http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs104/en/ Petersam 20:36, 27 March 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Historical causes of epidemic TB

TB has been with us since antiguity, but some researchers suggest that it only took on epidemic proportions when hygiene increased, since children no longer were exposed to the bacteria, and could therefore not develop any immunity resistance towards it. Does anyone know more about this?DanielDemaret 06:39, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Peptidoglycan

As both gram-positive and gram-negative bacteria exhibit peptidoglycan in their cell walls, I'm going to remove the reference to it "being related to the gram-positive bacteria".John Sheu 17:17, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Symptoms

Why aren't there any symptoms in this article? 209.7.119.196 16:41, 10 April 2006 (UTC)

Agree. JFW | T@lk 16:57, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
Symptoms are listed in the paragraph under The Disease - Progression. I added a subsection heading 'Symptoms' to locate this topic. Petersam 18:55, 24 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] socioeconomic factors in TB

I was disappointed to see almost no attention to such critical factors as housing, poverty, substance abuse and AIDS that affect the incidence of TB. TB rates dropped wherever overcrowding was reduced and standards of living increased. See for example http://knews.knet.ca/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=1942

Vronsky

[edit] History Question

Out of curiosity, why isn't there any mention of Selman Waksman in the history, or for that matter, anywhere else in the article? It strikes me as a rather grievous omission to neglect mention of a man so instrumental in the treatment of Tuberculosis. I'd add something but it's already been well established that I'm biased on matters relating to Selman Waksman or Albert Schatz (who should probably also be mentioned). --gwax UN (say hi) 03:19, 10 May 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Self-contradiction

"TB infects, as of 2004, around 14.6 million people in the world... TB infects approximately a third of the world's population. Approximately 14.6 million people died from TB in 2004."

Taken together, these imply a roughly 100% mortality rate, and that the total population of the world is about 45 million. --Calair 23:29, 21 May 2006 (UTC)


From the first citation ([6]), in 2004 there were 14.6M infections and 1.7M deaths. The bad numbers appear in the second and third paragraphs of the introduction and under Epidemiology. -=Blurble 15:01, 24 May 2006 (UTC)
Fixed. 147.188.244.139 16:43, 24 May 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Infection vs. Disease --- Incidence vs. Prevalence vs. Mortality

The correct numbers are 2 billion people have TB infection with 14.6 million active TB disease; in 2004, 8.9 million new cases with 14.6 existing cases and 1.7 million deaths. Recent edits have shown that there is some confusion between latent TB infection (LTBI) and active TB disease. According to WHO [7], one-third of the world's population (2 billion people) is currently infected with the TB bacillus. ... However, people infected with TB bacilli will not necessarily become sick with the (active) disease. The immune system "walls off" the TB bacilli which, protected by a thick waxy coat, can lie dormant for years. When someone's immune system is weakened, the chances of becoming sick are greater. 5-10% of people who are infected with TB bacilli (but who are not infected with HIV) become sick or infectious at some time during their life. People with HIV and TB infection are much more likely to develop TB. For 2004 WHO reports 8.9 million new cases of active TB (Incidence (epidemiology)) with 14.6 million existing cases of active TB (prevalence) and 1.7 million deaths due to active TB (mortality). Petersam 08:05, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] History or Relevant, for disambiguity and ranked searching or search ranking?

TB abbreviation TT

TB and peritonitis

1966 Webster's Third New International Dictionary lists abreviation TT Page 2,458 TT 1.. 2.. 6 tuberculin tested

1966 Webster's Third New International Dictionary lists TB a cause of 2 diseases Page 2,459 tuberculous 1 : .. 2 a : constituting or affected with tuberculosis ... b : caused by or resulting from the prescence or products of the tubercle bacillus <~ peritonitis> <~ meningtis> — tuberculously adv

John Zdralek my mom can slice thinner than your mom (joke) 06:13, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

question - who posts to the talk and does a person talk then is selected by the editor to be talk what is talk?

hmmm... obviously there is a difficulty uploading a verified image of the dictionary to a talk page ... let then try else this

1966 Webster's Third New International Dictionary
1966 Webster's Third New International Dictionary

[edit] Charles Bukowski

Added Charles Bukowski to the Literature and Poetry section. I think this is particularly interesting since he contracted TB in 1988. I think this is particularly interesting since this is much later than any of the others in the section. He is also considered a major American author and deserves to be noted. Liontamarin 10:22, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Red Death is not TB

Poe's The Masque of the Red Death described "Red Death" as "sharp pains, and sudden dizziness, and then profuse bleeding at the pores" and death within half an hour. This is not TB; see article for symptoms. TB does not kill that fast, but can take longer, up to several years, to finally kill its victims. TB did affect Poe's life in claiming the lives of those he loved. This story describes his perception of how TB affected him, but does not describe any real disease. I have not seen any reference to Red Death describing any actual disease. Therefore, I removed Red Death from the Other names for the disease section. Petersam 09:23, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Nine million new cases"

This sentence is from the second paragraph of the intro:

"As of 2004, 14.6 million people have active TB disease with nine million new cases of the disease and nearly two million deaths, [1] mostly in developing countries."

It talks about "nine million new cases of the disease and nearly two million deaths". Does this mean anually, there are these many new cases/deaths? If so, it should state so! Reading it is fairly confusing. T. S. Rice 03:27, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

Added the terms prevalence, incidence, and mortality to clarify the numbers. See section above Infection vs. Disease --- Incidence vs. Prevalence vs. Mortality Petersam 07:09, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Confusing statement

The article says "While only 10% of TB infection progresses to TB disease, if untreated the death rate is 51%." Does this mean 51% of everyone infected will die, or that of the 10% that get the disease, 51% of them will die? Vicarious 07:44, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

Changed to: Most of those infected (90%) have asymptomatic latent TB infection (LTBI). There is a 10% lifetime chance that LTBI will progress to TB disease. If untreated, the death rate for active TB disease is more than 50%. Petersam 08:24, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
Thanks Vicarious 02:45, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] US guidance

Will people please STOP chopping and pasting bits wholesale from the CDC website and pretending that they apply to the whole world? CDC recommendations are specific to the US and are NOT relevant to other countries: in fact, many CDC recommendations directly contradict the recommendations of other countries and international health organisations (including the WHO). If you ARE going to put CDC guidance into this article, PLEASE mark it as US specific, or at the VERY least be polite enough to reference statements as coming from CDC guidance. --Gak 18:09, 17 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Overcrowding

Could someone please write something about overcrowding.

[edit] Improved TB vaccine developed

This is an improvement, especially given that drug resistant TB has been on the increase.[8]

[edit] TB is Gram Positive

"phylogenically it IS gram positive. Running the actual gram stain however can yield poor results because of the waxy outer well wall composed of LAM and Mannophosphinositide" Supporting Information can be found on http://www.mansfield.ohio-state.edu/~sabedon/biol4045.htm#mycobacterium_tuberculosis --darkphase 13:23, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for spotting this error. It has been corrected. TimVickers 16:48, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Treatment

Should we keep this and reformat it, or is it too specific? TimVickers 18:10, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Chemoprophylaxis, AND Izoniazid, AS WELL AS rifampin, pyrazinamide AND ethambutol COULD BE USED TO TREAT TUBERCULOSIS, OVER A SIX MONTH COURSE. ANY PREGNANT MOTHERS SUSPECTED TO HAVE TUBERCULOSIS, MUST IMMEDIATELY BE TREATED, BECAUSE THERE IS A HIGH RISK OF THE BABIES AND THE MOTHER BEING VERY HEAVILY AFFECTED. ethambutol IS RECCOMENDED FOR CHILDEN, WILE THE OTHERS COULD BE TRATED WITH ALL THESE DRUGS. IT IS STRONGLY RECOMENDED THAT PATIENTS CONTINUE THEIR REGIMENTS UNTIL THEIR ANTIBIOTICS RUN OUT. Chemoprophylaxis, Izoniazid, Rifampin, AND Pyrazinamide SHOULD BE USED OVER THE ENTIRE REGIMENT. Ethambutol SHOULD BE CUT BACK, OR ELIMINATED ALTOGETHER AFTER THREE MONTHS.
I see very little there that is salvageable or encyclopedic. Sandy (Talk) 19:20, 17 November 2006 (UTC)
I agree. TimVickers 19:36, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] World Map

That map does not even have some countries on! It should be either fixed or removed because it's highly inaccurate. Suane

Which countries are missing? TimVickers 16:08, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
A lot. It's obviously deeply outdated (Socialist era). I found Slovakia, Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Serbia & Montenegro, Macedonia, Albania, Ukraine, Belarus, Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, Kazachstan, Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan, Kyrgistan, Tajikistan missing. I might be not so exact about that, since the map is quite small. New base map should be used, and colored according to the newest WHO data. Suane 21:06, 27 November 2006
Haha, yes that is a VERY old map. Disco 12:10, 19 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] TB vaccines

The para on the main tuberculosis page under vaccines:

"Several new vaccines to prevent TB infection are being developed. The first recombinant tuberculosis vaccine entered clinical trials in the United States in 2004, sponsored by the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID).[32] A 2005 study showed that a DNA TB vaccine given with conventional chemotherapy can accelerate the disappearance of bacteria as well as protect against re-infection in mice; it may take four to five years to be available in humans.[33] The only TB vaccine currently in phase III trials is MVA85A, which is being trialed in South Africa by a group led by Oxford University,[34] and is based on a genetically modified vaccinia virus. Because of the limitations of current vaccines, researchers and policymakers are promoting new economic models of vaccine development including prizes, tax incentives and advance market commitments.[35][36]"

is inaccurate in the sense that MVA85A is not yet in phase 3 trials - these are still at least 2 years away. The vaccine is in phase one and two trials in the UK (Oxford), South Africa (Cape Town) and The Gambia.

I cannot make the changes as the page is restricted - maybe someone else can.

There are also a number of other new TB vaccines which are in phase 1 trials, produced by Glaxo Smith Kline (GSK), Statum serum Instituut (SSI) and the Aeras Global TB Vaccine Foundation (www.aeras.org) which should be added to the list.

Tony Hawkridge University of Cape Town tony@rmh.uct.ac.za —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 41.241.91.81 (talk) 04:56, 10 December 2006 (UTC).

[edit] High number for infected correct?

"Over one-third of the world's population now has the TB bacterium in their bodies ... one in ten latent infections will progress to active TB disease which, if left untreated, will kill more than half of its victims." -- 1 in 30 persons in the world today is expected to develop active tuberculosis disease? (220 million persons). Is this right? -- 201.50.251.197 15:37, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Indeed, it is described more fully in the WHO factsheet reference. TimVickers 16:27, 26 February 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the info. One more thing to lose sleep over. :-( -- 201.50.251.197 01:48, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Cell damage help

I'm doing a grade 8 science project about tuberculosis and I've looked all over the internet but i cant find the following information: How does TB affect certain types of cells (how does it affect muscle cells, blood cells etc...), what happens to the tissues of the cells, and how does the infection prevent the cells from doing their job (therefore, how does it affect the body). If anyone could please help me find any of hat info it would be greatly appreciated. -Demonskyline7

There is a bit in this article, see the pathogenesis section. TimVickers 22:54, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

Yeah I read that over 100 times, but I can't really understand all these scientific terms... or find the information I need

In non-technical terms, TB grow within the white blood cells (immune cells) called macrophages. The multiplication of the bacteria kills the macrophages and bursts them open. In tissues, the dying macrophages attract other immune cells that damage the tissue in their efforts to kill the bacteria. The most common cause of death is destruction of lung tissue and slow suffocation. this is a much more technical description of this process. TimVickers 03:12, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, that helped. ;) -Demonskylne7

I cant understand a lot of it... can you copy-paste the section where it mainly explains how it damages cells? because I need to write one page on how it damages cells and how this damage distrupts cells from their usual activities, and how this damages the body.

You can copy and use anything in Wikipedia without any restriction, as its content is in the public domain. However, you will need to cite Wikipedia as the source if you simply copy the section and use it without making any major modifications. TimVickers 22:18, 26 March 2007 (UTC)
I meant if YOU can find me the main paragraph here which explains how TB damages cells and the rest of things I need for my essay and copy-paste it here or somewhere... because i need a one-page explanation of what i said earlier by tomorrow... Thanks for your effort to help :) -Demonskyline7 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 74.103.176.163 (talk) 23:02, 26 March 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Famous deaths

I don't see the need for this section. In the Medical Manual of Style it says this isn't usually a good idea to do this for common conditions. TimVickers 03:22, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The world map

The world map on that page, when I click on it, the country Taiwan seems to be colored white. Since this page is an FA article, I did not want to ruin it. So, if someone can verify the color. Thanks, CarpD 3/23/07.

I'm afraid Taiwan isn't covered in the WHO data from which the map was generated, I don't know why not. TimVickers 15:40, 24 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] what is tuberculosis

what is tuberculosis may i ask why does it hurt so many people in our everyday life?♥ —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 170.211.123.123 (talk) 15:15, 30 March 2007 (UTC).

I hope if you read the article it will answer that question. TimVickers 15:26, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Intro sort of misleading

The intro states that "Tuberculosis (abbreviated as TB for Tubercle Bacillus) is a common and deadly infectious disease caused by the mycobacterium Mycobacterium tuberculosis or Mycobacterium bovis."

However, the article later goes on to state two more species that cause tuberculosis - M. africanum and M. microti. This exclusion is unjustified. I think we should reword the intro to include these two species. Agree/Disagree? KBi 00:15, 11 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Infection/Transmission?

Is TB Contagious?

Yes, read the article. TimVickers 18:31, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

I thought the TB bacterium needs to enter the respiratory system in order to infect a person. But the article says it can be transmitted through kissing, spitting and using unsterilized eating utensils. Does this mean, TB can be transmitted through contacting the body fluids of a person with active TB? How long can TB bacteria survive in the air?

[edit] Need to include some of the nineteenth century folklore

The folklore information is one sided. I would like to add some things about how TB was romanticized. The Spes phthisica, how many aesthetes did their creative work while suffering from it, and it's reputation for increasing sex drive and feelings of euphoria. Here is what I would add to the folklore section: {{editprotected}} TB was romanticized in the nineteenth century. Since TB sometimes produces feelings of euphoria referred to as "Spes phthisica" or "hope of the consumptive", some TB sufferers were said to have bursts of creativity as the disease progressed. For instance, Frederic Chopin complained that he could not compose unless he was coughing blood. It was also believed that TB sufferers acquired a final burst of energy just before they died which made women more beautiful and men more creative.

Vincentsharma 02:21, 19 May 2007 (UTC)Vincent

Template:editprotected is for specific edits to a particular page. If you have text to insert into the article that is uncontroversial and follows consensus, please feel free to re-enable the editprotected tag. Cheers. --MZMcBride 02:30, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Okay, perhaps I should do a better job of making it clear that this was the belief of the time. That's why I want it added to the folklore section and not the history or medical sections. Also, I removed the quote from Chopin since I can't cite it (I read it on in an article that didn't cite it). How about this: {{editprotected}} TB was romanticized in the nineteenth century. Many at the time believed TB produced feelings of euphoria referred to as "Spes phthisica" or "hope of the consumptive". It was believed that TB sufferers who were artists had bursts of creativity as the disease progressed. It was also believed that TB sufferers acquired a final burst of energy just before they died which made women more beautiful and men more creative. Lawlor, Clark. Studies in the Literary Imagination. Retrieved on 2007-05-18.

We can either add this directly, or as the page is only semi-protected, in 4 days you will be able to edit it yourself (semi-protection only blocks newly-registered users). TimVickers 12:19, 19 May 2007 (UTC)
I've disabled the editprotected tag. Almost any editor can add the text should they want to. Cheers. --MZMcBride 03:19, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
I added it.Vincentsharma 00:18, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Tubercluosis affecting Brain

Dear Friends,

I am looking for much literature on the Tubercluosis in the Brain. If U have any important inputs on this topic. Pls discuss with me.

Rgds, JayantJayant94026 16:30, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Try the reference desk. There's tuberculous meningitis, cerebral TB (e.g. in AIDS)... Prognosis not great. JFW | T@lk 21:41, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bovine tuberculosis

Does this deserve its own article? I got redirected here but there isn't much information on the subject. Richard001 01:00, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

Changed redirect to Mycobacterium bovis. TimVickers 15:13, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Genomics

doi:10.1172/JCI31810 genomics in TB diagnosis and treatment. JFW | T@lk 21:42, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Possible improvements?

In this part of a sentence in the 4th paragraph—"data show that, from 2000 to 2004, 20% of TB cases were resistant to standard treatments and 2% were also resistant to second-line drugs"—are the 2% of cases part of the 20%, or are they a separate category?

Also, under "Transmission", I think it would be good to define or clarify the meaning of "congregate settings" in "residents and employees of high-risk congregate settings".

I've made a few additions, most of them minor and just for the sake of clarification, but the one I'm most worried about is the reference to "histological techniques" under "Bacterial species" since, although I've studied histology, my knowledge is still only rudimentary. Thanks, everyone! Scrawlspacer 14:59, 12 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Evolution vs. mutation

I noticed there was a disagreement about whether to use evolution or mutation in a sentence under Bacterial species:

During its evolution, M. tuberculosis has lost numerous coding and non-coding regions in its genome, losses that can be used to distinguish between strains of the bacterium.

If this question comes up again, I'd like to support the use of evolution. After all, mutation is not the only evolutionary mechanism, and one might even want to specify the kind of mutation taking place (e.g., hereditary, environmentally caused through radiation or something similar, etc.). Mutation also gives the impression that the change happens over a shorter time than evolution does, since evolution refers to the entirety of an organism's existence on the planet, from first appearance to extinction. Be well, all! Scrawlspacer 08:52, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Transmission reference re: 40.000 droplets.

Although the reference cited is quite interesting as well as informative, it does not contain the specific information (the number of aerosol droplets contained in a sneeze) which it supposedly confirms. Guille 21:45, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

On page 455, line 10 the article states "A sneeze can generate as many as 40,000 droplets, which can evaporate to particles in the 0.5 to 12 μm range." I've reworded the article to say "A single sneeze, for instance, can release up to 40,000 droplets" from the original that stated "about 40,000 droplets". Tim Vickers 22:07, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Page 455? line 10? The site referenced has 17 lines of text in a single paragraph. Perhaps you should link to the actual citation rather than the synopsis of the article? Guille 16:42, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

That is the abstract of the paper. Click on the link saying "Full text article" at middle right of that page. If you do not have access to a library that subscribes to this journal, please e-mail me from my userpage and I can attach the Pdf in my reply. All the best Tim Vickers 16:50, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Sorry I fucked up while creating a new redirect

Please repair it. I don't know how to. The whole history of this article is moved. --Koreanjason 06:55, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

Done. Please don't do that again. Where did you want Colin Flooks to redirect to? I've left the redirect blank for now. Tim Vickers 17:08, 4 September 2007 (UTC)
Fixed redirect. Nothing to see here people, move along now. Tim Vickers 19:43, 4 September 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Appetite loss

According to the article, appetite loss is a symptom. But, I've heard that an increased appetite is also a symptom. I was wondering if both are true, and it goes in a cycle, or if the increase is wrong. Lascoden 03:22, 10 September 2007 (UTC)


[edit] California ban on Gerbils

Can someone check the reference? The text implies that Gerbils are banned from California due to passing on TB, whereas from what I have read it seems that they are banned for fear of crop damage. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.107.141.221 (talk) 22:03, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Good question. They are termed "detrimental animals" in the regulations (link) but the reason is not given. Tim Vickers 02:52, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Map of incidence

I corrected a map of incidence per [9] for the European Union. It really needs hard proofcheck because map as I found it there is not based on real data. ≈Tulkolahten≈≈talk≈ 20:44, 10 December 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Consumption article?

What is the connection between this article and the consumption article? The consumption article is a poor version of this one, although perhaps it should direct to history of TB? Not sure, but consumption needs help. --Zachbe (talk) 23:14, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

Consumption is a disambiguation page that should only give redirects to articles. So I've removed the TB text that was added by 59.92.164.141 from Consumption. Since none of the text was cited, it didn't make sense to merge the text into the tuberculosis article. (Cross-posted to Talk:Consumption) –panda (talk) 23:39, 3 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Ranke's Complex

I couldn't find a reference here to Ranke's complex (calcified TB lesion located in lung parenchyma and hilar lymph nodes) - is this something worth adding or is there a better place for it or is it even worth the mention? Thanks! BruceD270 (talk) 15:42, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

There's an article under the alternative name of Ghon's complex, we don't have anything about the stages of TB infection here, if you could write a paragraph that would be great. Tim Vickers (talk) 18:43, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Cure in a dry climate

In movies about the past, a recent example is "3:10 to Yuma", people talk of moving to a dry climate to treat tuberculosis. Is such a climate helpful? Or is this just a myth? --206.63.95.15 (talk) 18:53, 17 February 2008 (UTC). Another example is the movie "Tombstone" which features the O.K. Corral shootout. In the movie a character by the name of Doc. Holliday is dying of TB. (Edited May,6,2008).