Talk:Tsakhiagiin Elbegdorj

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[edit] Biography assessment rating comment

WikiProject Biography Summer 2007 Assessment Drive

Could use an infobox, but otherwise a B.

The article may be improved by following the WikiProject Biography 11 easy steps to producing at least a B article. -- Yamara 17:22, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Discussion

This article is hardly NPOV. Furthermore, it seems that it has been translated (poorly, probably by means of BabelFish or the like) into French and German, replacing the previous versions on those pedias. /The Phoenix 09:03, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] THIS ARTICLE IS VERIFIED FACTS WITH TONS OF INTERNATIONAL RESOURCES

This article looks correct. The Phoenix, if you don't know please read more in the internet.

  • Whether the facts are true or false is irrelevant - the main point is that the sources of information must be cited in the article.--Aleron235 03:21, 15 February 2006 (UTC)


The POV problem has been reduced, but not elimintated:

  • If you want to claim that MPRP politicians are corrupt, then you need to prove that, and news reporting doesn't count as proof in this context. You either need someone to publically admit his corruption, or a court decision. (Writing "the DP thinks they are corrupt" would be ok).
  • The word frantic is POV.
  • You write that "MPRP illegally overthrew" his governement. Can you show which clauses of the constitution were violated? Because if there is no violation of the constitution, then the governement change was legal (coalition contracts are not legally binding).
  • "More than half of the population who voted for DP" can't be correct, because the DP doesn't hold more than half of the seats in parliament (non-MPRP doesn't automatically mean DP).

And that's just some of the problems with one single paragraph. There's still a lot of work to be done here.

Btw: Those "tons of international resources" are urtimately based on just two or three agency reports. There's no point in listing them all. Better try to trace down the original reports (AP/Reuters/etc.) and just list those. --Latebird 10:32, 15 February 2006 (UTC)

POV Corrected.


This article is neutral. Why do you keep posting POV sign? --Okonji 03:27, 16 February 2006 (UCT)

You seem to have quite a different idea of "neutral" than the rest of the world. My points above are just a few examples of the existing POV, and you didn't even take notice of them. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of him personally, but the current text is pure propaganda, and not fit for an encyclopedia. --Latebird 07:30, 16 February 2006 (UTC)

The same stuff has now appeared in the article about Miyeegombo Enkhbold. --Latebird 00:39, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

Because Miyeegombo Enkhbold overthrew Elbegdorj's government, the fact belongs to both people. -- Lemonhead 18:51, 17 February 2006 (UTC)

This article is still not NPOV. I did a major edit to this article, which includes grammar corrections. Some may think that I am against Elbegdorj because I removed some of the harsh criticisms of the communist government and some of the most praising language for Elbegdorj. This is not true; he seems like a great person and leader from what I have read, but some of the language off this article is not generally appropriate for articles in Wikipedia. Academic Challenger 22:44, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] trivia

Would it be OK to delete the trivia section? Most of it seems irrelevant or nonsensical.

Elbegdorj half jokingly said "Genghis Khan wasn't really a bad guy", "he just had bad press" in an interview with Boston Globe. is a pretty standard sentence for any Mongolian (or, almost any)
Mongolians call Elbegdorj the Golden Falcon of Democracy, alluding to a bird that comes with spring sunshine after a long, harsh winter. I don't know any Mongolians who call him that. I have met Mongolians who call him a man who loves to hear himself talking (MPRP supporters, incidentically), but I would never add such stuff to a trivia section
For his efforts and contribution in the creation and strengthening of the democratic system in Mongolia, Elbegdorj was awarded the medal "Freedom." This might actually be worth mentioning, if we knew when and by whom?
In reference to his work, Elbegdorj has been referred to as "Mongolia's Thomas Jefferson". see comment on second entry.

I have nothing against Elbegdorj, but these trivia just don't seem to really belong into an encyclopedia. Yaan 19:02, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

The trivia are one of the last bits of POV-ish stuff that I didn't remove when cleaning up the article. As fat as I am concerned, feel free to dispose of them. --Latebird 21:51, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Accident

Please remember that we are trying to write an encyclopedia here, and not a news publication. Overly detailed information or sensationalist speculations as they might be found in the tabloid press or aired on TV are not appropriate here. Specifically:

  • The exact time of the accident is not relevant.
  • The exact emergency organisation he called is not relevant.
  • Specific details about his progress are not relevant (saying that he was in a coma and is getting better is entirely enough).
  • If we inform about speculations (MPRP involvement), then we must say whether those have been confirmed or not (not doing so is defamation).
  • Unspecific links to the home page of a Mongolian language news site (which most of the time doesn't mention Elbegdorj) are not relevant.

I have reset the article again to an encyclopedic version. Please do not change it again without discussing your changes here first.

It is important to note that this Mongolia.web article already cites some unfounded speculations that were in this article for a short time. Incidents like this cause massive harm to the reputation of Wikipedia. With all respect and best wishes to Elbegdorj, plase respect the policies and guidelines of this project, and don't abuse it for your personal and political interests. The relevant policies and guidelines here are (among others): WP:NOT, WP:VERIFY, WP:LINKS, and WP:BLP. --Latebird 10:18, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

I think the accident is now far enough in the past to move it from the intro section further down. If anyone thinks otherwise, just let me know. Yaan (talk) 00:04, 14 January 2008 (UTC)