Talk:Tritone substitution

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The last sentence claims "Tritone substitutions are a defining part of Coltrane changes", but I don't understand why they're related. Coltrane changes involve moving the key center by major thirds; they don't have tritone substitutions built in. You can apply tritone substitutions to Coltrane changes, but that's not any different from applying them to any ii-V-I progression.--Rictus 7 July 2005 08:03 (UTC)

[edit] Coltrane changes???

I agree completely with Rictus, "Tritone substitutions are a defining part of Coltrane changes" is untrue. You could put a tritone substitution into Coltrane changes, but it is is in no way a "defining part". This is a common misconception about Coltrane changes. I defy anyone to find me a tritone sub in the definative changes of Giant Steps or Countdown.

[edit] Article mergers

Tritone substitute, tritone substitution and substitute dominant all seem to describe the same thing, but using different words and illustrations. Someone musically competent should take whatever's valuable and make one article out of it. --Alvestrand 16:57, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

I took a shot at it. -- ForteTuba 00:10, 16 March 2006 (UTC)

There is a statement that Classical musicians would notate the TriToneSub as a German6th chord. I would like opinions of other Classical theorists concerning this. First of all, it rarely occurs in Classical music, except in a Jazz context. It is not used the same way or voiced the same way in Classical and Jazz. i.e. the TriToneSub is notated differently and usually resolved differently. I would think that Classical notation would be more like a V7/bv (a Dominant of the bV) as in Jazz notation, the root is considered to be the b6 of the scale and not the #4 of the scale as in the German6th notation. The notation of the German6th implies specific voice leading and generally a different resolution than in Jazz. Jazz does not usually use the Cadential 6/4 chord as it the more common resolution of the Ger6 chord. In order to show the function of the chord as used in the Jazz context in a Classical analysis, the V7/bV (or what ever /x would be relevant in a particular example) certainly is more accurate of a description of what it is and also distinguishes it from the Gr6 as well it should. In the rare case that you would see a chord spelled #4 b6 1 b3 in a Jazz context, it would of course be prober to call it a Gr6 but I have never seen such an occurrence. LetsJustSeeClearly. (talk) 19:27, 25 March 2008 (UTC)