Talk:Trey Anastasio

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1 Addition of compositions and guitar technique
2 Great job cleaning up!
3 Trey's Devil Worship
4 Song credits counts
5 The Barn as a separate page?
6 Trey Anastasio considered one of the most accomplished composers?
7 Cleanup Operation
8 Splitting Hairs
9 Bolding Treys side projects
10 Drug Addictions
11 Trey's Middle Name
12 Date of Birth
13 Origin
14 Hand/Heart/UVM
15 Fair use rationale for Image:Bar 17.jpg
16 Fair use rationale for Image:Seisdemayo.jpg
17 Fair use rationale for Image:PHAM18DVD.jpg
18 Fair use rationale for Image:Plasmaalbum.jpg
19 Description of "The Horseshoe Curve"

[edit] Addition of compositions and guitar technique

I will soon information about Anastasio's compositions and guitar technique. Sources include The Phish Companion, 2nd ed. and my own research into the topic. Feel free to edit or expand as appropriate.

I will also expand to include basic information about his projects outside of Phish, and will move the existing information about his guitar rig to the guitar section.

Curtlindsay 20:07, 2 October 2005 (UTC) curtlindsay@comcast.net

COMMENT ON THE SECTION ENTITLED "TREY ANASTASIO THE GUITARIST"

I'd like to comment on the completely unnecessary nature of listing out in detail every possible chord, technique, or composing device that Trey Anastasio has ever employed. EVERY guitarist "uses barre chords extensively." Billy Joe Armstrong uses them for Christ's sake. It's not impressive, and for the record, nobody uses the locrian mode. It's a theoretical mode built on a diminished chord and it sounds like crap in practice. We're all aware that he knows his theory and is an accomplished guitarist, and rattling off all of these unnecessary details on his Wikipedia page only provides fodder for Phish fans who know nothing about playing guitar to use in an argument against Trey detractors. "Trey is considered a versatile guitarist" will do just fine.

[edit] Great job cleaning up!

I just wanted to say that whoever came in and reorganized this article, particularly the intro, life, and discography sections, did a fantastic job in my opinion. That's a better picture, for sure. After I'd added a lot of information to the basic "stub" about Anastasio's projects and had outlined a musical analysis of his guitar playing and his composition, someone then came in and, in my opinion, really muddled up the intro (not that it was that great as I left it), and I just wanted to say great job to whoever came in and fine-tuned it. I'd say this article is just about ready to rock for the time being. Why didn't you take credit for your work in discussion? That's cool, just saying you should be proud. Great work.

I went back through after a review and fixed a few grammatical and spelling errors that appear to have popped up during the cleanup. We need to be careful about that, this is an encyclopedia, after all. Also, I put the reference between the Languedoc guitars and the Starcaster back in. It's important for guitar enthusiasts, because the Starcaster and Trey's guitars are some of the only hollowbody models in existence with six-inline tuners, which is pretty darn distinctive (and helps them hold tune better than most three-on-a-side models). CurtLindsay 04:03, 23 October 2005 (UTC) curtlindsay@comcast.net

[edit] Trey's Devil Worship

I want the content about Trey's signing of "El Diablo" or the "Devil's Horns" at the August 9, 2004 Phish concert in Hampton, Virginia, put back on the main thread. While he has the right to worship the devil, he needs to be exposed at the same time for the devil-worshipper he is. If anyone has seem him give the Devil's Horns at other concerts, please chime in. It will just add to the exposure. - unsigned by a nut

Feel free to add such garbage when you find a credible source. Until that time said garbage will come off the page asap. BabuBhatt 16:58, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Song credits counts

Why were these removed?? Interesting info, factual not POV, sourced to TPC2, relevant and well-placed? Removal was unsigned and without explanation; I'm reversing it. Airumel 23:42, 12 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] The Barn as a separate page?

I think there is enough information to make The Barn its own subject. A number of notable acts outside of the Phish family have utilized it.

User_talk:Milchama 18:14 2 February 2006

[edit] Trey Anastasio considered one of the most accomplished composers?

I dispute the veracity of the following statement:

"Among music critics and historians, Anastasio is considered to be one of the most accomplished guitarists and composers alive today, rated as number 73 on Rolling Stone's List of the 100 Greatest Guitarists of All Time."

The idea that a sizable minority--much less a plurality, as the author implies--of critics and historians consider Trey Anastasio to be "one of the most accomplished...composers alive today" is simply false. I dare say that he would not even be mentioned by the vast majority of serious critics, let alone a historian of any pedigree. Boulez, Ligeti, Stockhausen, Carter, Herbie Hancock, Chick Corea--even Paul McCartney, James Taylor, or Neil Young, depending on one's slant--could perhaps lay claim to that attribution. But Trey Anastasio?

(While it is another issue entirely, I'd like to raise the point that composition connotes writing in notation. Songwriter would therefore perhaps convey Anastasio's primary role more accurately.)

Further, Rolling Stone is not a reputable musicological journal; it's a popular magazine. That fact notwithstanding, Anastasio did not even make the top 50, so the claim that he's "one of the most accomplished guitarists" is an exaggeration.

To be clear, I'm not saying that Anastasio is a poor musician. He is obviously both technically skilled and inventive. But he is, biased observations aside, neither one of the most accomplished living composers, nor one of the most accomplished living guitarists.

Sorry if I offended anyone. I'm just trying to make sure that this encyclopedia remains an unbiased source of information. This is an encyclopedia, not a magazine article. Accordingly, I went ahead and changed the tone of the line in question, along with several others throughout the article, to something more neutral.

Thanks, Psfitzgibbon 02:06, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

I'm fine w/ you removing hyperbole from this page, I'll even agree w/ you that Trey is probably not 'considered one of the most accomplished...composers alive today." But you're assertation that he is more a 'songwriter' than a composer is false. Also, he is an accomplished guitar player and it should be noted.

Trey DOES write music in notation (Don't know why you've implied that he doesn't. To quote you: 'I'd like to raise the point that composition connotes writing in notation") Trey studied composition and knows music theory, can read/write music, plays several instruments, and has conducted an orchestra before (right after Phish broke up he composed an orchestral version of the Phish song "Guyute" and conducted the Vermont Youth Orchestra in their debut performance of the piece).

if you listen to Trey's atonal fugues like You Enjoy Myself or Divided Sky, I think you'll see that while written for a rock band, these are more 'pieces of music' (that leave room for inprovisation) than 'songs.' Trey wrote all the parts for those compositions. Additionally, In his ten-piece band, Trey wrote all of the horn charts for the five-piece horn section. Trey might not be 'considered' one of the most accomplished composers of his time,' but I don't think Zappa was considered to be an accomplished composer in his time by the music press, even though, in my opinion, Zappa was accomplished, even if he didn't get his due by the music press.

As for Trey's guitar playing-he IS an accomplished guitar player. Don't let the jam-band label or the noodling inherent to Phish's music fool you, the man has dedicated himself to his instrument and it shows. You point out that Trey didn't make the top 50 of the Rolling Stone list. Well, niether did Eddie Van Halen (#70), and he is definitely considered an accomplished guitarist. Meanwhile, Jack White (#17), Kurt Cobain (#12), and John Giuliano (#1) made the top 50. White and Cobain maybe innovative and influential, but they are not better guitar players than Trey and EVH, I don't care who you ask. And I haven't even heard of John Giuliano. (it's not a question of who's more interesting, or influential, or original, when you're talking about chops [technique] Trey and EVH outshine White and Cobain.) I don't hate Jack White, but I think Rolling Stone goes out of it's way to lick this guy's ass. He's really not one of the top 20 guitar players of all time.

[edit] Cleanup Operation

Alright, look: someone, or a succession of someones, came in since the last time I dropped by this article and they totally butchered it. There are grammatical, spelling, HTML, and other assorted errors that weren't there before.

When I first expanded and edited this article, my simple and humble intention was to add some technical information about Anastasio's guitar playing and his composition style and techniques. Someone then came in and did a little cleanup on the intro, which was refreshing and much needed. Then better pictures were added, which I also thought was great.

It would appear, as all too often happens across the board on Wikipedia, that another party came in behind us and decided to take out this-and-that they didn't like, and then to add this-and-that that they thought would be appropriate, without the slightest consideration for the basic standards of quality to which any encyclopedic, even pseudo-scholarly volume should adhere.

I am now going to repair this vandalism.

Also, in response to psfitzgibbon's posting above, I would like to say the following: Anastasio is no stranger to music notation in all its subtleties and complexities. While I would suggest that the scope of Anastasio's knowledge and exercise in music composition, as evidenced by his discography (with which psfitzgibbon is undoubtedly thoroughly familiar, disc-for-disc), far exceeds that of a James Taylor or Paul McCartney, I do grasp the content of the poster's basic idea--superlatives are always POV, whether backed by Rolling Stone or not. As part of my cleanup operation this evening, I am going to remove from the article the commentary in question. CurtLindsay 17:50 PST, 20 Feb 2006

[edit] Splitting Hairs

To say that Trey does not often use "finger tapping" is simpy incorrect, which should be fairly obvious to anyone who knows the sound a guitar makes when someone taps with their fingers instead of plucking with a pick. This is a majority of the reason that his playing sounds so fluid and clean- because often times multiple notes will be tapped instead of picked. Plus, with many of the complex patterns Trey uses, and the speed at which he plays them, it would be a waste of energy and sound to pick each individual note, rather than simply hammering onto the string.

What you are describing are hammer-ons and pull-offs, the person who wrote that quote was referring to one-handed and two-handed tapping, which is common to 'shred' guitar and popularized by Eddie Van Halen. Trey does not make use of those tapping techniques much in his playing, so I think it is an accurate statement to include on the page. It's true that he doesn't pick every note individually, but Hammer-ons and pull-offs are not generally referred to as 'tapping,' so because he uses those techniques does not mean he 'taps.'

[edit] Bolding Treys side projects

Should the names of treys other bands and side projects be bolded? None of there names are directed to this article, so perhaps just have them italicized? Thoughts?--Gephart 04:00, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Drug Addictions

Not to cast a negative slant on this otherwise well-written article, but I was suprised to find no mention of his alleged problems with narcotics. I know he has never been "busted", publically checked into reh-hab or made a formal statement regarding the matter, but much as an article on Keith Richards wouldn't be complete without a paragraph detailing his life-long battles with addiction, this also seems incomplete without at least a nod to the seemingly well-substantiated allegations amongst his fans about drug abuse.

What drugs does he abuse? I know he's admitted to LSD, Marijuana, and alcohol use. As for Crack Cocaine, Heroin, PCP, MDMA, Meth, Queludes, San Pedro cactus, Peyote cactus, psilocibin mushrooms, Amanita muscaria mushrooms, salvia divinorum, or Ayahuasca abuse, that remains to be substantiated. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 63.27.118.187 (talk • contribs) 19:27, 20 Oct 2006 (UTC)

"Well substantiated allegations among fans" isn't encyclopedic, as there is no original research here. Substantiated in a reputable source is encyclopedic. BabuBhatt 20:29, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps a distinction between use and abuse is needed. Use of LSD and marijuana in no way entail abuse. He said in a Rolling Stone interview that he found cocaine freebasing problematic so he stopped, which seems like a hallmark of a person who doesn't abuse drugs but merely use them. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 75.73.49.9 (talk • contribs) 21:13, 24 Oct 2006 (UTC)

I'm not exactly sure this is relevant information. Particularly if you look at how his bust in Dec. 2006 is given a very lengthy paragraph at the end of his biographical information. I think at best this warrants a sentence or two, but it seems terribly unbalanced. Frankmccloud 15:52, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Trey's Middle Name

I don't have any sources in front of me, but as a long time fan of the band I do remember seeing, on several occasions, Trey's middle name reported as "Guiseppe", as in "Ernest Guiseppe Anastasio". (I remember thinking "how did 'Trey' come out of that?". Prior to reading this Wiki page, I had never seen his middle name reported as "Joseph". I certainly don't have grounds for editing the page, based solely upon memory...however, "Guiseppe" obviously not that common a name is not the sort of name one forgets. Does anybody have definitive evidence that the reports I remember are indeed false...definitive evidence that his name is "Joseph". I feel as if it might have been reported "Guiseppe" in the PHISH BOOK (that coffee table-sized book from a few years back). Any info?

My understanding is that his given middle name is the Italian "Guiseppe", but on legal documents, he uses the Englishisation™ of it, Joseph. —bbatsell ¿? 20:29, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

The name Trey comes from the fact that he is the third Ernest. His dad being Ernest Jr. I've been told so by Erny himself.

[edit] Date of Birth

His recent mugshot shows his date of birth as Apr 13, 1966 but the article shows it as Sep 30, 1964. What's the source of the 1964 date?

This is a good point, someone should hange the date on the page, since I doubt the police got it wrong...

That mugshot is the first time that birthdate has EVER been seen. In every other instance, it has always been September 30th, 1964, and in all articles, his age quoted is consistent with a 1964 birthdate instead of a 1966 birthdate. Basically, unless Trey has been misrepresenting his age for many, many, many years, yes, the police got it wrong. —bbatsell ¿? 20:29, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Sources: [1] [2]. There are more. 0 found for April 13. —bbatsell ¿? 22:22, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Origin

The Origin on the page says Fort Worth Texas. But didnt Phish start in Vermont, and arent all members from Vermont?

You guys are Idiots. He is from Vermont, not from Fort Worth Texas. Jesus H. Christ

It is nit-picking, I guess. He was born in Fort Worth and moved to Princeton, NJ. If origin = birthplace, it should be Fort Worth. If origin = where musical ambitions started, that would be Princeton, NJ, since he was in many musical activities there. As for the Phish thing, that is about that specific band while this article is dealing exclusively with Trey. -- moe.RON ^{Let's talk | done} 05:36, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Hand/Heart/UVM

I have heard this story many times and believe it to be true, but have never seen it attributed to a reliable source. Does one exist that can be cited? Davedonohue 16:18, 18 March 2007 (UTC)

I've heard of this as well but cannot verify it. Trey seems decadent enough for it to be true but how can such a thing be verified? --Teetotaler{{subst:image source|Image:18 steps.JPG)) Betacommand ^{(talk • contribs • Bot)} 00:24, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

{{missing rationale|Image:18 steps.JPG

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Bar 17.jpg

Image:Bar 17.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in Wikipedia articles constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 23:26, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Seisdemayo.jpg

Image:Seisdemayo.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:PHAM18DVD.jpg

Image:PHAM18DVD.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Plasmaalbum.jpg

Image:Plasmaalbum.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

[edit] Description of "The Horseshoe Curve"

The entire paragraph (quoted below) describing Trey's latest album, "The Horseshoe Curve," has been copied and pasted directly from the phish.com website. If this isn't a violation of copyright, it is at least tacky. An original description of "The Horseshoe Curve" should be written instead.

The text in question:

On July 24 2007, Trey will release his new album The Horseshoe Curve via his own Rubber Jungle Records on both CD and limited pressing vinyl. Instrumental from start to finish, The Horseshoe Curve showcases Anastasio's Afro-Cuban-influenced improvisations, replete with five-part horn arrangements, tight breaks, multiple percussionists, and Anastasio's guitar work. The album is exploration of the big band funk that Anastasio has been steeped in for the larger part of the decade.

Taken from the following webpage: http://www.phish.com/news/index.php?year=2007#story370