Talk:Transportation

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Transportation is the word that means Transport in the United States, a large country in North America. It also happens to have once been used for penal transportation. The vast majority of the links here (see What links here) refer to Transport, not Penal transportation. That is why it should be redirected, it what the user expects to find.

One of the good things about encyclopaedias is that users find things they didn't expect to find. Adam 06:13, 25 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Not only that, but a reader interested in penal transportation will only enter "transportation" into the search function, and never find it. I know I wouldn't think of looking under "penal transportation", but only under "transportation" for it. I see what you mean about the links to this page, though. It would be better to go into those articles and change [[transportation]] to [[transport]], [[tranport|transportation]] and [[penal transportation|transportation]] as appropriate, jguk 07:23, 25 Feb 2005 (UTC)

That can be solved by putting a header on the article like - This article refers to transport (the movement of people and goods), for the relocation of prisoners, see penal transportation. dml 14:49, 26 Feb 2005 (UTC)

That all seems rather odd - to have the link to the "penal transportation" page on a page completely unconnected with it. I'd be awfully surprised to type in "transportation" expecting to read about the Tolpuddle Martyrs et al. and be presented with an unrelated subject.

Maybe you could help me correct the links on all the pages listed on "what links here" so that they point to "transport" or "penal transportation" as appropriate (which is what they should do anyway as that's where the main articles are). (If you do help, please start at the bottom, as I'm starting at the top and don't want to be edit conflicted out.) Then the only "problem" would be that North Americans who type "transportation" in the search box have to come through a disambiguation page to get to "transport" - which doesn't seem much of an inconvenience to me, jguk 15:33, 26 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I've completed this exercise now. All links to "transportation" now go directly through to "transport" or "penal transportation" as appropriate, jguk 00:12, 28 Feb 2005 (UTC)

so that means 'transportation' should redirect to penal transportation and those that mean transport should link 'transport' and not 'transportation'. so i am changing the reditect. hope that's ok, but as already noted above, Transportation is used specifically to refer to penal transportation. Paki.tv 05:01, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Is this a joke?

This has to be some sort of joke... I can't imagine anybody in their right mind thinking that "Transportation" should redirect to Penal transport... completely absurd.

If this continues I will request page protection. --Shadowlink1014 20:18, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

EDIT: I realize that I did not really provide any rationale for my reverting this redirect (even though I really don't see how it is needed) -- Basically, Penal transport is a TYPE of transportation; transportation is the fundemental concept of moving people or materials... redirecting to Penal transport would be like redirecting to Boron when somebody typed in Element.

Also, like it or not, MOST people who type this term are looking for the general term; as for the argument that people looking for penal transport won't find what they're looking for -- that's what the disambig. on the Transport page is for. --Shadowlink1014 02:05, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Please don't question people's mental states. We Wikiholics have enough problems with our obsessive mental states and should be sympathetic to each other's weaknesses. :)

Transportation in some settings (e.g. British & Australian history - and probably US history prior to independence) does refer to penal transport - though I gather this is not the American usage. American usage of English is not universal (if that's where you're coming from). Paki.tv has a point - transportation is not generally used to mean transport in Australia, and it's probably the same in other Commonwealth countries. This page either needs to be a dab, or a top dab needs to be placed on transport. I'll add the top dab.

I'm happy for this page to redirect to transport - but if that is disputed, I think it's be to just make it a dab page. --Chriswaterguy talk 10:46, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

I just discovered the Transportation (disambiguation) page, and realize there's more than the two meanings. I think the best option is to move the dab page from Transportation (disambiguation) to Transportation. While the majority of people who search for "transportation" probably mean "transport" (especially among American users) it's still important to cater for those seeking other meanings. --Chriswaterguy talk 11:06, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

I still think Transportation should redirect to Transportation and the transport page should be linked from transportation (diambiguation). afterall, transport is transport, while transportation is transportation - they are seperate things. all over the world people know 'transportation' as a historical phenomena. on the 'slavery' page we record the history of slavery and abolition, not contemporary examples of slavery. if in america there has been some historical revision about how the country was founded - which is after all, on transportation (eg to maryland) as well as slavery and genocide, then it is our role to undo the damage done by the continued ignorance. that way even shadowlink can go beyond the limits of his/her imagination... Paki.tv 01:31, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

Actually the Oxford says that "transportation" is merely the noun form of "transport", and that transportation when used to refer to transfer of prisoners is a type of transportation. --Shadowlink1014 11:17, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

That maybe an argument for Wiktionary but this is an encyclopaedia not a dictionary. Your argument is like making the page for Holocaust point to Holocaust (sacrifice) instead of a page on the Shoah. I will revert the change when I have time. Paki.tv 23:55, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

I think Christwaterguy is right... the best solution to this is to make this page a dab, or to use a top dab, which he has already done on the transport page. Make this page a dab if you want, but don't make it redirect automatically to the prisoner page; there are far too many people entering "transportation" for transit to do that... two-thirds of English speakers are in the United States! (which means that MOST people who search for transportation are looking for transit) --Shadowlink1014 01:08, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

OK, point taken and sorry for the delay - i've made the page a dab - hope thats ok Paki.tv 00:07, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

It's improper to redirect a term to said term followed by "(disambiguation)." If anything, we'd do the reverse (move the disambiguation page to Transportation and make Transportation (disambiguation) a redirect), but that really isn't the best course of action. Someone searching for "transportation" probably seeks the Transport article. Like it or not, this is the most common meaning, and that's the only valid criterion. This has nothing to do with what definition is the most important or historically significant, and it has everything to do with enabling readers to find the desired article with the greatest ease. The Transport article contains a prominent link to the disambiguation page, so someone seeking an article pertaining to a different meaning is pointed in the correct direction.

Incidentally, I don't know why you refer to "historical revision" and "ignorance" on the part of Americans. We simply use the term "transportation" as the noun form of the word "transport" (which we use primarily as a verb). —David Levy 10:09, 28 July 2007 (UTC)