Talk:Tort reform

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[edit] New page start

Believe it or not, the subject of tort reform goes far beyond the shores of the States, so I thought that I should start a new page in its own right. The interesting feature is how the debates have diverged, and I would welcome contributions to help write this properly. I've tried to identify the salient features of the debate, and then I've left some sections below to be filled with what different countries have actually proposed, or what the nature of contention is in those jurisdictions. It's a fascinating topic. Please bear with me to fill up the notes section - all assertions I've made are accurate, and I'll get round to showing it with references when I can. I thought it was just important to have something there rather than nothing at all. If there are any corrections, please go ahead. I'd be glad to have some knowledgeable people to work with! Wikidea 02:13, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Style

I should add, because of the nature of the subject, I think the page has necessarily to be written in a discussive form. In other words, we're dealing with arguments against and for reform, and between arguments for one kind of reform against another kind. It's important therefore to balance the script with what is said on one side against what's said on another. If parts sound like they're from any particular POV, that was not at all my intention! I'm happy for suggestions and to rewrite whatever's felt to be unbalanced. Wikidea 02:19, 25 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] The Picture

Is the picture for this article a joke? It seems pretty ridiculous, if you ask me. ~ Dancemotron (talk) 04:22, 6 March 2008 (UTC)

Well, I wouldn't say it isn't meant to be humourous, but surely there's a serious purpose. It is, after all, a page about accidents. And look, there is someone who's had an accident! Can you find a good photo instead? Wikidea 09:35, 6 March 2008 (UTC)
http://www.house.gov/jec/tort/tort/fig-3.gif seems more appropriate.~ Dancemotron (talk) 02:20, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
Not really. It only goes up to '93 (i.e. it's a decade and a half old), it's only for the US and it doesn't appear to be adjusted for inflation. Wikidea 11:19, 7 March 2008 (UTC)
Well, whatever. The current picture seems pretty stupid. It's like having a picture of a briefcase on the page for lawyers with the caption "Lawyers use these".Dancemotron (talk) 18:40, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Accurate statistics

Does anyone have access or a reference for a comparison of international medical negligence numbers? The real problem with things like this is (a) negligence can be covered up in systems which are not transparent (b) the negligence numbers depend on what the jurisdiction's view on causation is (c) central authorities undoubtedly do not want people to release the figures - those who publish figures will usually want to show a system needs reform (in either direction). Wikidea 12:07, 11 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Edits in favor of neutrality/balanced viewpoints

Superscript text

I have made some fairly extensive edits to try to balance the viewpoints on the page. I should introduce myself by saying I am an American law grad who has studied tort reform extensively, including a seminar at Magdalen College, Oxford.

The main edits are as follows:

1- I have eliminated or added counterbalancing viewpoints to offset viewpoints that essentially boil down to "juries are worse than judges".

2- I have eliminated references to a high rate of punitive damage awards in the U.S. In reality, punitive damages are awarded in fewer than 5% of verdicts in tort claims, and fewer than 2% of tort claims result in a verdict in the first place, so you can do the math. The bottom line is that, except in cases of particularly egregious conduct [i.e., intentional assault, egregious drunk driving, rape, etc.], punitive damage awards are a non-factor in settlement negotiations and are not even requested in pleadings as to do so would be frivolous. Typically punitive damage awards are a small multiple (1-3 times) the ordinary damages awarded, although there has been an increase in very large verdicts (which are nearly always reduced by teh court anyway).

3- Article said that the contingency system encourages plaintiff's lawyers to take borderline cases. Nothing could be further from the truth. A plaintiff's lawyer who is on contingency is motivated to select cases with a high likelihood of success, otherwise the attorney doesn't get paid. If the work is hourly, the attorney could care less what happens, because they will get paid either way. The person who is incentivized to pursue a crappy case is the plaintiff, who doesn't have to put any cash outlay into the lawsuit [other than the court costs, which can be substantial], but the plaintiff doesn't know the difference between a good and bad case anyway and mostly relies on the lawyer to guide them, hence, contingency encourages only solid lawsuits, not weak ones.

4- I have clarified where the discussion is really refering to UK tort law. So far there are no allegations of a compensation culture in the US, at least not in the mainstream dialogue on tort reform. We might have a similar concept, but here people refer to it as "personal responsibility". 24.219.30.152 (talk) 01:16, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

Hmmm, I'm going to have to think about some of these changes. I think you've deleted some referenced material, which should probably stay. And also, some of the things you're saying, I'm afraid you just might be wrong on (like the lovely economic theory of the contingency fee. And also American spelling!). One thing in particular that interests me is that Peter Cane's mention of the 80p for £1 of tort compensation is disputed, because we can't calculate pre-trial transaction costs. Who says that, and where? If you could give the reference, then I'd be grateful (though I don't have much time for the Law and Economics bunch, which is what it sounds like). The cost of the tort system I think is beyond dispute (hence the tort reform debate!) - think also (which isn't in there yet) about the amount of time it takes in the States to bring a case, rather than somewhere like Germany. It doesn't seem you're registered to talk to though! Wikidea 10:28, 3 May 2008 (UTC)