Talk:Top Chef (season 2)

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1 chart
- 1.1 Season 2 elimination challenges
2 December 13 Episode
3 Finale
4 Hostility toward Marcel

[edit] chart

Here is an Elimination Challenge table (A WORK IN PROGRESS) along the lines of the one in SEASON ONE. Feel free to contribute to it and, when ready, put it into the article. JimmB 19:03, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Season 2 elimination challenges

Episode Progress
Chef	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8	Comments
Sam		IN	HIGH	IN	HIGH	BYE	LOW	WIN
Elia	HIGH	IN	IN	IN	LOW	WIN	WIN
Betty	HIGH	WIN	WIN	HIGH	LOW	LOW	HIGH
Marcel	LOW	IN	IN	HIGH	IN	HIGH	IN
Ilan	WIN	IN	IN	IN	WIN	BYE	IN
Michael	IN	IN	LOW	IN	HIGH	LOW	IN
Cliff	IN		HIGH	IN	HIGH	BYE	LOW
Mia	HIGH	IN	IN	IN	LOW	BYE	HIGH	OUT	elim ep. 8
Frank	IN	IN	LOW	WIN	IN	BYE	OUT		elim ep. 7
Carlos	LOW	IN	IN		LOW	OUT			elim ep. 6
Josie	IN	IN	IN	IN	OUT				elim ep. 5
Marisa	IN	IN	IN	IN	OUT				elim ep. 5
Emily	IN	IN	OUT						elim ep. 3
Otto	LOW	OUT							elim ep. 2
Suyai	OUT								elim ep. 1

Key to above table
	Winner of the Quickfire challenge
BYE	In Episode 6, the top 5 chefs in the Quickfire did not have to compete in the Elimination challenge
WIN	Chef won that episode's Elimination Challenge.
HIGH	Chef was in the top during that episode's Elimination Challenge.
LOW	Chef was in the bottom and risked elimination in that episode's Elimination Challenge
OUT	Chef lost that week's Elimination Challenge and was out of the competition.

Green background and WIN means the chef won that episode's Elimination Challenge.
Yellow background means the chef won that episode's Quickfire Challenge.
Blue background and HIGH means the chef was in the top during that episode's Elimination Challenge.
Yellow background and HIGH means the chef won that episode's Quickfire Challenge and was in the top during that episode's Elimination Challenge.
Red background and LOW means the chef was in the bottom and risked elimination in that episode's Elimination Challenge.
Yellow background and LOW means the chef won that episode's Quickfire Challenge, but was in the bottom, and available for elimination in that that episode's Elimination Challenge.
Grey background and OUT means the chef lost that week's Elimination Challenge and was out of the competition.
Episode 4: No eliminations.

[edit] December 13 Episode

I had seen the teasers for this show with Stephen Asprinio, so I know where the reference is coming from, but having just viewed the intitial airing, I didn't see him show up at all. I'm incline to remove him from the episode capsule, but want to make sure I wasn't just missing the cameo... Editor Emeritus 04:14, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Yeah, I put it there originally based on the teasers, but I didn't see him in the aired episode either. I changed it. Wl219 10:44, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks W1219 - and thanks for cleaning up the spotty info I left on last night's episode. Editor Emeritus 22:58, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Finale

Bravo is teasing the Top Chef season finale as being on January 31, but the Wikipedia article currently has it as January 17. Where did the show order and dates come from? Also, if the show sticks with a norm of one contestant being elimated per week, there aren't enough episodes left according to the article. Does anyone know where the article info came from? There seem to be some problems here and I think we need to correct them sooner rather than later... Editor Emeritus 04:14, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

I believe the airdates and episode names were originally taken from tv.com. Wl219 10:45, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Thanks - that makes sense. Bravo is now teasing new episodes of Top Chef starting "Wednesday, January 3" so I'm going to make the edits later tonight if that doesn't strike anyone as too troublesome. Oddly enough, since there are also teasers for a January 31 finale, this doesn't do anything to answer the question about too many contestants and too few episodes. Editor Emeritus 22:57, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Hostility toward Marcel

I've moved the following passage that an anon editor wrote in the Ep.11 summary: "Cliff thereby fell victim to a scapegoating dynamic. This dynamic, initially driven primarily by Ilan's and Sam's hostility toward Marcel (with legacy effect from Betty), ripples out to drag in (and drag down) Cliff and (later) Elia, spoiling their chances against Sam, Ilan and Marcel. Neither Cliff in this episode nor Elia in the next, where she succumbs to taking on the same role of acting out group hostility against Marcel, shows any insight into how this role weakens their own performance and competitive standing as chefs. Marcel does have insight and refuses to become dependent on group approval." It reads like an essay, and may not conform to WP standards. I put it here for editors to discuss whether to keep it or not. Wl219 05:49, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Marcel has no wins

I believe that Marcel was the winner of the most current elimination challenge (in Hawaii). I believe that the fact which states that Marcel has no wins should be changed. I am not sure if it was an official win so I will not change it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.27.119.90 (talk) 09:07, 25 January 2007 (UTC).

We've seen instances where there was no declared winner, and I think the finale part 1 is such a case. I think Marcel was announced as a finalist first partly because he was standing to the far left, but I don't think that should indicate that he won over Ilan. Wl219 09:53, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

If you believe the judges in their deliberations (and yes, their credibility during the televised portions are occasionally suspect), then they quickly decided that Marcel makes it and Elia does not, before they make the tougher decision between Ilan and Sam. If that is the case, I think you can call Marcel the winner. (Although, of course, the Bravo Web site chose a dish from Ilan as the featured dish.) --Nlu (talk) 18:17, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

I think trying to infer a winner solely from the judges' on-air remarks is the wrong approach because, as you said, their credibility is suspect. There is a lot of deliberating that occurs off-air that we don't see, including consultation with the producers. I don't even know if Padma has any say in deciding at all (does Heidi have a say on Project Runway?) or if she just announces the decision (taking of course many long dramatic pauses, this is TV after all). Frankly, I'm inclined to think that Marcel and Ilan were chosen as finalists because it's emerged over the season that Ilan hates Marcel more than any other contestant, but that doesn't make 1 a winner over the other for the purposes of Ep.12. Wl219 19:47, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Marcel

On the bravotv.com thing, the live interview with Sam, it was revealed that Marcel got attacked in Vegas by someone or two women. I forget. I know that they'll post the videos there soon. It was like... a person (at one point they said person, later two women) came up and asked, "Are you Marcel from Top Chef?" and when he replied yes, said person smashed a bottle over his head. Sam apparently saw the damage, and Marcel had to get stitches - I think in the finale, we'll see the damage. Or... maybe it's healed by now if it was during the two month hiatus. I don't know. It was really confusing and I was distracted. If it's worth mentioning, and since that's right from the source, I'll rewatch. Chef Tom didn't know about it though.-Babylon pride 18:33, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

There was an article in Las Vegas Weekly that featured an interview with Marcel in which he noted that he currently has a 1" scar and described the attack as follows:

"This girl came up to me at a nightclub and asked me if I was Marcel from Top Chef. The next thing I knew, this bottle struck me, and my friends had to rush me to the hospital. I needed 30 stitches for this."

There was no information given about when the attack occurred. --Thorswitch 17:29, 31 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Order of Events in Episode 11

The show was edited to change the order of events. Cliff's attack on the sleeping Marcel occurred first. Elia and Ilan shaved their heads after this. If you watch the show, immediately after Marcel got loose from Cliff, he headed for the bedroom. In that scene, you could clearly see Elia kneeling on the ground with all her hair. Furthermore, Elia and Marcel both indicated in their chow.com interviews that the attack on Marcel occurred before Elia and Ilan shaved their heads.

Exactly when Cliff was disqualified from the show is not clear. In the final, edited version, it appears that it was first thing the next morning. But there was evidence that the producers and film crew heard about it late in the morning. There were then meetings about what to do which would indicate that the disqualification was late in the day or maybe the second morning. Tom, the judge, indicated in his blog that he wanted to disqualify Elia, Sam, and Ilan as well and Marcel would win by default, but the producers would not permit that to happen. --Eric726960 08:03, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

I was wondering why this isn't mentioned and I figured it was because the only sources for this "conspiracy theory" are blogs and other online fora (i.e., not WP:RELIABLE)—even though the evidence presented by these sources is thoroughly convincing (see here). But now I see that Bravo VP Andy Cohen has basically confirmed the story (while at the same time dismissing any implications of wrong-doing). I think the timeline manipulation should be in the main article, as it was a pretty serious controversy among fans of the show. Clconway 16:00, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

There's enough valid references that its inclusion seems justified. I'd make a separate section ("Controversy over Cliff's Disqualification" or something like that), and make sure to include how it showed on air (cite using the "cite episode" template) and what the order was. Quotes will be better than your personal interpretation of the show if possible. It would also help if you can get a good critic of the show to say that something's fishy with the order as part of the fan reaction (I'm thinking the TWOP recap as a start...) --Masem 16:06, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Article assessment

This article contais a lot of information about the show but no sources are cited and the format is inappropriate - we aim for prose as much as possible. Some of it may be overly specific for an encyclopedia. I've rated it as start class and low importance.--Opark 77 23:21, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

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