Talk:Tony Croatto
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El cantautor Tony Croatto falleció la madrugada del domingo, sólo horas después de que se celebrara un concierto en honor a su trayectoria artística. Tenía 65 años.
Croatto, de origen italiano pero radicado por casi cuatro décadas en Puerto Rico, padecía de cáncer en los pulmones y había rehusado recibir tratamiento médico tradicional.
In the text itself says his family is of Croatian origin. Please, don't go behind someone and revert, before reading the text. Kubura (talk) 14:53, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
"Surname is not enough to be identified with a nation (how many generations had passed before they entered Italy".
According to that, no Croatian Jew could be Jew, because they came to Croatia from Spain and from Germany, Poland, Hungary and Austria. Kubura (talk) 14:57, 18 January 2008 (UTC)
It's a matter of self-identification. Can you prove that he considered relevant his Croatian heritage? Imagine that only the father of his great-grandfather was Croatian. Would it make sense to say that he is of Croatian origin? 87.9.232.12 (talk) 18:28, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
[edit] Re: Croatto
You wrote:
Listen, her father is Tony Croatto.
It wasn't me who gave the info that his father is of Croatian origins.
For your information, westernmost parts of Croatia were in areas that were after 1918. given to Italy (peninsula of Istria), after the division of Austria-Hungary.
After the Mussolini's fascist became ruling party in Italy, authorities started with violent Italianisation of area. There were fascost laws, that regulated the forced Italianization. Laws, in which "funny Slavic names" (beside others) were forbidden and was ordered to "restore them in original Italian form". (e.g. "Regio decreto legge 10 Gennaio 1926, n. 17: Restituzione in forma italiana dei cognomi delle famiglie della provincia di Trento").
Many Croatian surnames were violently Italianized then. Same was with surname Hrvatin (it literally means - Croat). Here's location of that village on fallingrain.com [1].
So, I don't understand you. How do you think that she cannot be of Croatian origins? Why do you find that categorization as problem? Kubura (talk) 07:12, 21 January 2008 (UTC) My reply:
- I know who Tony Croatto was and who his daughter Mara Croatto is.
This is not about what you, nor I nor what some other person may believe. Wikipedia is about "facts" which can be verified with a reliable source. I believe that you are aware of that.
We cannot assume that the Croatto surname was of Croatian origins nor that it originated from the Hrvatin nor that it was Italianized by Mussolini's government. It is not our job in Wikipedia to assume. Unless, a verifiable source is provided and cited as required by Wikipedia policy that the Croatto surname is of Croatian origins or that Tony or his daughter Mara have themselves publicly expressed the fact that their surnames are of Croatian origins, then it will be considered a "rumor" which is unacceptable under policy.
To give you an example, we cannot pretend nor assume that because Mark Cuban's surname is "Cuban", that it is of "Cuban origin".
You ask and I state:
- So, I don't understand you. How do you think that she (Mara) cannot be of Croatian origins? Why do you find that categorization as problem?
1. I am not saying that they are not of Croatian origins. You provide a cited a verifiable reliable source where she or Tony have stated that "they" are or were of Croatian origins or that without a doubt that the Croatto surname is of Croatian origin and the issue will be solved.
2. I do not find categorization a problem. I find categorization of what is assumed without a cited verifiable source as "required" by policy a problem.
Tony the Marine (talk) 21:44, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
- Tony, as much as I respect you, you have it wrong here. "Croatto" means "from Croatia" in Italian, very much as Tedesco means "from Germany". The last name "Alemañy" means "from Germany" in Catalan. It is not an acknowledgment of ethnic origin of the person (by any chance), it is merely an identification of the origin of the last name, very much as Betances' last name can be directly traced from Betanzos in Galicia. Those are merely facts, pretty much like the fact that Luis Miguel was born in Puerto Rico, but is no more Puerto Rican than I am (BTW, Tony Croatto deserves to be called a Puerto Rican, much more so than him). Demf (talk) 12:22, 17 May 2008 (UTC)
