Talk:Tomorrow series

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[edit] Time/Date setting

The original book was published and set (i assume) in 1994 with the kids being around 15/16 and year 10/11 at school. but i just finished reading circle of flight and it is CLEARLY set in 2006/07 with ellie still not having finished high school, and still only being 17. anyways just thought id point it out. 219.90.144.242 02:17, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

It states in The Other Side of Dawn that Ellie and the other characters would go through a special education program for children whose studies were disrupted by the war. Not sure about the age thing though. --Scottie theNerd 03:14, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

well she has to be 17 because she is still a minor in the eyes of the courts thats why she has so much trouble getting authority over gavin.

Yes, and I believe it states that she is 17 in Circle of Flight (couldn't be bothered finding it but I believe it's in there somewhere). As to the original point, I agree, in Circle of Flight there are mentions of iPods and a few other things that have only been in existence in the past few years.


hi my name is vicki and i would like to be in that movie (as ellie)i love these movies i think they are sooooooo cool. i almost cried in most parts adn when they siad that ellies friends died i cried. these books mean heaps to me, good on ya john! i also want to be an actor, hehe acting school. toodles bye —Preceding unsigned comment added by 59.101.219.161 (talk) 07:31, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Category: Children's book/series?

Looking at some of the other articles in the category, the Tomorrow series doesn't seem to fit specifically into that category. The series is more geared towards young adult and younger readers, but I wouldn't exactly compare a story of war and death with, say, the Magic School Bus. --Scottie theNerd 16:36, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

There's a proposal boiling right now to rename the varied children's books categories to children's and young adult books categories, because of the difficulty in drawing that line. Right now most of the books in there are for younger children, although the category also contains the Gossip Girls, and the Song of the Lioness series (that begins when Alanna is 10, and continues until she's a serially monogamous sexually active woman). And there are certainly plenty of young adult, middle readers, and even books for younger children that are stories of war and death. Deborah-jl Talk 18:58, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

"Returning to Hell, they explore the surrounding bush further and discover another group of partisans led by Major Harvey, an officer of the Australian Army Reserve."

Incorrect, firstly it is stated that Major Harvey was formerley in the Reserves, many years ago, and secondly it never mentioned he was an Officer.

If he is a Major, he must have been an officer.
It is also established in the series that his rank while in the Army Reserves was not a Major at all. Synystar 12:54, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Logic?

If the group had a radio that could pick up broadcasts form anywhwere in the World, why did they only use it once? Logic anyone?

They did it is mention in start of book two.
If you've actually read the book, you might recall that the kids didn't realise its capability until right before it ran out of batteries. --Scottie theNerd 08:27, 13 June 2006 (UTC)
Oh thats likely. And why didnt they THROUGHT THE WHOLE BOOK(S) find/get/steal anymore? How can no one understand any language that the ememy solders are speaking? Fiona is speaks like 5 different languages? How do detailed Sex scenes enrich the minds of young readers?
First of all, if Fiona speaks five different languages, what languages would you expect those to be? Oh, the usual of course. She definitely speaks Persian, a little bit of Pashto, she's very familiar with Indonesian, she loves Mandarin, and Thai is the best language in the world to her—yeah right. It was obvious that a European country was not the aggressor in the book, and I doubt any of those languages would be the ones she spoke. Does it not appear more likely she would speak Spanish, French, or Italian? I don't think they offer all those languages out in Australian high schools and she certainly didn't take trips to those countries, learn them for the fun of it, and come back. And I don't remember anything about the sex scene being designed to enrich the minds of young readers. By the time the kid is reading that, it's too late. Stop acting like reading about sex is going to corrupt the kid because it won't. If the kid is reading it, the parents aren't previewing it, and the kid is overly into a scene that wasn't even all that erotic, something is wrong at home. Don't blame the breakdown of the Western family unit on a book for young adults. If it is for a young adult, by age 13 the kid should be mature enough to read about sex without emitting even a single chuckle. If they can't contact their school to learn about their sex education program and stop complaining. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.35.11.39 (talk)

yes i agree. i am sure they could of got batteries somewhere why didnt they just get them from some house. Unless they didnt want to know why there country had been invaded and what is happening. Who wouldnt want to know. not them!. (i think they were to busy repopulating the australian race if you hear me loud and clear)

It is mention in book one they do get batteries for the radio but reception was not good during the day and the valley itself didn't help. They also state in book two that they do get news from the radio and know of existance of other groups in the area.

I think the book also trys to teach people to hate america and portrays them as fat, evil liars that refuse to help us but in truth i am sure they would as we are one of their closet and most loyal allies in the war against terror.

its evil. evil i tells you

F 22 06:53, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

That's wonderful. However, that has nothing to do with the article. If you have nothing relevant to add to the article, then please leave the article and its talk page alone. This is not the place to throw your opinion. --Scottie theNerd 08:32, 20 June 2006 (UTC)
And how are your comments relevant to this encyclopaedia article?
They did get supplied with radios by the New Zealand SAS. What are you on about? --Scottie theNerd 17:55, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

ok, first of all, the people who are criticizing this series either a) haven't grasped the point of this series,or )b have some sort of personal vendetta against john marsden. the point of these books is to entertain people! they weren't put under the "For people who want a completely realistic guideline of what to do in this situation" section! it was put in the fiction section! who cares why the author didn't explain why they didn't get more batteries for the radios?! did it cross any of your minds that John marsden did explain that soldiers had done a vast extent of looting!? batteries for anything would've been one of the first things for them to have taken! and it was put under young adult in genre so it can be assumed that Death, gore and sex could be involved in this story! what else do you think could replace that? roasting marsh mellows and telling horror stories? i think by the ages of 15-16 that sort of stuff would be a little lame! sex would be one of the first things to throw into a book like thins, if you don't like its (so called) explicit gory details put the book down and find a wimpier book to read, one where instead of sex and killing have; intense bashing and hard core make-out scenes. and to the response of John marsden trying to make America sound evil; ....where did you come from? were you born yesterday? in almost every war America has been in it has been the same! WW1 America didn't join the war till Germany started sinking their supply vessels trying to get to Briton (America was actually considering joining alliances with Germany in the first WW cos a large population of Americas states were German. in the second world war, America refused to go to war until it was directly attacked by Japan, who was allied with Germany and Italy, so it was with Briton they would fight along side with! even with the war on terror they weren't game to do anything until they were attacked again! by (god knows who) with the world trade centers. so don't go on about how John Marsden is trying to make America look evil when what he is doing is stating what they have done in the past! and just for the record, Marsden did state the America was suppling New Zealand with the weapons and planes and boats, so its not like he was being biased or anything. you people really should think about what you are saying before you stupidly say something which you think makes you look like a very deep observer in the subject of this series. and to that other comment saying Fiona speaks 5 different languages! HELLO! there are thousands of different languages out there! she speaks 5, what are the chances she happens to know what they are saying?! marsden states (through his protagonist; Ellie) that this country must've been small cos when it came to Australia they crammed as many people as they could into such a small area, cos thats what they were used to! or it could've been opposite, it might've been a very big country with a very big populace like Russia or china, either way the chances that Fi knew what language the soldiers were speaking is very low! —Preceding unsigned comment added by For gosh sake, its a fiction book. give it a break 59.100.154.219 (talk) 04:04, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] critics

It's been a while since I've contributed anything to this article, my last additions being the "tomorrow movies" part and the "chief characters" thing. I want to draft a new section, something like "critical reaction". If anyone knows of any reviews of the series, specifically the first book, could you please post it here?

Here:

Tomorrow When the War Began (1993) By John Marsden is without question the worst piece of fiction I have ever had the unfortunate chance of reading. The storyline is nonsensical and the plot is scripted like an episode of McLeod’s Daughters. The book would be “frighteningly real” as is stated on the front cover, but the problem is, this is Earth. I may yet write to Mr. Marsden asking why he has seen fit to poison a generation of young and impressionable Australians. The events that take place in the novel are impossible for many reasons: How could a "non-specific" country invade Australia in a week? There would need to be a massive supply chain already in place, and an impossibly large number of men and recourses committed to the task. Training schedules would have to be stepped up, vehicles put in for maintenance, and someone would notice the preparation for a full-scale invasion, as things like that never go unnoticed. Secondly, for the "non-specific" country to have aircraft and aerial capabilities they would need to have a Fleet of Aircraft carriers, which are both huge, expensive, and extremely powerful, how could someone not notice something like that moving at a country? Who doesn’t have radar? Not even the Eskimos! Also in the later books, the New Zealand Air force comes to Australians aid. How? Their air force is a man with a rake! They have only Heavy-lift aircraft and small helicopters. How could these launch an offensive strike from hundreds of kilometers away? The most valid piece of evidence against this book is the existence of the ANZUS treaty, which ensures the United States Defense force comes to our aid in the event of an invasion/conflict.

Dfrg.msc 08:15, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

You sounded like you knew what you were talking about until you got to calling the U.S. Armed Forces the "U.S. Defense Forces". And what sense does it make to put the vehicles in for maintenance for an invasion? They should already be ready to go in the event that the non-specific country was attacked by an aggressor. Everything else made sense though.


I don't see how this one can fit it. It's simply a troll review. --Scottie theNerd 08:27, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] HOW DARE YOU CALL MY MOTHER A TROLL!

Yes those Trolls writimg their reviews. I will have to write to the Board of Fictious and Mythical creatures and aske them to geet their review writing trolls in order.

Owned. With a three? OWN3D!? Dfrg.msc 08:30, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

"The enemy soldiers in the Tomorrow Series is merely a plot device the author uses to explore the relationships and personalities of the characters; they are a blank and unimportant template like the aliens in Independence Day." Someone else said that, I forget who, but it sums it up perfectly. If you're going to quibble over minor details, you obviously missed the point of the books. Battle Ape 17:38, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

"Someone else said that, I forget who"

might have been richard simpson on his excellent tomorrow page. Flage 07:52, 16 June 2006 (UTC)


[edit] RNZAF

How the HELL could these:

   * Six P-3K Orions are operated in the maritime patrol mission. Five were originally delivered in 1966 as P-3Bs. Another was purchased from the RAAF in 1985, following which all were upgraded to their current standard.
   * Five SH-2G(NZ) Seasprites were purchased in 1997 for operation from the RNZN's new Anzac class frigates. Although these are navy aircraft, they are operated and maintained by the RNZAF.
   * Three Beech Kingair B200 were leased by the RNZAF in 1998, with a further two leased in 2000. These are used in the multi-engined training role.
   * Two Boeing 757-200s are operated in the fast air transport role.
   * Five C-130H Hercules are operated in the air transport role. Three were delivered in 1966, with a further two in 1969.
   * The UH-1H Iroquois is currently the most numerous operational aircraft in the RNZAF inventory, with 14 units in service.
   * 13 Pacific Aerospace CT-4E Airtrainers were leased by the RNZAF in 1998 to serve as the air force's basic flying trainer.
   * Five Bell 47 Sioux are in service as basic helicopter trainers.

Launch an offencive strike on forces on Australias mainland? Tell me How Damit!

Also ,in 2001 the Labour Government, citing a benign security environment, cancelled the purchase of 28 Block 15 F-16 Fighting Falcon fighters, and disbanded the existing A-4 Skyhawk and Aermacchi MB-339 squadrons. One of the units disbanded included the famous No. 75 Squadron, an ex New Zealand squadron unit in the Royal Air Force that transferred to the RNZAF due to that unit's meritorious service during World War II and last flew A-4 Skyhawk fighter bombers. The other disbanded squadrons were No. 2 Squadron flying A-4 Skyhawks and No. 14 Squadron flying Aermacchi MB-339CB aircraft.

HOW!!?

Dfrg.msc 08:30, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Image:Superche.jpg
V/STOL!
 i think it says somewhere in the first few books that the Kiwis are being supplied by the USA

[edit] How could we be invaded if we have JORN

The Jindalee Operational Radar Network (JORN) is an over-the-horizon radar network that can monitor air and sea movements across 37,000km2. It has an official range of 3,000 km but depending upon certain atmospheric conditions has a range up to and including the Korean peninsula. It is used in the defence of Australia and can also monitor maritime operations, wave heights and wind directions.

The system allows the Australian Defence Force to observe all air and sea activity north of Australia to distances of 3000km. This encompasses all of Java, Irian Jaya, Papua New Guinea and the Solomon Islands, and halfway across the Indian Ocean.

significant use of the JORN is the detection of boats landing on the northern shores of Australia.

How could we be invaded if we have such powerful radars that dectect it coming, such as JORN explain that!

F 22 06:47, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

Too right Mate! Another gaping inconsistency in the plot! Woo hooo! Bing bing bing! Another 10 points!

Fiction or absurdity? It's like mouldy bread to a hungry person. Are you hungry? Dfrg.msc 06:24, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

JORN.JPGHere's how--Bigkev 10:09, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

Hahaha. I lolled.--Nick??? 08:08, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] copyright infringement

i'm fairly sure the entire plot summaries section is plagiarised from 'the tomorrow series web companion'. i haven't got a link to the site right now, and i won't tag it for copyvio because it's very possible the owner of this information put it up. did whoever put it up have permission. if not can someone obtain it or else rewrite the summaries. i may or may not draft a rewrite of the summaries: otherwise they should be deleted.Flage 07:59, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

I wrote all the plot summaries from my own memory (I may not have been logged in at the time, though; can't remember.) I don't think I used the "web companion", though. In fact I'm not sure I've even heard of it. Battle Ape 12:14, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Baby, Pram, etc.

Could I suggest to all editors and people commenting on this article to keep in mind that it is fiction and, as such, the author was quite entitled to make their own decisions about what was or was not possible and what the reactions of others may or many not have been. Please be civil to other users but also refrain from posting edits unrelated to improving the article. Thankyou! --AlisonW 16:16, 20 June 2006 (UTC)


It's called artistic license, people. Get over it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.35.11.39 (talk)


It wasn't so bad before the talk page got vandalised. Flage 08:35, 1 July 2006 (UTC)


Our criticism doesn't matter anyway, as content should only be added if it's notable. No way am I adding to any criticism section that '[User's name] of Wikipedia [link to this talk page] stated that [insert alleged plot hole here] reduced his experience of the book'. By all means, include in the article what the reviewers thought, but realize that this isn't a book club - our opinions matter zilch. --Safe-Keeper 01:08, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Criticsm

I havent read any of these books but could you write a criticsm section both literary if there is any. and if there is any weight to the invasion like why they could be invaded I mean really Australia is an island you would find any ships that would be comming months ahead of time and the only logical invasion would be from Indonsia. Jamhaw 20:51, 26 June 2006 (UTC)jamhaw

Oh don't join in with the trolling too. Criticisms are based on literary style, not on content unless outrageous. A fictional invasion by a fictional (and unidentified) enemy is hardly grounds for criticism unless you really want to hate the series. It's a plot device, and as far as I'm concerned, it's a very effective plot device in order to emphasise character development. This is a story about individual survival, not global conflict. --Scottie theNerd 22:01, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Look scottie you have no idea do you. The entire plot is circled around the invasion otherwise it would be 200 pages of hard core sex, orgys and nudity with nothing else. The book is about war not them having some picnic in the bush.

I keep asking you this but you never answer. How could this invasion happen?

PS Why is there a critical reaction part on the page but is is full of nothing but good. Isnt that a bias? I suggest putting in a plot holes section or criticisms part(with WP: NPV).

KRANDOR!? F 22 09:02, 30 June 2006 (UTC)

Again, stop dragging your displeasure of the story into this Talk page. You've been blocked once before, and it would behove you to drop this issue before the administrators take more decisive action against you. If you have nothing constructive to add to the article itself, keep your opinions to yourself. Just because you can't draw a direct line to current-day politics doesn't mean it's a plothole. As for criticisms, see above: if there's a professional, documented source you have, feel free to cite it. Do not throw in your own opinion. You haven't asked me anything, and I do not intend to play along with your game. Either you edit, or your leave this page alone.
And in case you've forgotten, the Tomorrow series is about survival, not war. --Scottie theNerd 14:39, 30 June 2006 (UTC)
The critical reaction page is "full of nothing but good" because there weren't any reliable sources that could be cited. As you can see, the "critical reaction" section is clearly a work in progress, at the moment, unless someones edited it, there is only a short list of some of the awards. Awards a good because they are a documented source and they allow for a quantative assessment. A critiscism, especially one sourced to a book review on Amazon or a MySpace page, is subjective anyway and unless it's from a professional, it's pretty much original research. Especially if you wrote it. Flage 08:34, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
Why doesn't someone just block this dumbass? Battle Ape 07:09, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Because the process isn't that simple. Please refer to this page for details and more. --Scottie theNerd 09:48, 3 July 2006 (UTC)


[edit] More spoiler-free material

Any ideas?Flage 03:36, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

It's hard not to include some form of spoiler material once you've read the entire series. It's a good idea but somewhat unrealistic. The books tend to merge together in your mind ~Sushi 10:40, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Red Dawn

Shouldn't something be said about the novel's similarities with the film, Red Dawn? McDanger 09:39, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

I mentioned it in the 'see also' section i started a few months ago. i wouldn't know what to write though. Flage 09:43, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Damn right its pretty similar to Red Dawn. I thought the exact same thing when I first saw it. Comradeash (talk) 16:06, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Spoilers

There are no spoiler warnings and hardly any spoiler free info? Death.by.maggots 00:19, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Tommorowwhenwarbegan.jpg

Image:Tommorowwhenwarbegan.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 10:10, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Discussion topics

The discussion page should not be used to discuss whether the book is good or bad or if there are parts of the storyline which may not seem 'logical' or if the story is possible or likely. The fact is that the book has become an extremely popular piece of literature and is widley popular, especially in Australia. --124.180.159.96 (talk) 07:42, 22 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Article Error/Vandalism

Hi all, just thought I'd point this out. There seems to be an error in the section regarding Corrie's character description. It seems someone has edited this section and made it completely false, stating that Corrie gets shot in the leg and Kevin "thrusts his [combat knife] into all their hearts" Heres what has been edited into the article:

Corrie was thinking about the show grounds. Robyn and Corrie waited for the others. At the thought of the showgrounds, Corrie got a sick feeling in her stomach and a hard lump at the back of her throat. The more Corrie thought about her friends’ location, the more Corrie was upset. It could have been fate that we had been in Hell on the exact day of the invasion of the town. At least for a few seconds everything was dead quiet. The invaders only fired one more shot, one bullet was all they needed. The bullet hit Corrie’s leg and she hit the ground. She lyed there reviewing the time she had spent with us’, how’d she wished her family would be safe. Kevin fired another shot towards the invaders. As he sprinted into the enemy lines he drew out his combat knife from his belt. He thrusts his blade into all their hearts. Kevin butchered all of them. The others and I rushed over to aid her. Robyn held her hand to assure Corrie would be fine. We all knew that this wasn’t the case. It became harder and harder for her to breath. Each breath was more painful than the last.

It is obvious that this is NOT coherent with the storyline, as Kevin never had a "Combat Knife" at any point in the story. Could someone please fix this problem, otherwise remove the section entirely. I would do it myself, but i am not too familiar with the editing system in Wikipedia.

Also, i noticed that under the Fiona Maxwell character description it states "...knows virtually nothing about camping or living in the bush, but she always has her period on time." If this could also be fixed, much thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.234.212.81 (talk) 10:10, 24 May 2008 (UTC)