Wikipedia talk:Today's featured article/September 7, 2007

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May I suggest this image if a clip of the film won't be used? --Lenin and McCarthy | (Complain here) 14:24, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Good idea. I used this one because it has a slightly less obnoxious tag from the creator. What do you think?--Chaser - T 03:51, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

I disagree. The problem about that is that those images are unrelated to the incident. It is better to use the screenshot so readers can get the point immediately, after all, what does a simple picture of a bus convey? It's not an article about Kowloon Motor Bus, but an article about an incident caught on camera and sent to YouTube. Hence the screenshot is the most representative of the subject. Also, the photograph of the bus is not the route number on which the incident took place.--Alasdair 12:21, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

thumb|My suggested shot.

Fair use images aren't an option on the main page anymore. We haven't used them since Jimbo Wales removed one a few months ago. They clash with Wikipedia's mission to produce free content. I'm happy to discuss other free images, though.--Chaser - T 16:33, 4 September 2007 (UTC)

If we're going to use Image:DD3601.JPG, can someone please shop out the author's name and timestamp? --- RockMFR 03:00, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

I don't have photoshop, but I found another image in the commons category and uploaded that. There's no distracting image credit in the photo.--Chaser - T 03:19, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

Actually, I've taken a picture of a Route 68X today, and uploaded it to Wikipedia just now (right side). Since the incident took place on a route 68X, it's better to use that instead, since it's relevant to the incident.--Alasdair 07:42, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

I agree with Alasdair. That's an excellent photo. --Masamage ♫ 07:48, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

Done. Thanks so much for taking that photo today. It looks better to me, too.--Chaser - T 08:00, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

Ah, the wonders of a Nokia N73 camera phone. That picture is taken on the road outside where I'm currently working on my summer job. It was at lunch hour, and a bus stopped. Click! That's it.--Alasdair 08:34, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

• I put in the picture from the video. We should use the most relevant, informative, image in a case like this. Rationale:

1. Our mission to promote free content does not matter here - no free alternative to the Bus Uncle can be created. Therefore, keeping the fair use image off is not going to motivate anyone to create free content.
2. Our mission to be informative does matter. In this case, a photo of the actual subject is more informative.
3. Jimbo's opinions and actions are not royal fiat. We don't have to do something just because Jimbo once did it.

If you disagree, please discuss rather than reverting. Thanks, Johntex\^talk 17:48, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

• • As mentioned before, Jimbo Wales said not to use fair use images on the TFA page. So,m I reverted using the edit summary by Jimbo. User:Zscout370 ^{(Return Fire)} 18:52, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Jimbo also said:

...as a general rule, I think that almost any argument, on any topic, which has premises beginning with "Jimbo said..." is a pretty weak argument. Surely the merits of the proposal should be primary, not what I happen to think."[1] - Jimbo Wales

So, "Jimbo said ___" is not a good reason. I'm reverting back pending actual discussion of the issues. We should be using the more relevant image, particularly since no "free" alternative can be created. Johntex\^talk 19:08, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

This is transcluded on userpages, nonfree images are not allowed. --ST47Talk·Desk 19:42, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

There's complaints by users on IRC regarding the image swap, and there's the very serious problem of the image appearing everywhere a non free image shouldn't. If we're going to put a non free image on the front page, we need to do so slowly and sensibly so as to avoid these problems, and we need to find consensus to do so. We can probably use a template or add a hack to Mediawiki to stop non free images appearing when the main page is transcluded and features a non free image. Nick 19:52, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

• Ah, that is a good point. People should not be transcluding sections of the Main Page on their user pages due to the risk that these sections might carry fair use content. Johntex\^talk 20:04, 7 September 2007 (UTC)
• Also, those users should be encouraged to come off IRC and have a discussion here where it can be preserved and referenced for the future. Johntex\^talk 20:15, 7 September 2007 (UTC)