Talk:TNA World Heavyweight Championship/Archive 2

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Bill Banks says Angle is the first TNA Champion

Check this out: http://www.tnawrestling.com/news/fullnews2.php?all=1415 MC511 01:31, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Banks says "I would say", that's not the same as "TNA says". TNA's own website says Cage is the first champion. Banks says some BS about Angle never officially winning the belt, then why does TNA call Angle a 2 time world champion? And Cage a 3 time champion? TJ Spyke 01:45, 24 June 2007 (UTC)
Perhaps they're considering Cage's "undisputed" reign from May 13th and Angle's Dusty win as "interim" World Heavyweight title reigns and Angle's win at Slammiversary as a TNA World title win? I don't know, just a thought I had, but Banks is I believe the editor of the TNA web site, and most signs from Jeremy Borash, to Don West to Mike Tenay point to Angle being credited as the first TNA World Champion. TonyFreakinAlmeida 17:31, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Ya angle is the first...Banks said it and he said it on TNAs official website!! we need to change it to make it say Angle is the first Since he is the Director of TNA.com....then we should go by what he says.. http://www.tnawrestling.com/news/fullnews2.php?all=1415 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.139.10.196 (talk) 23:36, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Banks said in his opinion. TNA's title page, Angle's profile, and Cage's profile all show Cage as the first champion. TJ Spyke 23:36, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

EVERYONE says ANGLE but you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.139.10.196 (talk) 01:41, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Me, TNA, wrestlingtitles.com, and basically every other title history website. It looks like the only person claiming Angle is the first champ is Bill Banks. TJ Spyke 03:54, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

while there are 3 people JUST IN THIS COLUMN besides myself...we COULD take a vote...ugh please just read what i wrote on Angle's talk page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.139.7.105 (talk) 13:52, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

here... i updated the link...this PROVES that TNA was acting like the Sacrifice main event was for the NWA title. http://youtube.com/watch?v=M676jgrlLj8 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.139.7.105 (talk) 17:50, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Don West once again just said on Impact as Christian was making his entrance that he almost won the world title for the third time at Slammiversary. It seems even TNA doesn't know what the title history is. TonyFreakinAlmeida 01:08, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Once again, I have to ask: what history? TNA removed their title history, so we can't use that anymore. Besides, is the webmaster's opinion and more important that Bill Banks? The official opinion on the broadcasts is that Angle is the first champion as of Slammiversary. Mshake3 03:33, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Cage's official profile calls him a 3 time world champion and Angle's official profile calls him a 2 time world champion. They also said Angle was stripped of the title after Sacrifice, meaning he was champion (you can strip someone of a title they don't hold). Tony is right, TNA keeps sending mixed messages right now. TJ Spyke 03:35, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

We should just say angle...AGAIN The announcers said Cage is a 2 time champion..and when they reffered to the wrestlers they reffered to Angle as TNA world Champion..and rhino and cage as simply "former world champions" but the last like 10 pieces of imformation have angle listed as first. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.139.14.130 (talk) 05:04, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Except for the fact that TNA says both. Until TNA gets the situation cleared up, we should stick with what they originally said. TJ Spyke 05:15, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

true but i believe we should change it to what they are CURRENTLY saying...it seems more logical too to have angle listed as first champ, then to explain the whole story. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.139.14.130 (talk) 05:48, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Why not put in that TNA has not yet made it clear where the TNA world Title lineage starts, that at times they said cage and other times they said Angle at Slamiversary. As neither is clear both peices of information should be presented in the interest of giving all the facts.

Seems to be that EVERYONE formed their opinion based on the website's title history. The history was later removed (mere days later infact), but everyone's original opinion remained the same. But if our opinion was based on an official statement, then shouldn't we change our opinion when the official statement is changed?

And if you don't buy that, then note this: Bill Banks > Webmaster. Mshake3 14:12, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

ya we could do that...i still say we just use what Bill Banks said--71.139.1.78 19:45, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

Christian Cage = 2 time World Champion in TNA

Check this out: http://www.tnawrestling.com/roster/christiancage/index.html Christian Cage is a 2-time World Heavyweight Champion in TNA, both under the NWA. This means that now the title Christian was defending at Sacrifice was indeed the NWA World Title, despite being "stripped" by the NWA earlier that day online. TNA continued to still recognize it as an NWA reign rather than a TNA World Title reign. This would also have to mean that, Kurt won the NWA World Title that night. That reign can be disputed as unofficial. Kurt Angle is the first ever TNA World Heavyweight Champion, as of June 17, 2007 at Slammiversary. MC511 03:58, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

TNA has a history page up again: http://www.tnawrestling.com/info/history/tnaworldpreview.html They're recognizing Kurt as a former NWA World Heavyweight Champion. MC511 06:18, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
Weird how they're recognizing Kurt's 1 day reign as an NWA title reign, they should just get rid of that since they've been trying to cover it up by saying he walked out of the building with the belt thinking he had won the match, and the announcers have said that he went for and won his first World Heavyweight Championship in TNA at Slammiversary. From what I can gather, I'm betting that whoever is editing the title history keeps making a mistake and having to take it down because they're not being approved by the company. Why recognize a title win as an NWA title win when they didn't even have rights to that title? TonyFreakinAlmeida 14:59, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
They had rights to the NWA titles until midnight of May 13, 2007. NWA breached the contractual agreement, so they were in the wrong, TNA is in the right to call Angle a former NWA Champion. MC511 20:47, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
Uh-huh, your source? The NWA (who, you know, own the NWA Championship) do not consider Angle a former champion considering that they stripped Cage of the title earlier in the day. This is like Inoki trying to claim Angle is the IWGP Champion when he has no say over the IWGP Championship. I am not sure what we should do now about the title reigns, but Angle is not a former NWA Champion since TNA had no right to the title during the time of the PPV. Great, TNA continues to cause a mess for us. TJ Spyke 02:36, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

Why is the file called tnaworldpreview? Mshake3 23:06, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

Why the filename is called that, I am not sure, the link to the history isn't public on TNA's site yet, so I guess this means that it's not really official. If TNA had the rights to the NWA titles til midnight, well I don't know, but sure I guess they can consider Angle a former world champion, even if for a day. TonyFreakinAlmeida 02:26, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
It's public now: http://www.tnawrestling.com/info/history/tnaworldtitle.html MC511 02:34, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
It's also public that Christian is a 2-time World Champ in TNA, and Angle is a 2-time World Champ in TNA. Christian both under NWA, Angle with 1 under NWA, and 1 under TNA. This is the most logical way of doing it too, finally they have come to a conclusion. MC511 02:36, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
All right, cool, should Angle's "NWA" reign be recognized through this page's title history due to the NWA not recognizing it themselves? Also where do they link this page on their site? I can't find it. TonyFreakinAlmeida 02:48, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
I don't think they do link it, hence the name "testpage". TJ Spyke 02:52, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
Angle is not a former NWA Champion since TNA no longer had the rights to the belt, and the NWA does not consider him a former champion. If TNA wanted to consider him a 2 time TNA Champion, that was fine. Now though, that reign will go the way of all those unofficial NWA Title reigns (like Bobo Brazil and Carlos Colon), make a note of it but erase it from stats pages (along with Cage's "TNA" Title reign). Angle can't win a title that doesn't exist anymore (since the NWA stripped Cage and Team 3D earlier that day). TJ Spyke 02:52, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
Where does it say test page? Page was live on both the preview and tnaworldtitle link just a second ago. TonyFreakinAlmeida 03:03, 1 July 2007 (UTC)
Nevermind, I was looking at the old link. Well, maybe that is the official page and they just haven't added the links back. TJ Spyke 03:08, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

so for now are we saying angle is first champ? i mean you did say when tna changed there history so would we? so are we saying he is number 1?--71.139.9.242 05:30, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

Angle FINALLY proven as first champion.

So angle was finnaly proven as first champion i assume? Like i said earlier werent you guys using the old tna title history that was taken down as what you were basing it on? well now the new title page is up and it lists angle as first champion. officially.--Tboneangle123 07:08, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

STOP listing Cage as champion!

Cage has never been a TNA champion. TNA updated there title history.--Tboneangle123 16:36, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

That page is still hidden by the way. Mshake3 21:44, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

wierd, but its still official, because we were using the history page that was taken down before when we were saying cage was champion....now it says angle..so we will use that.--Tboneangle123 22:54, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

A hidden page is not an official opinion. Mshake3 23:56, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

Ya well, you guys were using a DELETED page as an official opinion...and this is at least still visible.--Tboneangle123 00:20, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Yeah and now someone is changing the page back to the way it was when the thought was Cage was the first champion, jeeeez, people need to read. TonyFreakinAlmeida 00:38, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
Here is some clarification. Christian Cage was NEVER the TNA World Heavyweight Champion and here's why:
Sunday, May 13, 2007 -- Team 3D successfully defended the NWA World Tag Team Titles against LAX and Scott Steiner & Tomko in their last day as champions. Christian Cage lost the NWA World Heavyweight Title to Kurt Angle, in a Three-Way bout that also involved Sting. TNA had the rights to use the NWA World Titles however they wanted until midnight of that night, so TNA made Kurt Angle the champion. NWA and TNA severed their business relationship later that evening; NWA World Heavyweight Championship is stripped and replaced with the new TNA World Heavyweight Championship. A tournament would then begin to crown a new NWA World Heavyweight Champion under the National Wrestling Alliance. Kurt Angle is recognized by TNA as a former NWA World Heavyweight Champion, but not officially by the National Wrestling Alliance because they released a pretaped segment on their website where they "stripped" Christian Cage and Team 3D of their respective NWA Titles, a video clip that was taped before the "Sacrifice" Pay-Per-View. NWA had no idea that TNA were going to do one last title change that evening, so the NWA chose to ignore the title change, and in turn everyone on the Internet is now calling Christian Cage a former TNA World Heavyweight Champion, when in fact he is not, nor is Angle a 2-time TNA World Champion. Kurt Angle is a former unofficial NWA World Heavyweight Champion, and the first ever TNA World Heavyweight Champion, as of June 17, 2007 at Slammiversary. Calling Christian the first TNA Champion is really ridiculous, because that's just made up history, and it gets really confusing because that history never happened on TV, or mentioned anywhere on TNAwrestling.com. MC511 02:07, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
It's original research to say that TNA had control of the belts until midnight, so that argument goes out the window. The NWA officially stripped Cage and Team 3D of the titles several hours before the PPV, so Angle didn't win squat that night (I could say i'm the NWA Champion, and it would be just as legit as Angle's claim). Here's what officially happened (and thus what we should do as well): NWA stripped Cage and Team 3D earlier in the afternoon (I think it was around 1PM EST), anything that happened afterwards doesn't matter since TNA no longer had any say over who were the champions (it's like if a wrestler steals a title belt and claims they are the champion, it doesn't make it true), Angle is now a 7 time world champion only (5 WWE, 1 SmackDown World Heavyweight, 1 TNA). Angle is officially the first TNA Champion now, and I don't see the mention to mention on Angle's page that he is unofficially or officially a NWA Champion (or IWGP World Champion for that matter). So to sum it up, what TNA says about Angle being a NWA Champ doesn't mean shit since they had no say over the belt after Cage was stripped of the title. TJ Spyke 03:36, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
Then why do we list the unofficial reigns of Ric Flair, Dusty Rhodes, and Carlos Colon? Kurt Angle won the NWA World Title on PPV, viewed by THOUSANDS of people. It's definitely note worthy like every other unofficial reign. MC511 22:16, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
Maybe in the NWA Championship article, which is a discussion for another time. --Aaru Bui DII 02:21, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
Although my opinion means shit, I see it as CC is the first champion, because as Spyke pointed out, the NWA stripped Cage of the NWA World Title several hours before the PPV. Therefore, Cage WAS NOT the NWA World Champion going in to the match. He was called as the NWA Champion, but the NWA has final say over who they recognize as champion. TNA can say what they want, but the NWA has final control. Angle DID NOT win the NWA World Title, hw won the TNA World Title, therefore meaning he defeated the reigning TNA World Champion, Christian "Captian Charisma" Cage. Killswitch Engage 21:03, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
Cage's final hours and Angle's entire reign may be unofficial and unrecognized but that's common and not as farfetched as a de facto champion. --Aaru Bui DII 21:50, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
I see Angle's reign as at least being listed in his championships and accomplishments page, TNA recognizes him as an NWA World Heavyweight Champion in their title history, and also his current TNA World Heavyweight Championship reign, you spin it either way, somebody editing that out, it's one title reign unaccounted for that actually happened. TNA never acknowledged the NWA titles being stripped off of their guys, Jeremy Borash also called Christian, "NWA Heavyweight Champion of the World" during introductions at Sacrifice. TonyFreakinAlmeida 22:26, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
Again with the "TNA never acknowledged" thing. That's like when TNA said Christian Cage isn't a very good tag team wrestler when he was getting stuck in tag matches against LAX and 3D and losing. That completely retconned the 9 tag team titles he won with Edge, Edge, Edge, Edge, Edge, Edge, Edge, Storm, and Jericho in WWE. (and yes, I enjoyed proving my point by writing Edge seven times) So does that mean those title reigns didn't happen? Does that mean Christian Cage's WWE history didn't happen? No. So why should it be different for the NWA/TNA World Titles. NWA officially stripped Team 3D of their World Tag Team Titles. NWA officially stripped Christian Cage of their World Heavyweight Championship. However, because TNA didn't have their own belts in yet, NWA allowed TNA to use their belts that night. And if I recall correctly, I heard "Heavyweight Champion of the World", but no NWA prefix on it, leaving it up to interpretation. And since everybody knew by then TNA was getting their own titles and breaking out of the NWA shadow, I think it's safe to say that interpretation says "TNA Heavyweight Champion of the World". So I don't care who says Kurt Angle was NWA Champion, or who says Christian wasn't TNA Champion. If you can't back it up with an argument that completely refutes mine - and don't give me any of that "officially" crap - then the way I see it, Christian was the de facto TNA Champion for under 24 hours. He lost the title by a controversial decision at Sacrifice, which in the end got it vacated - discounting Angle's win at Sacrifice regardless of NWA or TNA. At Slammiversary, Angle officially won the TNA Championship for the first time. Christian and Angle are the first TNA Champions in history. There! 63.215.27.146 01:01, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
Proof, watch that, Borash called Cage NWA Heavyweight Champion of the world during in-ring intro's. TonyFreakinAlmeida 01:24, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
Oh, and I put Christian's name before Angle's in that statement for a reason. You guys can figure it out, right? 63.215.27.146 01:04, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

Your tag team wrestler example was weak and ineffective. Not stating it was the NWA Championship during the match doesn't automatically make it the TNA Championship but just a "World Heavyweight Championship". Also, TNA received their new belts before Sacrifice. --Aaru Bui DII 01:22, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

Two things I noticed from that video.

  • 1)The mediocre responses the wrestlers got.
  • 2)The possible lawsuit, because TNA lost the rights to call Cage the NWA World Champion. The smart thing for that rather crappy ring announcer to do would have been to announce Cage as the WHC. TNA is lucky if they don't get sued for using a name they don't own. Killswitch Engage 19:08, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
Lawsuit, I'm not sure of, probably will not happen because it may have been a mistake by Borash, because if you noticed in the box with Christian's name in it as he came to the ring, it said "World Heavyweight Champion". Or who knows, maybe TNA did have rights to the NWA titles until midnight, but once again, that information which some have claimed, has no source. And if they did have rights to the title, maybe the NWA just doesn't feel it necessary to recognize a possible Angle title reign, but that's neither here nor there. TonyFreakinAlmeida 23:23, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

On-screen, the stripping of the titles was ignored and no suggestion of a TNA title was made, therefore, nothing suggests against the assumption that the happenings at Sacrifice are for the NWA title. (although recognized by TNA only) The TNA title was first mentioned the next day, thus that is when the title was created and all events after concern the TNA title. The only uncertainty is whether Angle is an NWA or TNA champion, being that his reign started as NWA champion and was replaced with the TNA title between the two shows. (in a fashion similar to a title renaming) --Aaru Bui DII 15:42, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

he should be listed as a former NWA champion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tboneangle123 (talk • contribs) 01:56, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

A little problem, he is NOT a former NWA Champion. The NWA stripped Cage of the title earlier in the day, and at that moment TNA lost any say they had over who was NWA Champion. TJ Spyke 02:05, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
TNA did say Angle is an NWA Champion and if they didn't have the right (legally or otherwise), they ignored it. --Aaru Bui DII 02:12, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

yet we should still recognize it as an unrecognized reign.--Tboneangle123 17:21, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

I strongly disagree. If TNA called Rhino a former WWE Champion, would you want us to recognize that too? Same deal, TNA no longer had the NWA Championship or any control over it since the NWA stripped Cage of the title earlier in the day and TNA lost any right to consider champions. TJ Spyke 23:10, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
Then it's down to whether it's relevant. They had the NWA belt and the win was shown on television. I suppose it's debatable. --Aaru Bui DII 23:57, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

well it is a title reign..i mean i have seen more than 1 or 2 websites that list angle as a former nwa champion--Tboneangle123 06:37, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

The only one that matters in this case is the NWA's site since it is their title and they took it back before the Sacrifice PPV even started (so it was not possible for Angle to win the title). The only unofficial sites I would consider reliable are PWI and sometimes wrestling-titles.com (neither of which consider Angle a former NWA Champion). How can Angle have won the NWA Title when TNA didn't even have the title anymore? TJ Spyke 06:45, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
I thought, by your Rhino example, you've accepted that he's an NWA Champion as stated by TNA only and that it does not deserve our recognition. That is not the case? --Aaru Bui DII 07:47, 7 July 2007 (UTC)
No, you are correct. I don't think we should recognize Angle as a former NWA Champion. TJ Spyke 20:06, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Reasons for notability:

  1. TNA had and used the NWA World Heavyweight Championship belt.
  2. The win was decided in a wrestling match that aired on television.
  3. The win was staged to be an official title change.
  4. TNA only lost control of the title earlier that day.
  5. Quite a few believe this to be official, as they are unaware of the title stripping. Therefore, it may require clarification.

The last point, I'm quite unsure about, but otherwise, that's all I can think of and it seems the advantage still goes towards it being not notable. --Aaru Bui DII 01:50, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

Exactly my point, the title change should be noted as unofficial, because that's what it was. It happened live on pay-per-view and across the Atlantic in front of 10's of thousands of people. TNA never made their viewers aware of Trobich stripping Cage and 3D of their titles, even went as far as to just have them come out with the NWA belts. Most reports even say the new TNA title belts had come in days before the PPV. It makes me wonder, if the titles were going to be stripped or if TNA already had the new ones, why didn't TNA just give their guys the new belts? There are many reasons why they may have decided to have them just wear the NWA belts out, one reason could be that TNA may have believed that those titles were their's for the rest of the day. It would seem rather odd that there would be two different deadlines, one for how much longer they control booking of the titles themselves, and then another for how long they're able to use the title belts. TonyFreakinAlmeida 14:18, 8 July 2007 (UTC)


From tna's official world title listing:

"NWA World Title is replaced by the TNA World Title; Cornette strips the NWA Title due to a controversial finish at Sacrifice, the first TNA World Heavyweight Champion is decided at Slammiversary in Nashville." Therefore, kurt angle is the first tna world champion.67.186.35.136 17:33, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

Conclusions so far (so as to avoid posts like the previous):

  • The NWA stripped Cage of the title on May 13 and therefore, he is the last official NWA Champion.
  • The occurances at Sacrifice concern the NWA title, all of which are unrecognized by the NWA. That is, the final hours of Cage's reign and Angle's reign are recognized by TNA only.
  • TNA replaced the NWA title with the TNA title when it was first used at the May 14 tapings, thus the date of creation. Angle's reign, that began at Sacrifice, started as an (unofficial) NWA reign and became a TNA reign upon the title's creation.
  • TNA (on its official title history page) considers that the Slammiversary win determined the first TNA Champion. Therefore considering Angle's entire reign, that started at Sacrifice, as an NWA title reign.

Therefore, it is unnecessary to state your support for these conclusions as they have been agreed upon. Should you wish to challenge these points, please clearly state your argument based on reliable sources. Otherwise, it is a matter of whether the unofficial reigns are notable. --Aaru Bui DII 00:03, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

All right. In the latest commercial for Victory Road during Impact, they called Angle a 7 time world champion, that being obviously his 6 from the WWE and his current in TNA. So I guess Bill Banks(TNA webmaster), and whoever the decision makers are for this miniscule information are having a conflict of interests, so that NWA reign obviously now, never happened. At all. TonyFreakinAlmeida 01:43, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Ya they said 7 time champion, but they also showed a clip of him holding the NWA belt after he won it. weird--Tboneangle123 22:13, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Kurt Angle IS the world champion

At Sacrifice, Christian Cage was stripped of the NWA title. Kurt Angle made Sting tap out. Then he was stripped of the title. Then Jim Cornette said that the "FIRST" champion will be crowned at Slammiversary. So that automatically make Kurt Angle the first tna champion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mr.kay 1 (talk • contribs) 15:14, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

We know. TonyFreakinAlmeida 23:24, 4 July 2007 (UTC)

AJ Styles recognized as TNA World Champion

In the latest “Ask TNAWrestling.com”, Bill Banks is asked a question regarding AJ Styles and him being a TNA Triple Crown winner. Bill Banks bills AJ Styles as a former “TNA World Champion” and “TNA World Tag Team Champion”. So to add more confusion to an already debatable topic, it looks like TNA Wrestling is recognizing former NWA Champions as former TNA Champions.

Q: I was wondering since AJ Styles is the only other triple crown winner, did he ever hold every single title at the same time? Brett Farrelly Guelph, Ontario, Canada


BILL BANKS: No, AJ did not hold every championship at the same time. In fact, AJ has captured the TNA World, X and Tag Team Championships on multiple occasions, making him a three-time Triple Crown winner – a record which probably won’t be broken anytime soon. AJ achieved his first triple-crown during TNA’s first year, as he become the first X Champion, captured the Tag Team Title then defeated Jeff Jarrett and Raven for the World Title in June 2003.

TNAWrestling 17:59, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Well, he can refer to it, but it doesn't mean it was the TNA world title. What he should have said was "TNA's world title", which is probably what he meant, even if it was the NWA title at the time. Remember, they're still expanding, and many casual viewers might not even know about the NWA/TNA relationship. Projectmayhem44 20:04, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Ya i think as of May 14th TNA cant say NWA on TV or there products.--71.139.28.58 04:31, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

They can say whatever they want to. Just remember, what's the benefit to TNA to still be using the NWA name? None, hence why they want to distance themselves. It's definetly not 2002 anymore. Projectmayhem44 21:26, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Can TNA use the NWA name still in reference?

The 2007 Sacrifice DVD is out and the cover has a picture of Sting,Angle and Cage all looking at the new TNA Title belt. But on the back of the DVD the NWA title match is Listed simply as for the "World heavyweight Championship". We all know that TNA considers this a NWA title match and they recognize Angle as the first TNA world champion. I think this is basicaly the same thing as to why they call AJ STYLES a former TNA World Champion even though he isnt, because i guess TNA cant even reference the NWA anymore. Kind of like if you watch the NEW WWE DVDS how they have to Change all there graphics and commentary to say WWE instead of WWF,like they cant say WWF even if it happened in the past.--71.139.28.58 04:51, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

I believe they can. Remember, WWE can't use WWF by court injunction, TNA just ended its business relationship with NWA. I personally think its because they are trying to establish themselves as a major company, and the fact that their major title wasn't their own as of just a few months ago might be a sore spot. I know I'd diminish the fact if I was in control as well. The NWA title doesn't mean what it used to, as even the ROH title is worth much more in many fan's eyes. I wouldn't be surprised if the NWA title loses world status soon. Projectmayhem44 23:17, 10 August 2007 (UTC)
NWA title will no doubt lose world status as it just won't have the exposure that it did when it was representing TNA's world title. TNA most definitely can refer to the old NWA World Heavyweight Championship, but will they? Probably not, they'll refer to Jeff Jarrett, AJ Styles, Abyss, Sting and everyone else who they crowned NWA World Champions as former World Heavyweight Champions, just like they refer to those who have held past NWA tag and heavyweight titles on their roster pages, World Tag and World Heavyweight Champions. TonyFreakinAlmeida 18:58, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

So basically they only say "World" Heavyweight Champions prior Slammiversary and "TNA" Champions starting with Angle? The actual TNA Title history starts with Angle.--71.139.0.65 21:20, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Pretty much. I think by saying "TNA champion", they're sometimes meaning "champion of TNA", regardless of what belt they held. They're right, in a way, it just doesn't stop it from being slightly annoying. It's kind of like lately WWE has only been refering to the smackdown belt as the "world championship" instead of the proper "world heavyweight championship". I guess they can all vary when they feel like it. Projectmayhem44 21:25, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

During Hard Justice on Sunday night, there were several times former NWA Champions were referred to as TNA Champions, like when Mike Tenay referred to Ron Killings as a two-time TNA World Heavyweight Champion, and Triple X as three-time TNA World Tag Team Champions. TNAWrestling 15:16, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Well at least they OFFICIALLY referr to Kurt Angle as the FIRST TNA World Champion, i think they refer to the others simply becuz they dont want to bring the NWA name up.--71.139.41.108 23:13, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

They also refer to Kurt Angle as the first "UNDISPUTED" TNA World Heavyweight Champion. I think they refer to other former champions in TNA as "TNA Champions", well because they can and it's their history. TNAWrestling 01:51, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

Merge

Is there really a need for a list page at the moment? There's only been three champions. Give it a year, and then recreate it. The [ROH World Championship]] contains a list. Same with NHL trophy pages, like the Hart Memorial Trophy, which is an FL. -- Scorpion0422 20:13, 25 August 2007 (UTC)

Actuall theres only been 1 champion.--71.139.45.175 20:26, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Sacrifice 2007 was for the "TNA" World Title

It appears that TNA Sacrifice 2007 was for the TNA World Heavyweight Title after all. Check this link out for the preview of this DVD: http://www.tnawrestling.com/news/fullnews2.php?all=1482 The cover also displays the TNA World Heavyweight Title, and the preview says, "The DVD features the event in its entirety, including the TNA World Heavyweight Championship match with Kurt Angle vs. Christian Cage vs. Sting."

Also, someone here incorrectly said that Don West at Slammiversary said that Kurt Angle was the "first ever TNA World Heavyweight Champion," he did not say that, he said he was the "first pure TNA World Heavyweight Champion," meaning this was the first TNA World Champion not sanctioned by the NWA.

With this confusion finally being resolved, it is now safe to say that Christian Cage was defending the TNA World Heavyweight Title at Sacrifice, still carrying that hardware of the NWA World Heavyweight Title. Just as Ric Flair did in 1991 when carrying the actual NWA World Heavyweight Title, but it was in fact the WCW International World Title because the NWA and WCW had split that day, just as TNA and NWA did at Sacrifice.

Also, we can gather that the 2 World Titles that TNA is counting towards Kurt Angle is the win at Sacrifice and Slammiversary. Although the Sacrifice win is not credited towards an NWA reign, despite winning the actual hardware, it is the TNA World Title, again, similar to when Rick Rude won the NWA World Title hardware in 1991, but in actuality it was the WCW International World Title.

Kurt was stripped on iMPACT! following the PPV because of the controversy surrounding his win at Sacrifice. So when he won the title back at Slammiversary, he was not the "first ever" champion, but he was the "first pure" champion, first clear cut champion. MC511 09:44, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

No, TNA chose not to use the NWA title on the DVD . But the live PPV still says for the NWA title.And TNA had the title history on its website that said Angle was the first TNA champion. End of discussion.--76.102.4.239 04:21, 27 August 2007 (UTC)