Talk:Tirana

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[edit] On mosques

On the Curiosities page linked to from the article, the form 'Et'hem Bey' is used, not 'Ethem Bey' as in the text of the article.

Is there also a mosque called Suleyman Pasha mosque? Or is it the same as Ethem Bey mosque? --Andres 15:08, 11 Aug 2003 (UTC)

The Suleyman Pasha mosque is the same as the Ethem Bey mosque. I think Ethem as opposed to Et'hem spelling is more common, which is why I changed it. If/When someone chooses the write an article they can mention both names I guess. Dori 15:29, 11 Aug 2003 (UTC)
The mosque of Suleyman Pasha was the largest of the Tirana mosques. It was badly damaged during the Battle of Tirana in 1944 and subseqently demolished. Its site is to the north-east of Etham Bey. (OJG) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.13.99.155 (talk • contribs) 16:57, 2 October 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Population

How old is the number of inhabitants? The last one I came across is from 1998 when the official number was about 420,000 but the estimated real number was 650,000. Andres 11:55, 12 Aug 2003 (UTC)

I found even the number 700 000:

http://www.colisee.org/article.php3?id_article=238

http://www.hri.org/news/balkans/ata/1999/99-02-14.ata.html

http://www.balkantrade.org/country/albania.htm

http://www.ogonspegeln.se/albania_market.html

http://www.gak.at/article/articleview/1041/1/39/

Andres 12:16, 12 Aug 2003 (UTC)

I don't know as I don't think there has been an official census or anything. Plus, I think the number is in constant flux. Many people have migrated from the North, but it is not known how many. They live in and around Tirana, and many of their "houses" are illegal, so I doubt they would want anything to do with the government (such as letting them know that they came from another city and they are now living there). Dori 13:03, 12 Aug 2003 (UTC)

I see. The problem is that any number of population requires reference at least to the year. Usually the number of people registered is meant. When it is census data or estimation then this is specially noted. As in Tirana the official number is substantially different from the real number, that estimation is important. As far as I know, the current estimation is 700 000. In fact probably the number is greater than that and rapidly increasing. On the other hand, there is bound to be some official number. Andres 14:41, 12 Aug 2003 (UTC)

OK, changing it to 700,000 estimate. If anyone complains they can change it. Dori 21:43, 12 Aug 2003 (UTC)
The largest number i've heard is about 800,000 but you never know. 700,000 sounds a reasonable estimate. Xhamlliku 03:48, 7 March 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Situated on the Ishm ?

Could anyone confirm that Tirana is really situated on the Ishm? (Should Ishm not be Ishëm or Ishmi? And is Tirana not situated on a tributary of it? Fransvannes 15:42, 20 Nov 2003 (UTC)

The river running through the city is Lana, but Ishm or one of its tributaries runs through the district (I can't find a decent enough map to verify this and it's been a while since I took my geography class in Albania -- this map (1.2MB) is a bit too detailed). It is either Ishm (indefinite) or Ishmi (definite); I believe Ishëm is a mispelling derived from the way it is pronounced. Dori 16:47, Nov 20, 2003 (UTC)

[edit] About the name!

The whole idea that Suleymon created the town after his victory at Tehran does not hold much weight, nor is it looked at with any truth in Albania today. Venetian records in the early 1400 make mentions of a town in the area called Tirana along with earlier Byzantine records who make mentions of a castle in the area.

An often-repeated explanation is that ‘Tirana’ was so named by Sulejman Pasha, the Turkish military leader at the time of Turkey’s conquest of Persia in the 17th century, after Tehran, the capital of Persia (now Iran). Such a theory would, however, seem to be contradicted by the evidence of Tirana’s name in its current form appearing in a 1418 Venetian document. The history of Tirana a fusion of Islamic and Christian influences —Preceding unsigned comment added by IskanderBey (talk • contribs) 03:00, 16 June 2005 (UTC)

Here is more on the theories of origins of the name

The three hypothesis for the origins of Tirana's name 1- “Tirana “, it is thought that comes from the word “ Theranda”, mentioned in the ancient Greek and Latin sources, that aborigines called Te Ranat, because the field was formed as a result of stiff materials that the waters from the surrounding mountains brought.

2- “Tirana“ comes from “Tirkan“. Tirkan was a castle in Dajti‘s mountainside. Even nowadays, there exist the ruins of this ancient castle that dates with the beginning of the I-century B.C. This is thought to have been the castle that the Byzantium historian Prokop (VI-century) called the Castle of Tirkan.

3- “Tirana“ comes from old Greek, “Tyros” which means dairy. It is thought that this variant remained, because in the field of Tirana, the shepherds of the nearby areas used to trade dairy products.

For the first time Tirana’s name in the nowadays form was mentioned in 1418 in a Venetian document.

For the first time the registration of lands was done under the ottoman invasion in 1431-1432. Tirana had 60 inhabited areas with near 1000 houses and 7300 inhabitants. In the XV -century as Marin Barleti mentions, there was Tirana e Madhe and Tirana e Vogël (Big and Small Tirana).

In the registrations of 1583, the area of Tirana resulted to have 110 inhabited areas, 2900 houses and 20,000 inhabitants.

Sulejman Pasha, whose background was from Mullet, established Tirana in 1614. First, he constructed a mosque, a bakery and a hamam (Turkish sauna). History of Tirana —Preceding unsigned comment added by IskanderBey (talk • contribs) 03:49, 16 June 2005 (UTC)

So should I change this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by IskanderBey (talk • contribs) 00:22, 17 June 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Cleanup

There's been a "cleanup" flag on this article since Nov 2005. I'll have a go, unless there are too many objections. Plan is: add headings commonly used elsewhere (but not slavishly); group the info already there under the headings; sub-ed and tidy; add new info where available and reliable. Note that I don't intend to start by deleting or altering current info. Why me? Why not?! I had a good visit there a couple of years ago and I have no pre-conceptions or agenda. Folks at 137 18:55, 9 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Painted buildings

I suggest the article should say something about Edi Rama's campaign to paint many buildings in bright abstract colours. This attracted quite a lot of international attention. Ben Finn 11:53, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Inside the City

I think a small part in the District section should be about "the block" as it was and still is an important and lively part of the center of Tirana.
Tourism nowadays is on the rise and numerous clubs, disco's and bars open up and close every month and you will never have a dull evening if you go out in Tirana.Eisenreich 23:07, 22 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tocleft

I reinstated this parameter as it allows a large white space next to the toc to be used. {{tocright}} is also possible. It's an opinion but I think it improves the layout when there's a long toc; but I won't start a fight over it. Folks at 137 22:00, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

I'm not going to start a fight over it either. I assumed it was standard practice to just leave it at toc, not worrying about left or right. But I don't really care.UberCryxic 23:34, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Tirana or Tiranë

In English, I've always known the city as Tirana; but after doing this edit I noticed that the form "Tiranë" is used in many articles. Is there a reason for doing so, or can I safely change all those mentions to "Tirana" ?

There are even articles on the Tiranë District and the Tiranë County, which I guess should be moved to Tirana District and Tirana County. I've proposed both moves. - Best regards, Evv 21:26, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Tiranë should be used, just like you would use Krujë, Gjirokastër, or Shkodër. - PG-Rated 06:26, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
I've seen both spellings in English language publications, so I have no problem with either (after all British and American spellings co-exist). Elsewhere, it's been argued that letters not used in English shouldn't be used in English Wiki - even in proper names. I wouldn't spend any time trying to change them, perhaps put the alternative in brackets (once). There's far more important improvements needed for the article. Folks at 137 06:37, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
I was surprised the article is called Tirana. In English, I have only ever seen "Tiranë" used; to me, "Tirana" smacks of Italian colonialism. —Angr 19:47, 19 November 2007 (UTC)
Tirana vs Tiranë - the former is the same with an indefinite article, isn't it? Check the Albanian page (Shqip) for Tirana. It's the same with Kosova vs Kosovë - the English name reamins Kosovo but Kosovans want it to be called "Kosova" (not Kosovë). If you're native Albanian, please clarify, if I am wrong. (Removed the SineBot message as it was me who forgot to sign it first.) (Added Kosovo example).--Atitarev (talk) 04:25, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Ethem Beg mosque picture

I restored this picture for the following reasons:

  1. The mosque is an historic building, of architectural and historic note.
  2. It exists.
  3. A building, in itself, cannot be an "insult" - it's neutral. A similar argument has occurred elsewhere (see Talk:Tallinn) and the result is that a picture of a building of historical, architectural, visual and tourist importance is shown. The statistic about the religous mix in Tirane is of interest and should be in the article (preferably with a citation).
  4. Removing the picture of the mosque as "insulting" is POV and a form of censorship.

BTW, the other removed picture (regarding poverty), does seem representative of circumstances in north Tirane, IMO. If circumstances have changed over the last few years, however, that is also worthy of note. Folks at 137 08:01, 21 August 2007 (UTC)