Talk:Timor Leste Defence Force

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[edit] Name

The name of the defense forces is given in English and in Tetum, but what language is "Forças de Defesa de Timor Leste"? LordAmeth (talk) 21:33, 20 January 2008 (UTC)

Portugese. Is that worth adding to the article? It's the force's common name in English-language publications (almost always abbreviated to F-FDTL). --Nick Dowling (talk) 09:12, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Move to East Timor Defence Force

Propose that this page be moved to East Timor Defence Force as this is the closest translation of Forças de Defesa de Timor Leste. I have worked in Timor Leste as a government advisor, including with FDTL, and have never heard anybody ever refer to the FDTL as Military of East Timor. Ex nihil (talk) 06:57, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

As I understand it, 'East Timor Defence Force' is considered outdated. While it was commonly used when the force was established, almost all english-language publications now use 'F-FDTL'. 'Military of East Timor' is a generic name, and I agree that it's rarely used and not a great title. I'd prefer 'Timor Leste Defence Force' as this seems to be the direct translation, but this would be inconsistent with the other Wikipedia articles on the country. Should we be bold and move this article to 'Timor Leste Defence Force'? --Nick Dowling (talk) 07:47, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

I so totally agree with you. 'Timor Leste Defence Force' is it. The only reason I did not propose that was the failure to change the country page from East Timor to Timor Leste, a decision that I feel was extremely discourteous of Wikipedia considering the government's specific request that it be referred to as Timor Leste. If you have worked there you will know that everybody uses 'Timor Leste', even the ADF but the Australian DFAT uses East Timor although the more enlightened Kiwi embassy call it TL. I suggest we leave it for 48 hours to see if anyone has any strong feelings and then change it to ' Timor Leste Defence Force' with diverts from F-FDTL and FDTL. Ex nihil (talk) 08:41, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

I agree with that approach. In the interests of consensus editing, I've posted a note at Talk:East Timor (in lieu of a Wikiproject on the country) to seek other editors' views. --Nick Dowling (talk) 09:54, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

I can understand the argument to list the defence force by it's official name, but this certainly shouldn't be taken as a precedent to change everything else to "Timor Leste" when it is not the name the country is most well recognised by (as required by WP:NAME).--Merbabu (talk) 10:24, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

I agree: that would be an abuse of process. All we're suggesting here is that the article be moved to the military's more common English name, which is clearly 'Timor Leste Defence Force' (as F-FDTL is an unsuitable article title). As there's no consensus on the name of the country, I've thought it proper to consult on the move before making it. 'Military of East Timor' will, of course, redirect to 'Timor Leste Defence Force' and I'll create East Timor Defence Force as a redirect as well. --Nick Dowling (talk) 10:29, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

Agree with some move along these lines; Timor Leste Defence Force is just fine. Just be aware though of the undercurrents in the country between the 'national language', Tetum, and the 'official language', Portugese. There were some references to 'Timor Lorosae Defence Force' or some such, in the early years after 1999. However right now Timor Leste Defence Force is just fine. Buckshot06 (talk) 23:03, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

As no-one has raised any objections, I've just made the move. --Nick Dowling (talk) 07:51, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Good move, well done Ex nihil (talk) 12:07, 9 March 2008 (UTC)