Talk:Three Stooges

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 Three Stooges was a good article nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There are suggestions below for improving the article. Once these are addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Reviewed version: January 8, 2008
Three Stooges was a good article nominee, but did not meet the good article criteria at the time. There are suggestions below for improving the article. Once these are addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake.

Reviewed version: September 6, 2007
This article is within the scope of the following WikiProjects:
Peer review Three Stooges has had a peer review by Wikipedia editors which is now archived. It may contain ideas you can use to improve this article.

I know there are gaps in the first version of the article, but I'm not even a particularly avid fan of the Stooges. I don't want to spoil the fun that a real fan will have filling in all the other blanks. (I only wrote what was most interesting to me. :-) <>< Tim Chambers

I enjoyed the article as written. The Stooges were at their best, I think, when Curly Howard was part of the team. He was a gifted comic. --Maryevelyn 03:21, 27 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Contents

[edit] Other Main Characters

Though I don't know there names other actors who figured promenently in the shorts should be mentioned, like the woman who sang in "Microphonies" and the man who usually plays the cop subject to abuse. Both appear in a lot of shorts and they should be given credit. I don't know the names of the woman or man.


[edit] Shemp bias?

A recent edit claims that it is POV to talk about the "him primarily as if they were Moe, Larry, Curly. Everything I've read about the team gives me the impression that they really were the "canonical" Stooges, and the most popular. I certainly feel that way.

I removed an earlier Joe Besser bias, simply replacing the reason he left with the version told by Moe in his autobiography and Joe in his, and did not have to consider the issue of his success.--192.35.35.34 18:23, 25 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Vee-vee-vee? Bee-bee-bee?

How about "Heep-heep-heep" for the frightened Shemp? This is how it is rendered in "Two Reelers" (See Tributes section). --Theodore Kloba June 29, 2005 14:12 (UTC)

I always thought that fidgety, repetive expression of Shemp's sounded like "mee-mee-mee-mee". In any case, Shemp was OK, but he wasn't Curly. Not even close, other than being his brother. Wahkeenah 29 June 2005 18:47 (UTC)

[edit] Oblique reference in computer game

Hack (precursor to NetHack) used to have three humans, named Moe, Larry and Curly, busy slapping each other around until the player angers them. AQt which pint player risks being blinded for a while by getting poked by them. --131.207.161.152 13:11, 9 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Catchphrases

Although I meant what I said when I wrote that the Stooges are among the most quotable of comedy teams (maybe only the Marx Brothers are quoted more), I think the catchphrase list is rather long. It seems to have become essential a collection of quotes, which is not what the section is supposed to be. I'll let more qualified Stooge-o-philes handle this, but I think the list needs to be culled, perhaps by as much as a third. 23skidoo 17:13, 10 December 2005 (UTC)

I'll take a swing at it, someone check up on me though and correct it if you think I cleared something I oughtn't'ta. For a first step I think I'll just separate it into a separate Quotes section for comment, then if no one objects after a week or so we can just remove that section to wikiquotes or something. Phil 21:44, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

Has anyone compiled a list of insults to which Curly answered, "Why, thank you!"?

  • I think Curly's scared shouting would be better written down as woo-woo-woo, not whoop-whoop-whoop. Just a thought. Fleagle11 20:11, 18 November 200
  • Woo-woo-woo is probably correct as you can see in "You Nazty Spy!" in Curly's notebook "woo-woo-woo".

[edit] Trivia

That trivia regarding The Simpsons is incorrect, the two regulars they are referring to are named Larry and Sam(not Larry and Curly). TJ Spyke 22:03, 25 April 2006 (ET)

I don't agree that trivia sections don't have a place in these articles. While some of it can be merged into other sections, there is trivia that belongs in a trivia section and deserves to be saved.

[edit] Catchphrases

What happened to a long list of phrases we made for all the Stooges? Why not make a seperate page with that long list we did? King Shadeed 22:37, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Deleting articles on Stooge shorts

Just thought people who frequent this article would like to know a precedent is being set at Cash and Carry (1937) for nominating articles on Stooge shorts for deletion, rather than attempting to improve on or add content to them. --Rizzleboffin 05:52, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Where is it said that the article is up for deletion? I don't see any AFD or PROD marker. 23skidoo 12:17, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
After working on the article last night, I followed these instructions-- You may remove this message if you improve the article, or if you otherwise object to deletion of the article for any reason. I also took out the unencyclopedic, unsourced, and merged tags because I felt I had addressed all those issues as well. I don't have much experience in the deletion process, so I hope I was acting according to proper protocol.
What I don't understand is why an editor would say, "This article needs work-- delete it!" rather than, "This article needs work, I will do that work!" (or, at the very least, "This article needs work, could someone else please do that work?") --Rizzleboffin 14:45, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "Three Wise Fellows" in Cerebus

The independent comic book Cerebus contains an homage to the Three Stooges as main supporting characters in the graphic novel "Latter Days", but I didn't know how I should include it in the article. -- 13 August 2006

Please do. It's an interesting bit of trivia. 23skidoo 03:47, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The Four Stooges

I could have sworn Curly makes another cameo on a train with a hat and beard, and makes a kind of woooooo.... sound.

That's Correct, Curly Made a cameo in "Hold That Lion". I'm not sure Of the sound. I plan on watching my stooge boxset tonight to gather some info, it mentions it in there, i will see if i can desscern if it is indeed a "woo" sound DTGardner 04:25, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Moe/Curly?

I have noticed that in certain Shemp shorts (such as Shivering Sherlocks (1948)) Moe acts in such a way that it appears that he is imitating Curly. For instance, he makes the frustrated "Mmmmmmmmm" sound listed in the catchphrases, and he smacks his face with his hands like Curly did. Has anyone else noticed this? Fleagle11 20:15, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

  • Yes, I agree that Moe does pick up certain comic ideas that Curly used. I actually think that the scene from "I'm a Monkey's Uncle (1948)" in which Moe tries to club the duck before dinner is the most reminiscent of Curly. In this scene, he uses the 'mmmmmmmmmmmmm' sound, smacks his face with his hand, just like mentioned above, and he also jumps while swinging his club in a manner very much like Curly. In addition, the whole situation is one that Curly often found himself in, battling ducks and fish and many other animals, often saying "I'll get you YET!" just like Moe does in this scene. I completely agree that Moe and the other Stooges used many of Curly's characteristics in later shorts, however Shemp really doesn't. Being an ardent Shemp fan, I think this was a smart move by the gang to avoid making Shemp 'imitate' Curly, and rather become his own character! Of course his 'Eeb eeb eeb eeb' (or however you wish to represent it) is very similar in it's usage to Curly's 'woo woo woo woo'

[edit] Joe Palma

I think the article unintentionally misrepresents Joe Palma's role, and that Palma's role should be better defined:

He was then replaced first by a stand-in (Joe Palma), then by bald-headed "sissy" comedian Joe Besser, and eventually by Joe "Curly-Joe" DeRita.

This statement implies an equality among Palma, Besser, and DeRita as members of the Three Stooges, which is inaccurate. Palma was indeed a stand-in for Shemp. That is, he was actually meant to be Shemp, as far as the audience was concerned. In that sense, he didn't "replace" Shemp in the way that Besser and DeRita did, by becoming the third Stooge. Palma wasn't the third Stooge, he was portraying the third Stooge, which was the deceased Shemp.

Archived footage of Shemp, combined with new footage of his stand-in, Joe Palma (filmed from behind or with his face hidden), were used to finish the last four films on Shemp's contract.

This statement supports the notion that Palma wasn't considered a third Stooge, or as a member equal in stature to Besser and DeRita, but was simply intended to be a double for Shemp. This statement more accurately defines Palma's role.

Palma should be removed from the "Members" list. Palma was never considered the third Stooge, never billed as the third Stooge, and only appeared in films to portray Shemp. Palma should not be considered of equal stature as Moe, Larry, Curly, Shemp, Joe Besser, and Joe DeRita. However, Palma's unusual role as a double for Shemp should be, and is, provided adequate description in the article. The statement about Palma in the introduction simply needs to be either excised or rewritten to correctly define Palma's role. MaxKimball 18:21, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

I rewrote the opening of the article accordingly. Does it address you concerns adequately? -- Davidkevin 19:53, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Women and the stooges

I'd like to add something about why women seem to hate the Stooges so much. Yet, perhaps in the younger generation, some are beginning to dissent from the prevailing dogmas and bias. A trio of very charming amateur comediennes has produced a wonderful "three Stoogettes" video on YouTube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xW6eg8jrbdg


Shall we explore this issue? Is there change in the wind? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 66.27.73.102 (talk) 20:27, 12 March 2007 (UTC).


See my contribution "Stooge Critical Theory". Perhaps women hate the Stooges because they do not feel their dignity under constant assault in authoritarian institutions in the way of men and don't see the point of reconciling themselves to this assault.

One woman, a technical writer at a Silicon Valley company at which I worked in the 1980s, in which male techs were reacting to constant down-sizing and "market" pressures by Stooge attacks and other forms of clownish behavior including "Bob and Doug MacKenzie" riffs, wondered aloud to me why the Stooges, so obviously dreck in comparision to Charlie Chaplin, were so popular, being toxic waste of the Great Depression.

Perhaps women hate the knuckleheads because the films were garbage, made under exploiting circumstances, which so overworked the actual PEOPLE behind the personae of the knuckleheads that they died of job-related illnesses without any workmen's comp.

"Liking the Stooges" isn't hip. It's pathetic.

[edit] The Tools

Y'know when Moe hits Curly on the head with a pick, that would kill you and I wanna know if they used real tools or they made fake ones. Because hitting someone on head with a pick, slicing someone on the head with a saw or hitting someone with an axe would kill you in real life but in the Three Stooges, it doesn't kill them instead they get seriously injured.

[edit] Catchphrases

Somebody needs to provide a 3rd party reliable source that notes these as catchphrases or remove them as Original Research. 24.4.253.249 16:41, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Failed GA

Quick-fail due to no sources. Alientraveller 09:04, 6 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] References

The information i provided for this article came from This DVD: http://www.amazon.com/Three-Stooges-Story/dp/B00005B1WV/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-7292640-8215212?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1189965361&sr=8-1

I could cite every specific point that was taken, but is there a way to just generally cite an article from a source, without just doing it for a specific part?

DTGardner 18:00, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Vast Improvement! Good Enough for GA?

The article has improved dramatically since my last edit to this article last month. Maybe it's time to re-nominate it for good article status... — Cinemaniac (talk) 01:07, 13 December 2007 (UTC)

Done. — Cinemaniac (talk) 05:00, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Ga review

Sorry but I'm failing this article per the Good Article criteria. If you disagree feel free to list it at WP:GAR

  • First of the fair use rationales for the images are weak, such as "used to illustrate subject"
  • Image:Stoogelogo.gif
Image:Stooge-curly.jpeg
Image:Stooge-shemp.jpeg
Image:Stooges-joe.jpeg
Image:Stooges-cj.jpeg
Image:Emilstooge.jpg
Image:Stooges3436.jpg
Image:NewSDMovies 3Stooges.JPG
These images all fail the fair use criteria because they are larger than 300x300 pixels and have no fair use rationale.
  • The article has a lot of layout problems, books should be at the bottom of the article, members should be moved above references, the Shorts section should instead be a See also section, move the lists towards the bottom of the article
  • There is white space between many sections
  • References come after punctuation, [19]. should be .[19]
  • Keep the members date/birth dates separate to their own article
  • Long-awaited DVD release - is not an encyclopedic title as it is opinion
  • full dates such as October 30, 2007 should appear October 30, 2007
  • [citation needed] tag
  • Web references need to show publisher, retrieve date etc, check Template:Cite web and here to see the result
  • Years by themselves should not be linked - 1955
  • Healy would attempt to sing or tell jokes while - "or" implies he did one or the other
  • The offer was withdrawn, and after Howard, Fine and Howard learned
  • The combinations is almost the same as members but without as much detail
  • No need for links to books in the book section
  • Music needs references

The main problems with the article are the huge images and layout. I thought i was coming to the end of the article when the books section came up but then it goes back into article mode. You need to reorganize it, keep history and TV sections together, move lists to the bottom, make the images smaller, also not sure why so much copyrighted pictures are necessary. M3tal H3ad (talk) 07:08, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Stooges-joe.jpeg

Image:Stooges-joe.jpeg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 06:26, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Navbox

I am working on a template:navbox for the Three Stooges, to tie them together better. Feel free to help out. Please note that it is based on the Moe, Shemp, Larry and Curly cast. See Template:ThreeStooges. StevePrutz (talk) 21:21, 26 May 2008 (UTC)

It is pretty much completed now. I tried not to overdo the links and keep it simple. StevePrutz (talk) 21:42, 26 May 2008 (UTC)
I just discovered Template:3stoogesfeaturefilms. Feel free to improve upon that one as well. StevePrutz (talk) 02:11, 27 May 2008 (UTC)