Talk:Theodism/Criticism Discussion

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[edit] Archival of criticism section

On 27, Jan, 2006 User:Earl Rezner added a sub-section called Criticism to the Theodism entry. [1] This is the user's only edit, as of 17:01, 10 March 2006 (UTC). [2] Numerous requests have been made for the editor to supply sources, as per WP:CITE, WP:V, WP:NOR and especially WP:NPOV at Talk:Theodism and at the editor's talk page. After giving User:Earl Rezner plenty of time to explain himself /herself or expand his /her edits, and not receiving any follow up, I have moved the original Criticism section as it was added by User:Earl Rezner, as well as the section as it exists as of 17:01, 10 March 2006 (UTC), until the burden of proof required by WP:CITE is met, or until User:Earl Rezner or other editors appear to discuss the issues involved. If you would like to comment, add to this material, or re-integrate this material back into the Theodism article properly, please discuss it at Talk:Theodism. WeniWidiWiki 17:01, 10 March 2006 (UTC)


[edit] Criticism

The following content was added to the Theodism article on 27, Jan, 2006 by User:Earl Rezner[3]

The main distinction between Ásatrú and Theodism, is that Ásatrú is primarily interested in reviving the ancient religion of the Germanics, while Theodism views the feudal social construct as integral to being able to practice the religion at all. Theodsmen often attempt to recruit new members by joining Ásatrú groups, a practice which is often viewed as a conflict of interest and destabilizing to the Ásatrú movement. For example, the leaders of the Gering Theod, the Miercinga Ríce and the Normannii Reik all currently, or have been in the past, Elders in the Troth.

Theodism has been criticized for being very cult-like and attempting to revive institutions and practices like feudalism which are seen as counter-productive or even backward in modern times. A few of the more controversial practices are:

  • Caste system: One thing held in common by all Theodsmen is the institution of arrungs or castes based on the Dumézilian tripartite system and the concept of sacral kingship.
  • Thralldom: In most instances, the only way to join a Theodish group is to offer oneself into symbolic thralldom or slavery, and swear a hold oath to a Theodsman of a higher rank. Thralls have no rights, and therefore the potential for abuse is great. Thralls are publicly ridiculed, and made to sit on the floor at gatherings amongst other debasing things. In the past, individuals who have attempted to leave Theodish groups have been refused dismissal, or to practice freedom of conscience and leave without threats or harassment. Even when leaving on good terms, they are often set wretched or outlawed which is an archaic practice of civil death and disassociation which has connotations of being a criminal.
  • Animal sacrifice: Theodish groups routinely conduct blót or ritually slaughter livestock.2
  • Dueling or holmgang: Some Theod groups advocate dueling or ordeals as a form of non-secular dispute resolution.3
  • Sexism: Certain positions in many Theod groups are gender specific. In many instances, women - and only women - are utilized to ritually serve alcohol to men during symbel. Few women hold leadership roles in Theodism.
  • Xenophobia: Most Theod groups are extremely insular, and do not see anyone outside of their group as having luck, honor or worth. Theodish groups are often antagonistic with other Theods over doctrinal differences or perceived insults, often resulting in protracted feuds.

[edit] Notes

  • Note 1: O'Halloran p.31
  • Note 2: Call An official of the Normannii Reik challenged the leader of the Miercinga Rice to a duel on 01/24/2006
  • Note 3: Knowest How to Blot The how and why of Heathen sacrifice

[edit] Criticism section as of 17:01, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

On 17:01, 10 March 2006 (UTC) this content as it exists below was pulled from the Theodism article.

Some see a conflict of interest in the overlap between prominent leaders in Theodism also holding (or having held in the past) prominent positions within Ásatrú organizations; the leaders of the Gering Theod, the Miercinga Ríce and the Normannii Reik are all currently, or have been in the past, Elders in the Troth.

Theodism has been criticized for being very cult-like[citation needed] and attempting to revive institutions and practices like feudalism which are seen as counter-productive or even backward in modern times. A few of the more controversial practices are:

  • Holism: Theodism views the pre-feudal social construct and overall mindset as integral to being able to fully practice the religion. This stands in contrast to Ásatrú, which is primarily interested solely in reviving the reigious aspects of Germanic culture.
  • Class system: One thing held in common by all Theodsmen is the institution of a social hierarchy and belief in a non-egalitarian society. This belief manifests itself through the institution of árungs, or social classes, based on the Dumézilian tripartite system[1] and the concept of sacral kingship.
  • Thralldom: In most instances, the only way to join a Theodish group is to offer oneself into symbolic thralldom or slavery, under a Theodsman of higher rank. Thralls have no rights, and as a result of this practice, some have expressed concerns that the potential for abuse is great[citation needed]. In Theodish belief, thralldom is a period of learning for the thrall, and of mutual evaluation for the thrall and the group in question. This is done in order to insulate the "luck" of the group from any mistakes the thrall might make. Some groups have overt policies and mechanisms to ensure that abuse does not occur.[2]
  • Discouraging Freedom of (Dis-)Association: In certain circumstances, individuals who have attempted to leave Theodish groups have been refused dismissal, or have been unable leave without threats or harassment[citation needed]. Even when leaving on good terms, former members are set wretched, a term which indicates that while they are not Thralls, they are not bound in a hold-oath to any Theodish Lord[3]. When leaving on poor terms, they are most often outlawed. Outlawry is an archaic practice of civil death and disassociation which historically has connotations of being a criminal.
  • Animal sacrifice: Theodish groups routinely conduct blót or ritually slaughter livestock.[4]
  • Dueling or holmgang: Some Theod groups advocate dueling or ordeals as a form of non-secular dispute resolution.[5]
  • Sexism: Certain positions in many Theod groups are gender specific. In many instances, women - and only women - are allowed to ritually serve alcohol to men during symbel. Few women hold leadership roles in Theodism.
  • Insularity: Most Theod groups are extremely insular, and do not see anyone outside of their group as having luck, honor or worth[citation needed]. Theodish groups are often antagonistic with other Theods over doctrinal differences or perceived insults, often resulting in protracted feuds.

[edit] Notes

  1. ^ Garman Lord pp. 54
  2. ^ Talk is Ceap Discusses the fact that abuse of thralls is not permitted, and defines Thralls' recourse in the event of alleged abuse
  3. ^ Word Hoard
  4. ^ Knowest How to Blot The how and why of Heathen sacrifice
  5. ^ Call An official of the Normannii Reik challenged the leader of the Miercinga Rice to a duel on 01/24/2006