Talk:The Hedonistic Imperative

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[edit] Subjectivity of suffering

"Much of the actual case for the hedonistic imperative hinges on the reader's subjective interpretation of the nature of happiness." This seems rather much like POV philosophizing to me. As for the following few sentences, I honestly can't imagine how there could be anyone with absolutely no concept of what pleasure and pain are. If such people even exist, one has to wonder why they would spend their time reading about hedonism. Anyway, I'm pulling out this paragraph. -- Schaefer 10:06, 16 Nov 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Deletion

How anyone can suggest this aricle be deleted is beyond me.

Yea, its was a misuse of the delete request. A clean-up tag is warranted, the article definitely needs work, but the person who put the delete template up doesn't really know what the delete requests are for. I think its such an obvious misuse of the tag it should be taken off the page. But I'm reluctant to do so, because votes have already been entered. Brentt 16:14, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

I would love to hear why it's a misuse of the delete request. The essay consists of sophomoric and naive ideas, peppered throughout with wishful thinking. How is this significant? These types of manifestos are worthless unless they actually produce some change in society, and this "manifesto" has not produced any significant social change. Mnemopis 16:30, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Uggh, its an idea of a well-known published philosopher. What "effect" it has on society does not have anything to do with notability. The pokemon character Crystal (Pokémon) doesn't have much effect on society, but try and argue that she shouldn't get her own article. I think The Hedonistic Imperative has had much more effect on society than Crystal's character. The Hedonistic Imperative passes the Pokemon Test with flying colors. So leave it alone. Because you disagree with the position does not mean its not noteworthy enough to have an article. It would certainly be good for philosophy majors to have at their fingertips, because this IS an influential idea in contemporary philosophy. Because you don't like contemporary philosophy doesn't make any difference--the more you talk, the more I'm beggining to feel this is an outright ABUSE of the template. You seemed to be saying that you disagree with The Hedonistic Imperative (its "naive" and "wishful thinking"?) so it shouldn't have an article. Thats definitely an abuse if thats the case. Before I thought you were just misunderstanding what the template is for, now I suspect the problem is much more serious. Brentt 22:20, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

I'm following standard Wikipedia policy. A sophomoric essay by an amateur philosopher does not meet Wikipedia standards. Mnemopis 22:35, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Well perhaps the page needs to be tagged for style but certainly not deletion 87.194.119.253 16:34, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Do us a favor, look at the David Pearce article before you go on. He is a professional philosopher with a influential published book called, incidentally, The Hedonistic Imperative. Whether the article about The Hedonistic Imperative is up to style standards (its too essay-ish) is a different issue than whether it is a noteworthy enough subject to have its own article. If it wasn't it would warrant a deletion...but you are going to have a heck of a time making a case that its not a noteworthy subject considering it is about a influential idea in contemporary utilitarian philosophy (an idea that arguably has a life of its own). So before you jump to conclusions, and over-use the delete request, look into the subject a little more. You are NOT following wikipedia standards. You are misusing a template because you assumed something that isn't true (i.e. that The Hedonistic Imperative is an original idea made up by someone on wikipdia. No it is a contemporary interpretation of utilitarian philosophy with some noteworthiness in contemporary philosophy)Brentt 22:17, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

I did look into it and maintain my position. Sorry to burst your bubble, but Pearce is not an influential or significant philosopher. The only thing unusual about him is that, for some odd reason, he owns lots of domain names, but this is hardly notable. His drug-induced ravings are hardly notable and you will find many similar ravings at deoxy.org. Mnemopis 22:48, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Well, darn you to heck for making me look stupid as all hell. ;) I just assumed it was a published book after reading the David Pearce article. But it looks more like a self-published e-book. I just assumed because it was a published book that it must have some influence. But I guess I was wrong about it being published so I suppose that sort of blows that out of the water. If arguing on the internet is like running in the special olympics, I'm not only retarded but I'm a loser too. crap. I wonder if this article was created by him. Brentt 23:15, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Merely self-publishing a book is a trivial exercise. Pearce's book has never appeared on any best-seller list, nor has it influenced any prominent philosophers, much less stimulated any deep thought. It is poorly written doggerel of an insignificant philosopher who tries to compensate by buying up lots of domain names in a lame attempt to spread his shallow thought and his vanity. Of course, he's never actually published in any peer-reviewed journals, made any significant discoveries or contributions to society, or been referenced by any notable third-party sources in an objective manner. His thought, his philosophy, is shallow and insignificant, and should have no place on Wikipedia. Mnemopis 23:36, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Well even if it was deep it wouldn't matter if he hasn't been published or referenced in a publication. Brentt 00:29, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

But the Hedonistic Imperative has been discussed in other published works, look at a Google book search on "Hedonistic Imperative" +"David Pearce" as well as a Google Scholar search on the same thing. Hypnosifl 19:21, 9 February 2007 (UTC)