Talk:The Handmaid's Tale

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Novels
Literature Portal
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Novels, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to narrative novels, novellas, novelettes and short stories on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit one of the articles mentioned below, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and contribute to the general Project discussion to talk over new ideas and suggestions.
B This article has been rated as B-Class.
Mid This article has been rated as Mid-importance on the importance scale.
This article was the Novels WikiProject Collaboration of the Month (October 8, 2007–November 1, 2007). For details on the improvements made to the article, see the history of past collaborations.
Assessment comments
Socrates
Philosophy Portal
This article is within the scope of the WikiProject Philosophy, which collaborates on articles related to philosophy. To participate, you can edit this article or visit the project page for more details.
??? This article has not yet received a rating on the quality scale.
??? This article has not yet received an importance rating on the importance scale.

Contents

[edit] Satire and Science Fiction

I'm deeply unconvincted that the book is a satire, and not sue that it is science fiction. Any EngLit people wish to comment / edit? --Tagishsimon (talk)

From my copy of Webster:

satire: 1) A literary work in which human vice or folly is attacked through irony, derision, or wit. 2) The branch of literature constituting such works. 3) Irony, sarcasm, or caustic wit used to attack or expose folly, vice, or stupidity.

Perhaps it isn't a textbook example of satire, but I think the word loosely fits. As far as it being science fiction I think a lot of that is in comparison to Atwood's other books, many of which are blatant sci-fi. I think Atwood's description of the US and Christianity in and of themselves within this book are a type of satire, whether or not they're comical in nature. --mixvio

I've only just started reading the book, but in general science fiction is a very broad genre and The Handmaid's Tale cound be said to fall within its blurry boundaries on account of being a sort of alternate history type story. It might be more appropriate to say "speculative fiction" (which encompasses science fiction, fantasy, etc.), but Margaret Atwood's name is pretty much the only thing that's keeping it out of the fantasy/science fiction section of your local bookstore. --nekoewen

I found it in the science fiction section of both my local Barns & Noble and my kitchy neighborhood bookstore. But then again I live in NYC. --mixvio
i think that speculative dystopic stories, for better or worse, tend to be lumped with sci-fi. Streamless 14:25, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
Speculative novels like this are at the very heart of science fiction ("sci-fi" is often considered a pejorative) literature, from Brave New World to 1984 to Philip Roth's The Plot Against America. The fact that they are often not treated as science fiction is a whole 'nother rant entirely. It's like putting Octavia Butler in the respectable, not-science-fiction section so you can talk about the things she discusses in her science fiction novels without getting any sci-fi cooties on you.--Orange Mike 16:11, 8 June 2006 (UTC)--129.89.253.116 16:09, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
The Handmaid's Tale won an award for best SF novel 1987 raptor 13:13, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
I'm pretty sure that Atwood herself actively rejects the term Science Fiction in describing the Handmaid's Tale, and she prefers the term Speculative Fiction, as the developments in the novel could easily occur today (i.e. they don't involve any technological innovation). However, the current description of dystopian fiction is probably the most accurate --Lord Pheasant 09:39, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
This is part of the broader topic I addressed before, the desire among "respectable" critics, academics and their allies to draw as narrow a circle as possible around the term 'science fiction' and to claim magic realism, dystopian and utopian fiction, alternative histories(a/k/a "contrafactuals") and so on as something separate from and superior to "that sci-fi crap" enjoyed by lesser beings; rather than admit that 'speculative fiction' is just a broader (and perhaps more prestigious-sounding) term for what most people know as the variegated genre of science fiction & fantasy.--Orange Mike 14:55, 26 October 2006 (UTC)
Handmaid's Tale is a dystopia, a sub-genre of utopia and as such by definition sci-fi. Even though most of us might not agree. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.201.34.137 (talk) 14:35, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] To the end of the Plot:

"In this respect The Handmaid's Tale is similar to Egalia's Daughters by Gerd Brantenberg, Dune by Frank Herbert or The Lord of the Rings by J. R. R. Tolkien."

Absolutely shit! Why respect? And waht have these books to do with this novel? There shouldn´t be build a line to the masterworks "dune" and "LOTR" just because there are appendices at the end of the book!

I think that it's not a comparison of quality per se, but rather a way to recognise the underlying optimism even in despair that forms part of the novel; after all, if we didn't mention classic texts, the reader wouldn't be able to see the comparison! --Lord Pheasant 09:39, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] unencyclopedic comment moved to talk:

=== Analysis ===
Perhaps it's ironic that after the September 11, 2001 Terrorist Attack civil liberties in the US were severely restricted without people really noticing or caring. The Handmaid's Tale also described the great restriction placed on the people by the US government, who use attacks allegedly committed by 'Islamic fanatics' as an excuse. In the book, the lax attidude of the people towards losing their liberties is what paves the way for a religious revolution; as long as changes don't effect them on the short term, they won't care about the long term.

- Montréalais 02:49 Apr 5, 2003 (UTC)

If you want to include the Analysis paragraph in this article, please find some way to do so that's NPOV. Attacking the US government doesn't do that. -- Zoe

Yes, Zoe, I believe that's why I moved the thing to Talk. - Montrealais

Yes, Montrealais, but the paragraph was moved back to the article and I reverted it. -- Zoe
I fail to see how the US government is being attacked in the paragraph, but if you disagree with the contents of the paragraph, either change it till you no longer disagree, or put in a different opionion. Just moving the paragraph around does not accomplish anything.
I await your edits, but will leave the removal as is, for now. branko
It has nothing to do with whether "the US government is being attacked" in the paragraph. That's not the point. The point is that it is an opinion unqualified by any attribution. That's not NPOV- Montréalais 15:06 22 Jun 2003 (UTC)

I agree with Montréalais: that bit about 9/11 is pointless and has no place here.

I myself wrote a w/u for Everything2 a while ago in which I made the same comparison - but that was E2, this is Wiki. The comparison that SHOULD be pointed out in this article is to the Iranian revolution and the rise of the "moral majority" under Regan, as those things actually influenced the book. -- stewacide 15:18 22 Jun 2003 (UTC)

I'm not sure about this but shouldn't the fact that it was turned into a film and an opera come before the plot details and spoiler warning? Saul Taylor

Couldn't the ending also be seen as a kind of intellectual joke by Atwood? Suddenly she wrenches the narrative away from the timeframe of the rest of the book as if to say "ha ha, I'm not going to tell you how it ends because it's my book and I don't want to. Suckers!". That's how I read it, anyway. I rather like that anticlimax, though I know a lot of people simply choose to ignore the epilogue altogether. Bonalaw 13:07, 24 Jun 2004 (UTC)

I think Atwood was pointing to the fact that all histories and narratives are mediated - by time, by your own values, by emotion, and lastly by historians who arrange your words. An An 21:41, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Novel's structure

The article really doesn't talk about the Book's extraordinary structure. At the end of the book she suggests that Offred has narrated the whole thing - stream of consciousness style - onto an assortment of Audio tapes, the intended order of which is unknown. (Perhaps actually joking that the work has been edited by the historians who found it). What we get is not of stream of consciousness at all, but a cleverly calculated structure - it begins by dropping us in to a bizaar world we can't understand, and bit by bit fleshes out detail in a clearly ordered way. The net result is that book works as a thriller.

Then we pull out to a wide historical focus in which the fate of one woman ceases to be so important - so Attwood does not tell us her heroine's fate. --Indisciplined 23:04, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] POV

Is it too POV to say the character of Serena Joy was loosely based on Tammy Faye Bakker? Other websites have at least remarked on the resemblance...and I say it's quite blatant. Mike H 06:20, Nov 17, 2004 (UTC)

-- No, I think this was clearly Atwood's intention.

[edit] Iranian revolution

It is vital that some mention of this be made. This novel was definitely Atwood's attempt to say "it could happen here, too" about the Iranian revolution.

Well, unsigned person, please note this somewhere! I think its an excellent point to draw out. An An 22:56, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Actually, Atwood herself, in an article in the New York Times, recently explained that it was her trip through Afghanistan in the 1970's that was the inspiration for the novel and its female subjugation theme. --Naidipuz 05:20, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Subjection/Subjugation

From www.m-w.com

Subjection Main Entry: 3sub·ject Pronunciation: s&b-'jekt, 's&b-"jekt Function: transitive verb 1 a : to bring under control or dominion : SUBJUGATE b : to make (as oneself) amenable to the discipline and control of a superior 2 : to make liable : PREDISPOSE 3 : to cause or force to undergo or endure (something unpleasant, inconvenient, or trying) <was subjected to constant verbal abuse> - sub·jec·tion /s&b-'jek-sh&n/ noun

Subjugation Main Entry: sub·ju·gate Pronunciation: 's&b-ji-"gAt Function: transitive verb Inflected Form(s): -gat·ed; -gat·ing Etymology: Middle English, from Latin subjugatus, past participle of subjugare, from sub- + jugum yoke -- more at YOKE 1 : to bring under control and governance as a subject : CONQUER 2 : to make submissive : SUBDUE - sub·ju·ga·tion /"s&b-ji-'gA-sh&n/ noun - sub·ju·ga·tor /'s&b-ji-"gA-t&r/ noun

They're similar words, but I thibk subjection (3) is what Offred is undergoing. She is consicous, and she is made to endure. She never internally submits to the system.An An 23:22, 9 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I was one of the people who edited Subjection to Subjugation. I now favour Subjection for the reasons listed above.Fifelfoo 01:20, 10 Mar 2005 (UTC)
That's lovely then. Did you fix it, or shall I? An An 05:25, 10 Mar 2005 (UTC)
Why Subjection? To use subjection would completely remove meaning from the subtitle - 'subjugation' is a fairly self-contained verb, but with just 'subjection', the title isn't actually saying what she's subject to. --Lord Pheasant 09:39, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Are the "Marthas" of African descent?

Someone added the statement that they were, and someone else reverted it right back out. I don't have any hard-and-fast evidence to offer one way or the other, but the statement that they *ARE* of African descent always matched my impression. Does anyone know for sure? Or is it time to read the book gain? (Obviously, the answer may turn out to be "Some, in fact, an over-represntation are, but some aren't."

Atlant 14:26, 23 Mar 2005 (UTC)

When we did analysis in our English class, we concluded that Cora and Rita, at least, were black, but other Marthas were not explicitly black. I think it wouldn't be wrong to state that there is much evidence to conclude that Cora and Rita were black women. Mike H 07:16, Mar 25, 2005 (UTC)
The "Children of Ham" (negroes) were all "resettled". This is alluded to in chapter 14 (part 4), the moments before the ceremony when the household watch TV waiting for the Commander. Its page 93 in 1995 Virago Press edition. There are no statements in the book to the effect that the Marthas are negroes, and if there are, I would like to see them reproduced here. The idea that it "fits" the marthas that they are black may be more easily attributed to points of view which equate black skin with domestic slavery (i.e. mainstream American ideology, to name but one). An An 09:05, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
It was never explicitly stated in the text that Cora and Rita were black, but their speech patterns in the novel were not on par with the other white characters. I guess that could be interpreted a number of ways (common white?) but that was the conclusion we drew. Mike H 10:55, Mar 26, 2005 (UTC)
There were also examples of other kinds of people who were believed to be completely resettled but weren't. I can think of religious minorities who were originally supposed to be sent away but chose to live under the new laws, only to be found practicing their religion in private (say, the Jews, who had the option of taking a boat back to Israel, unlike the other minorities). Mike H 10:58, Mar 26, 2005 (UTC)
On reading the first chapters, the Martha's immediatley struck me as African American women. However, I think that has to do more with my perception of the culture seen in the USA. I also read it to be in the USA, without knowing anything about the book at all. Personally, I think this is a cultural perception rather than something that is seen explicitly in the novel.00:35, 10 November 2005 (UTC)
If you're saying that your reading of it as being set in the former US is a "cultural projection", then, no, that's not the case. The story is unambiguously set in the Cambridge/Boston area and explicit references are made to many of the existing geographic/commercial features that exist today. But if you're speaking of the Marthas being A-A as a cultural projection, then you may be right. I guess I'll just have to read the book again. :-) Or we could wait and see how Bushworld actually evolves. :-(
Atlant 12:48, 10 November 2005 (UTC)
Okay, I read the book again. And right there on Page 12 (in my eddition), it makes explicit reference to the "brown arms" of the dominant Martha. So regardless of whether the "Children of Ham" were generally resettled, I think we still have pretty good evidence that Fred's two Marthas were, in fact, African Americans before the Gileadean revolution. But I agree that there's no evidence that all Marthas are (were) A-A.
Atlant 18:24, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
The "brown arms" may simply be swarthy, or suntanned; "brown" is a very ambiguously broad term in English, and indeed it may be argued that the vast majority of the human race is some shade of "brown" (broadly defined). This is a weak reed to lean on. Orange Mike 23:35, 13 September 2006 (UTC)
Perhaps the speech patterns are working class, or servile class? Speech doesn't mean skin colour, and it is not enough to say that the speech is low-class so these women are black. Cora and Rita are the only Marthas that we hear speak at all - so there can be no determination of whether their speech is typical of their caste.
As for the "resettlement" attempts - Atwood makes it clear that these may be (and probably are) falsified for propaganda purposes. Whether negroes were murdered (as the epilogue asserts that jews were) or actually resettled is not in contention. Marthas are not possitively identified as negroes by Atwood, and any assertion that they are needs to be substantiated. An An 12:11, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Rita's brown arms maybe be a result of work, exposure to the heat of the ovens or the sun. It may be a symbol of the effects of work on her body. Cora says to Rita that she could have been selected as a handmaid, given different circumstances (ch 2). If Cora were negro, this would be incompatible to a society sufficiently fixated on racial purity to 'resettle' negroes and jews. On a broader note, why is it necessary to state that "all marthas are black", when there is at best conflicting evidence to this effect? An An 11:12, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

FWIW, In the movie, they were both white. Carolynparrishfan 19:41, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] biblical refrences

hello all as an access student i am witing an essay on the campative qualities of the handmaids tale and genesis chapter 1-4 including adam and eve does anyone have any views on the subject bex

[edit] Unwomen

I was puzzled by the part of the article that mentions male unwomen. Could someone point out to me where in the book this is mentioned? I wasn't aware of it even being implied. 84.69.25.238 12:36, 19 January 2006 (UTC)

Offred mentions that anyone sent to the Colonies is an "Unwoman" and that being forced to wear long grey dresses is supposed to demoralize them. (Alphaboi867 02:33, 8 June 2006 (UTC))
Should "widows" be removed from the Unwoman category as the text does not say they are banished and Offred sees one in chapter 5? raptor 10:11, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
Yeah, I've read the book about three times and I'm not sure I ever read a reference to widows being shipped to the colonies - if I'm wrong, can someone please cite the quote for me?

When Offred is talking to Moira at Jezebel's (chapter 38) Moira recounts seeing a film about the Colonies:

"It's old women--I bet you've been wondering why you haven't seen too many of those around anymore--...I'd say it's about a quarter men in the Colonies, too."

[edit] Feminist social critique

I am quite shocked that in the section of the article that describes the social critique in the book, critique of the oppression of women in modern society isn't mentioned. This book is first and foremore a feminist book. I find that it maps out very accurately society's perceptions about women, their gender roles and acceptable (as well as unacceptable) behaviour.

Anyone up for adding this aspect to the article?

Silentium 12:58, 14 May 2006 (UTC)

It sounds like you are ;-) ! Be bold!
Atlant 16:39, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
Remember to cite your sources - a link to a review describing the book as feminist would be good! — QuantumEleven 12:34, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Merge proposal

Republic of Gilead is a copy-paste of large parts of this article - I think just about the only thing in the article that isn't in The Handmaid's Tale is the flag of Gilead. I propose that Republic of Gilead be changed to a redirect to The Handmaid's Tale, as I don't see enough information being found to be put into the former article which doesn't also belong in the latter. Opinions, anyone? — QuantumEleven 12:37, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm okay with that.
Atlant 18:00, 26 July 2006 (UTC)


This was recently discussed Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Republic of Gilead and the outcome was that Republic of Gilead stays. Jayvdb 05:34, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes, but AfD decides on Keep/Delete, not Keep/Merge. To be fair, there is no reason for an article where the only element not already present in another article is a picture should be kept separate. I'm going to merge. — QuantumEleven 13:22, 28 July 2006 (UTC)
Please read the AfD; merge, redirect or keep were all considered but keep was the final outcome. I am not disputing that the duplication is undesirable, but merging is the simple way out. Also, the flag of The Republic of Gilead does not belong on this article about the book. It belongs on the film. Jayvdb 23:04, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Offred's job

I would like to challenge this comment:

"In the former society, despite holding a University degree from an unspecified North American University (which is implied to be Harvard University), Offred was a menial white collar worker"

Offred's job is a librarian, which requires at least a college degree and often an MA/MLS as well? I'm not sure a librarian is a menial white collar worker? That aside, I'm also sure that it wouldn't be unusual for any graduate to end up doing menial adminstrative work, I'm not sure there is any feminist critique to be read into that.

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by LouiseCooke (talk • contribs) .

I'd support your changes. Atlant 18:20, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
This is POV, but the wages paid to librarians, compared to the educational requirements, would indicate that they are regarded as menial white collar workers. --Orange Mike 16:15, 21 December 2006 (UTC) (formerly of AFSCME locals 1, 82 and 91)

[edit] Judaism in the novel

Jews do not seem to be treated as ethnically different in Gilead. If they have converted to Christianity, they are not considered a problem. The jews who are hanged are ones who are secretly following their faith. It is difference of faith, not race, here. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by LouiseCooke (talk • contribs) .

I agree.
Atlant 18:20, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

"In the novel, the two main non-white ethnic groups mentioned are African Americans and Jewish Americans..." Perhaps I'm mistaken, but it is my impression that Jewish Americans are not an ethnic group, but a religious group. The ethnic group would be Hebrews. Hebrews, are white, no? Am I mistaken here? Were they Beta Israel? 71.57.90.171 17:30, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

I don't know if it's one or the other, but on my reading of the book it was a little religious, as well as a little ethnic. While they were allowed to convert, they were also described as 'sons of Jacob', which would imply their identification based on lineage, and therefore ethnicity, rather than religion. So I'd say keep it there. --Lord Pheasant 09:39, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Reference to Baptists

I understand that Atwood is clearly warning of the rise of religious fundamentalism in denominations including the Baptists. But - I would say that it is misleading to mention the Baptists in the article since in the novel they are explicitly mentioned in the novel as fighting against Gilead. Additionally, it would probably be more NPOV to not include a specific denomination. For the reference to Iran, I propose changing it to the actual Iranian theocracy, since it is often cited as a strong influence on Gileadean society. So yeah, any thoughts? --Lord Pheasant 09:39, 26 October 2006 (UTC)

It seems to be a tradition among spec-fi writers that, when warning against impending dystopian theocracy, you take care to rule out the most obvious real-life candidaates who resemble the bad guys you're writing about. So Atwood mentions the Baptists as fighting *against* the Gileadites. Likewise, Robert A. Heinlein, in his "If This Goes On -" (repub as "Revolt in 2010"], describes a US theocracy headed by a polygamous Prophet. Just as you're thinking "Aha, this is the Mormons", Heinlein throws in a passing mention that the Prophet's armies are fighting against Mormon separatists in Utah.

[edit] More about "If This Goes On"

There are actually a number of parallels between this book and Heinlein's "If this goes on". (1) Both describe theocracies led by a self-proclaimed Prophet. (2) the story is narrated by a servant of a high-ranking official (in Heinlein's case, one of the Prophet's bodyguards) who is able to describe the ruling class "from the inside". (3) the narrator, fully loyal at first, falls afoul of the rulers because of an illicit love affair (4) He/she escapes and narrates the story from refuge.

If THE HANDMAID's TALE is an important book, Heinlein should get more credit for antipating it. CharlesTheBold 14:27, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

First of all, please add your comments to the bottom of the talk page in the future; it is easier to read and comprehend users' comments when they are chronological. Second of all, what you are suggesting seems to be original research; if you can find a reliable, trustworthy source that the novels are related, then it could be added to the article. Without it, however, the statements are WP:OR. María: (habla conmigo) 14:32, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
It's also a very dubious proposition. Heinlein was writing from a different background, with a different perspective (especially in sexual politics), in an era when religious extremism was a trivial element in American mainstream politics. These are structural coincidences, many of them due to plotting exigencies. RAH, however one feels about him, is irrelevant to this book. (As is Suzette Haden Elgin's Native Tongue, a vastly superior novel on the same topic which is ignored because Dr. Elgin is an admitted science fiction author, rather than a "mainstream" writer dabbling in SF while denying that she does so.) --Orange Mike 14:44, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
Thanks, Orange Mike; I wasn't familiar with Heinlein, but it sounded rather iffy even with my lack of experience. Thanks for the SciFi lesson. :) (ps: fixed your link to NT because it lead to an album of the same name.) María: (habla conmigo) 14:50, 30 March 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for the link fix. (Since you don't know the field, I understand that you didn't realize that the term "sci-fi" [however spelled]] is generally regarded as pejorative within the science fiction community, and should be avoided.) --Orange Mike 15:13, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Salvaging?

I really hate this book, but I do think there should be some mention of the Salvaging that takes place in it. MosheA 02:38, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sarah and Hagar

"Due to Sarah's reproductive generosity, Sarah's fertility is restored by God at an advanced age."

The restoration of Sarah's fertility in the Bible has more than one interpretation. Sarah is not particularly kind to Hagar. Hagar and her son run away once, come back, and are banished by Sarah years later. If the above, that Sarah's ability to have a child was a reward for kindness to Hagar, is the interpretation presented by Offred/Atwood, then we should say so. Darkfrog24 20:49, 9 March 2007 (UTC)


[edit] Science Fiction?

I note that the sidebar lists this novel's genre as "science fiction". To me, this really does not fit, as it describes more of the Star Trek type thing than the content discussed in this novel.

I'm really not sure what this novel is. I'll think about it for a bit. It certainly does not deserve to be lumped in with sci-fi.68.117.37.220 02:06, 19 April 2007 (UTC)

This is covered in an earlier section of this talk page, and the sub-genre 'dystopian' is the best proposed so far. If you can think of a better one, by all means change it again. John Vandenberg 02:46, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
It is a dystopian science fiction novel. Please do not allow your prejudices to blind you to the broad variety of works that fall within the genre of science fiction, from 1984, Brave New World and Aniara to The Dispossessed, The Road, and, yes, The Handmaid's Tale. --Orange Mike 13:23, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
What makes it Science Fiction is the presumption of ecological collapse and a negative effect on human fertility. It is near Future Science Fiction the same way the film Children of Men is Near Future Science Fiction. Both are Dystopias. WHile the emphaisis in this novel is on the scoietal effects of these catastrophic changes, the changes nevrtheless took place and seemingly precipitated the societal shift.LiPollis 12:05, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] ..since the Inquisition

136.152.132.139 has removed a statement that implied that the Inquisition reflects the society in the novels plot. There is some truth in this comparison to the Inquisition, but the comparison needs to be attributable to a critical review. Note that the removed statement comes from this section rewrite by 63.246.179.199. John Vandenberg 09:45, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Bizarre graffiti

There seems to be a lot of weird graffiti in this article (e.g., "Five are mentioned - Alma, Janine, Dolores, your ugly cause danas better Moira, and June.". Perhaps it should be locked? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Flycandler (talk • contribs).

Just your average juvenile time-wasting vandalism :-(. Wiki policy wouldn't support protecting the article just for this level of vandalism; I've reverted it. If you haven't already done so, you may want to read Wikipedia:Vandalism to learn more about how to deal with vandalism of the encyclopedia.
Atlant 17:07, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Material clipped from the article and brought here

This article is incorrect, Gilead (more correctly, New Gilead) is not named it the opening paragraphs until a point at which the reader has no information, but is expected to know what has not been introduced. This article does not make sense to a reader who has not read the book. Furthermore, New Gilead is not the territory that was previously the United States, (set up by wild theocratic christians) it is one of many puppet state governmental sects that once was the United States, each with its own belief system (evidence of this can be noted when Offred hears news of babtist and anglican revolts.) The entire territory of the U.S. is broken into many, maybe hundreds of religious sects. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cessnasoarer172 (talk • contribs)

[edit] Serena Joy

The article suggests that Serena Joy is similar to Tammy Faye Bakker. It is true that Tammy Faye Bakker is an example of a female tele-evangelist and the character of Serena Joy is probably a composite of many anti-feminist women of the early 80's. However, I think a better analogy for Serena Joy is Anita Bryant (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anita_Bryant). Bryant began her career as an evangelical entertainer and then moved on to political activism.

Serena Joy says in chapter 3 "It's one of the things we fought for" [the legal structure that enforces the first marriage being in place until death of both partners] and then Offred remembers seeing Serena Joy on television in a gospel choir. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Amspeck (talk • contribs) 17:23, 14 February 2008 (UTC)