Talk:Tar-Ardamin

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From Aclarillo's talk page:

i have a question regarding Tar-Ardamin. You changed the translation of Ardamin from 'First of the world' to 'Pillar of the world' — may i ask why? 'Pillar of the World' would be 'Ardamindon' i think, whereas 'Arda-min' simply means 'Arda-first' (Arda, realm, here means 'world'). Anárion 10:11, 26 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Good question, and I think the idea behind the name is similar: that he is calling himself a primus inter pares, a 'first among equals' as well as a 'pillar of Edainic nobility' -- both are signs of emerging Númenorian arrogance. However, his Adûnaic name Ar-Abattarîk has the word element -tarîk, which is attested as 'Pillar' (ref: târik "pillar", in Minul-târik "Pillar of Heaven", in [Ardalambion]); it does have obvious linkages to the "minassë", and "minë" meaning one, a pillar forming physically, in essence, a "one". I also found this: [German site (though in English)] where it says that an earlier name for Meneltarma was Menelmin. Perhaps what Tolkien was getting at is that language also reflected the Númenorean's growing pride and estrangement from the Eldar: "min" in Quenya is transformed from "one" to "pillar" in Adûnaic. Or it could just be the final name slipped through the cracks in his ongoing editing (remember it was omitted from the LOTR Appendix). I think, then in the interests of clarity that the article should state that his Adûnaic name means "Pillar of the World", and in Quenya it may mean "First of the World". -- Alcarillo 17:45 26 Apr 2004 UTC

Thank you for your fascinating reply. i am copying this to the article's talk page ;-) Anárion 17:12, 26 Apr 2004 (UTC)