Talk:Tallahassee, Florida

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    [edit] Progressive?

    "Tallahassee has traditionally been a politically progressive city. It has voted Democratic throughout its history."

    Then it seems like it should say it has always been a Democratic city. The Progressive Movement was a movement among both Democratic and Republican parties. Before that, the support of slavery by the Democratic Party hardly seems like it would qualify as "Progressive".69.141.68.106 19:34, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

    [edit] Why the capital?

    Why is Tallahassee the capital of Florida and not e.g. Miami, as one could assume? 82.83.12.207 00:13, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)

    Because back when it became the territorial capital, the only towns worth mentioning in the state were Pensacola and Saint Augustine, so the capital was placed roughly equidistant travel time between them (IIRC). (Of course, that's already in the article, so I could have saved the typing. ;) ) - Aerobird 00:16, 7 January 2006 (UTC)

    I was told a story in Boy Scouts as a child that when they were trying to decide where the capitol should be, like the above person mentioned the only two cities/colonies worth mentioning were Pensacola and St. Augustine. So in the story I was told they had riders start from both cities and ride toward each other and where ever they encountered each other is where the capitol would be. And for some reason that ended up being a Native American settlement in the area of Tallahasse. I do not know if this is true. I actually came to this article to see if there was any truth about it but have not seen any mention of it. - GZUS96 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 161.51.11.2 (talk) 07:21, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

    Also: Florida at one time was just the panhandle area. Below that was all Spanish territory. Tallahassee is in the middle of the panhandle Marc Averette (talk) 19:46, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

    [edit] FSU

    An anonymous user used this in justifying the removing of some information: History of FSU is misleading... it was all-male at first before becoming co-ed, before becoming all female, before becoming coed again . Simpler to keep that detail out.

    Shouldn't this new information be verified and placed in the article?

    --Ram-Man 02:31, Apr 28, 2004 (UTC)

    [edit] Photos

    Regarding the photo request, I can look into getting a photo of the capitol complex and the skyline from, say, Pensacola Street. It'll be in a few weeks, though. TrbleClef 03:16, 11 Dec 2004 (UTC)

    I added a photo of the Florida State Capital Building. JeffreyAllen1975 16:16, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

    • Great photo! I moved it down a bit, since I think the general style convention is to put the infobox first. --JW1805 (Talk) 17:49, 3 December 2005 (UTC)

    [edit] External links in main article...

    All those external links in the "Education" section strike me as a little odd; shouldn't those be links to Wiki pages (red or otherwise)?


    [edit] Extend

    For an article about a city, this is not very long. Consider extending it. Krashlandon 17:49, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Image Collections

    I moved these image collection links from the 'external links' section to here. Listed on the page, it really borders on linkspam, but I think having them listed here could be useful as a reference. Dr. Cash 17:45, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

    • Harper Collection 1,300 images of Tallahasseans and the Tallahassee area, 1884-1911. From the State Library & Archives of Florida.
    • Granger Collection 1,650 images of Tallahassee and surrounding areas, 1940s-1950s. From the State Library & Archives of Florida.
    • Red Kerce Collection 800 images of historical people and places in Tallahassee and the surrounding area from 1940-1964. From the State Library & Archives of Florida.

    [edit] hospitals

    Is there allowed to be a section on hospitals, or are city templates only allowed certain sections? I'd like to add info in for TMH, Capital Regional, and FSU Med school. ⇒ SWATJester Ready Aim Fire! 22:35, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] New map

    Er...the county highlighted in the statewide map is not Leon, but rather Madison... - Aerobird 03:11, 10 February 2006 (UTC)

    How embarrassing is that? It's fixed now. ℬastique▼parℓer♥voir♑ 13:39, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
    Yeah, we don't like them Madison boys out here! (especially because that county is one of the biggest highway speeding-traps in the state, if not the US.) ⇒ SWATJester Ready Aim Fire! 16:54, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
    It's because of all those Bridges in Madison County. groan ℬastique▼parℓer♥voir♑ 19:36, 10 February 2006 (UTC)
    That's a new one on me; never had any problems or heard anything about Madison's sheriffs being particulary radar-gun-trigger happy. (Now Waldo and Hawthorne, on the other hand...) - Aerobird 03:54, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

    no not the sheriffs...it's the highway cops. You can't go on I10 through madison without seeing the cutouts in the median for them to speed trap you from.⇒ SWATJester Ready Aim Fire! 04:42, 11 February 2006 (UTC)


    [edit] Chiles High School

    Removed Chiles H.S. from this page as it's outside the city limits by a good ways. Technically this is a correct move but for those living in Tally - I would think most actually consider the county as Tallahassee since there are no other municipalities here. USA Noles1984 14:49, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

    I reinserted it. Even though it is not technically a part of the city, it is most closely associated with the Tallahassee. Maybe it should just be noted that way. official webpage even says "Tallahassee" on the top of the page. AriGold 15:06, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
    Also, there's been yap lately that Tallahassee might be considering consolidation with Leon County, a la Jacksonville/Duval County, which would make both Bradfordville ('proper' home of Chiles H.S.) and Woodville simply neighborhoods of Tally... - Aerobird 16:14, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
    I'll agree with your above statement on Chiles, Aerobird. I think I can swallow consolidation now since the city is handling the sewer system where I live as pitiful as it is. USA Noles1984 16:24, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
    It should stay inserted. While techinically outside of city limits, Tallahassee public schools are run by the county, and Chiles is part of the county school system. I disagree with saying that the school is located in 'neighboring Bradfordville', as I've always been convinced that Bradfordville is as much a section of town as is Killearn, downtown, the campuses, etc. There is no 'town' of Bradfordville.
    In the above you mention "Tallahassee public schools..." The schools are administered by Leon County so therefore there are no Tallahassee schools. Secondly you state "I've always been convinced that Bradfordville is as much a section of town as is Killearn, downtown, the campuses, etc. There is no 'town' of Bradfordville."
    True, there is no town of Bradfordville but Bradfordville is not "a section of town." Academically and legally it is unincorporated and not a part of Tallahassee. 25px|USA Noles1984 15:01, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Tallahassee Flag

    User:Angr removed the City of Tallahassee's flag with no explanation. I have returned it until there is a valid reason for initial removal.25px|USA Noles1984 16:04, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

    That flag is not the actual flag. We got a new city flag. I don't know how to post stuff, but I'll send a link over and you can put it up. Tlhcubsjaz 06:10, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Expanded Tallahassee history

    I'm currently putting together a compreshensive History of Tallahassee with photos for submission in the near future. Some may want to expand on this article prior to - which can be done at Tallahassee, Florida/Sandbox. It needs to be somewhat completed up through current years before posting. I'm still working on the Tallahassee Bus Boycott and old Tallahassee hotels for interest. 25px|USA Noles1984

    [edit] Newsweek high school rankings

    I have removed this information from the article because all of the rankings were outdated, and did not match the list for 2006. These rankings change every year, and any reference to them must be carefully referenced, and stated to make clear which year's list is being used. It would be best to not list individual school rankings in this article; It looks tacky. I would also note that the 2006 Newsweek list includes 1100 schools, up from 1000 in 2004 (I haven't located the 2005 list). -- Donald Albury(Talk) 11:18, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Notable residents?

    I see that Burt Reynolds was just added to the list of Notable residents of Tallahassee. I'm uncomfortable listing someone as a notable resident of Tallahassee when the only time they spent in Tallahassee was as a student at FSU. Any other thoughts? -- Donald Albury(Talk) 23:57, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

    • Students should indeed be counted as residents, imho. Some students live in their college town for as many as 8-9 years (because of grad school or apathy ;-) ). There is no reason to exclude someone who lived in a certain town for education. It's no different than someone moving to a town for work for a couple of years. My only concern is with listing athletes from FSU or FAMU, as the list would grow to be huge. AriGold 13:47, 21 August 2006 (UTC)
    I think it can be taken too far. Take Burt, for example. Born in Lansing, Michigan, raised in Riviera Beach, Florida, attended high school in West Palm Beach, attended FSU, had to drop out for a while because of an injury and attended Palm Beach Junior College in Lake Worth (I've seen photos from the 1950s of him in plays at the Lake Worth Playhouse), returned to FSU, worked in theater in upstate New York and in New York city, went to Hollywood, California, of course, has spent years at his ranch in Jupiter, Florida, and who knows where else. So, how many different cities, towns, whatever, get to claim Burt Reynolds as a resident? -- Donald Albury(Talk) 00:49, 22 August 2006 (UTC)
    I've been a resident of many cities. I don't understand how someone's celebrity status can be used as means of limiting where they have been a resident. Because they are famous then we are to hold their place of residency to a different standard? I don't know, it seems weird to me. Like you're trying to label a certain person to make things easier almost. This isn't a month long vacation we're talking about. If you live somewhere for school, for a signifigant duration or years, you're a resident. It seems pretty simple to me. By the time you die, you could have been a resident of dozens of cities, states, countries, etc. AriGold 15:24, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] New history article

    Most of the history of Tallahassee was moved to a massive History of Tallahassee, Florida article which I created so that it could be expanded upon correctly and in depth. Noles1984 20:51, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Events moved, Urban Planning and Expansion moved

    I moved the section Festivals and events up to under points of interset for a better flow or read. I moved Urban Planning and Expansion since it's technical in nature and other cities have demographics where that section was. Noles1984 17:52, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

    [edit] Sports teams

    What happened to the Tigersharks? - Aerobird 14:22, 27 December 2006 (UTC)

    The Tigersharks were moved to Macon, Ga. They became the Macon Whoopi, this was back around 2000. They have since moved from there and have joined the defucnt ECHL teams. Smarter fans moved on to the Tampa Bay Lightning. Asatruar (talk) 01:28, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

    • I was wondering if anyone from Tally that would like to help me with the creation of a Tallahassee scorpion page? Asatruar (talk) 00:19, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

    [edit] Fixed internal links

    Links to Leon County Emergency Service, FAMU Police etc. were not links to specific articles on those subjects but rather to general internal links like Police, etc. Emergency Services. Noles1984 15:52, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

    The Infinity software reference is the top of the section should be removed. Infinity is not a major corporation, they certainly do not in any way define Tallahassee, and I don't even believe they are the largest IT provider in Tallahassee.

    In a nutshell, no one does, nor should they, think of Infinity Software when they think of Tallahassee.

    I'm sure it's a fine company, but come on, that's as close to advertising as I've seen on wiki.

    [edit] Lost episodes

    I found some references (quotations) on the web. Last episode was transcribed from DVD and is completely accurate. Noles1984 16:55, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

    [edit] external links, residents, pop culture.

    the external links is looking like a link repository. some of that stuff just seems unnecessary, like the "tallybars" site. the things to do site, national civic league, etc. i think it should be cleaned up. if these are going to stay i'd like to add the site that i administer, tallahasseeshows.org

    i feel that the list of notable residents is kind of crazy, and should probably be limited to those born here. and the pop culture references are just kind of embarrassing and not needed.

    [edit] Tallahassee in pop culture

    I moved the section to its own article Tallahassee in popular culture because it was getting large and cumbersome. It has been reorganized with sections to be more easily read. Noles1984 20:48, 15 September 2007 (UTC)

    [edit] Music groups as "Notable Residents"

    Does it bother anyone else that there are several music groups listed as "notable residents"? It would seem more logical, to me, to either list the notable muscicians from the groups individually, or to make a new category such as "Notable Local Performing Groups". Tim Ross 12:22, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

    [edit] Tallahassee notables

    (copied from User Talk:Dalbury)

    Sorry, Dalbury, but I just undid your latest Tallahassee revision. In my opinion, having your own Wikipedia article is not the only suitable measure of notability, just a good first check. In fact, some rather non-notable folks have them, and some notable one, the various easily checked Olympic athletes on the list for instance, don't have articles. Marion Tinsley did have one, but without the "Dr.". I checked all the Olympians. They're legitimate. Tim Ross·talk 22:17, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

    I still say the best indicator that someone is notable enough to be listed as a 'notable resident' is to have their own article. It is not enough that someone's existence is verifiable. If we are going to call someone 'notable', then Wikipedia:Notability should apply, and it is a bit awkward establishing notability in a footnote to a 'notable resident' who doesn't have a WP article. -- Donald Albury 22:49, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
    Indeed, I suppose that all Olympic athletes can be fit into Wikipedia:Notability. Thus, someone could legitimately write an article for each saying, basically, that such a person completed in certain events, at a certain Olympics, with certain specified results. It doesn't make a lot of sense, though to require this for the Tallahassee listing unless you feel that some Olympic athletes are not notable. By the way, do you know if circular references, back to Wikipedia, qualify as "reliable sources"? Tim Ross·talk 23:35, 25 November 2007 (UTC)
    Whether a given individual (or the subject of any article, for that matter) meets the criteria of WP's notability guidelines is ultimately subject to a consensus of editors, often decided at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion (if an article has not been nominated for deletion, then no one has seriously questioned the notability of the subject). Notability for some subjects has been reduced to a set of criteria (see Wikipedia:Notability (music)). The notability quideline for people (Wikipedia:Notability (people)) requires substantial coverage of the person from independent sources. There is no provision that someone who has won a particular prize or event qualifies for an article in WP. As to your last question, Wikipedia articles are not reliable sources. Reliable third-partysources cited in WP articles may be cited in other articles, as long as it has been verified that the cited sources support the material in question.
    I believe your argument is faulty, Dalbury. Yes, one certainly is supposed to have reliable secondary sources in a biographical article to demonstrate, among other things, "sufficient coverage" to meet the notability specification. The Tallahassee article, however, is not a biographical one, and I don't believe that the listing of notable individuals in that article has to meet that specific standard. It is your personal definition, alone, which is the sticking point, that one should not be on that list in the Tallahassee article without a personal biographical article. I believe, for example, that the fact of having one's own article is sufficient grounds for consideration for the list, but that the article editors might justifiably wish to exclude some such individuals from the list if their local notability were negligible. Conversely, many important individuals, in a local sense, have no Wikipedia articles, but may be appropriate for the Tallahassee article. The Olympic athletes in question are a perfect example. One should be following a consensus of editors on this point, not the biographic notability requirment. In any case, I intend to replace the deleted Olympians, including an appropriate reference to their existence and achievements, which I hope you will find satisfactory. Tim Ross·talk 11:40, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
    Per Wikipedia:Verifiability, everything in WP articles must be verifiable, and anything that is challenged or likely to be challenged must have reliable published sources cited. Therefore, if I challenge whether someone is a notable resident of a place, then citations to reliable sources that such person is notable and is a resident/former resident must be provided. In practice, editors have been accepting the existence of a WP article about someone as establishing notability. So, either create an article for each person you want in the list, or cite enough reliable sources for each person to establish reliability and residency. -- Donald Albury 11:52, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
    May I point out, Dalbury, that your issue was with Wikipedia:Notability, not Wikipedia:Verifiability? I note, also, that your "challenge" on that topic consisted of deleting anything that didn't meet your standard, rather than initiating a discussion on Talk:Tallahassee, Florida, which might have been a better option, and, indeed, might be the right place for this discussion. Tim Ross·talk 12:34, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
    When I deleted the unsourced 'notable residents', I suggested creating properly sourced articles about them. Notability is established by citing reliable sources, as the requirement for everything added to WP is verifiability. You cannot discuss notability without invoking verifiability. -- Donald Albury 12:50, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
    In any case, I've re-added the three Tallahassee-associated Olympians, with refs to their accomplishments and Tallahassee connections. My apologies if any of my comments sounded grumpy. Not intended. Tim Ross·talk 13:30, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

    [edit] Governors as "Notable residents"

    Florida governors are, of course, notable. They also live in Tallahassee for a while. Thus, we could put all of them on the list of the city's notable residents if we wished. I don't think it would be especially worthwhile to fill the list with politicians who were in the city only while in office. For that reason, I am going to go through the ones now on the list and remove those with no other connection to the city than during their gubernatorial residency. Ruben Askew attended FSU, Leroy Collins was born in Tallahassee, and Lawton Chiles was an FSU research fellow. I can't find any good connections for Bob Graham or Claude Kirk. Tim Ross (talk) 16:12, 14 April 2008 (UTC)