Talk:Talking Heads

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Contents

[edit] Patrick Bateman

I got rid of the Patrick Bateman reference because it makes no sense whatsoever. I've read the book and seen the film, and while there is a quote from "Nothing But Flowers" at the start of the novel, I don't see any evidence that the Talking Heads were his "favorite band."71.137.208.182 04:36, 4 June 2006 (UTC)

Patrick Bateman definitely says that his favorite band is the Talking Heads. If I remember correctly its towards the end or the beginning of the novel. He does not analyze them at length, however.

That's a shame :( I'd like to hear what he has to say about them... 86.41.209.54 00:27, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The Simpsons

I think there should be mention of David Byrnes appearance on 'The Simpsons' episode "Dude, Where's My Ranch?" [[1]]. Dirk Diggler Jnr 12:46, 15 January 2006 (UTC)

I think that mention should be under David Byrne's own wikipedia entry as he has a lot of solo material and it fits under that better.JohnRussell 08:28, 29 January 2006 (UTC)

Added a end to end collection of Talking Heads albums on Rhapsody, since wikipedia doesn't allow the upload of rpl files, I was forced to link from my site.. I release it full PD if anyone wants it, but this is the only way I can do this.. I would hope that for a lot of musicians this could be done. I'd leave it up to the community to decide if its needed, but I personally like being able to hear the musician I'm reading about while I'm listening to them.. I guess I could Cntrl-C/V the text into rhapsody under Artist and find their work, but I also believe its a good service.. I don't get paid or anything from Rhapsody, I'm just a big fan of this method of accessing music. It's very addictive if you are a music freak like me, I have 200+ CD's for the record (Sand In The Vaseline, and Jerry Harrison's Casual Gods among them) and I don't use P2P networks for music, only bit-torrent for downloading TV shows and game patches, linux distros.. --Rofthorax 06:53, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Lifetime Piling Up

A minor query: `Lifetime Piling up'? I have the soundtrack album to Until the End of the World, and the Talking Heads track is listed there as `Sax and Violins'....

Whoops, you're right. "Lifetime Piling Up" was the single released to coincide with their one- and two-disc Greatest Hits at about the same time. I've fixed this now. -- PaulDrye

[edit] True Stories

Shouldn't there be a mention of the film/album true Stories here? It may have been mostly a Byrne project, but there was a band album out of it

[edit] TV personalities

Should probably also mention that "talking head" is slang for vapid television personalities. --MemoryHole.com

Not unless we're going to have an encyclopedia article called "talking heads" with the title understood in that sense. I would think television pundit would be more appropriate. If you want further argument, see this column. But it might be good to mention the more "literal" meaning of "talking head" as an explanation of the name of the band. --LMS
Actually, according to the Sand in the Vaseline disc one inside cover, they got their names from that definition. A friend came over when they were trying to think of a name, and suggested "Talking head" because it's the term for an all-head, no action talking shot if a person the friend had found in the TV guide. I think that this is pretty noteable. 207.7.187.135 13:52, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Suspicious edits

An anon user replaced:

Interestingly, the name 'Talking Heads', came from a visit to M.I.T., where a project that allowed for computer generated visualisations of world political leaders faces was being tested in an effort to allow the leaders to communicate with one another in a face to face scenario, in case of a crisis situation.

with:

The name 'Talking Heads', came from an issue of TV Guide that listed some words used in the television business. A 'talking head' is a shot of a newscaster from the shoulders up. 'All content, no action' seemed to fit the band's musical style and stage presence so the name stuck.

Some of this user's other edits have been slightly suspicious. Could someone who knows about this subject please check if this is accurate. - Efghij 03:13, 8 Aug 2003 (UTC)

As I mentioned in the above discussion, this is true. You can check Sand in The Vaseline. I'm not the one making those edits, but I just want to be of some help. 207.7.187.135 13:54, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
It's true, this is paraphrased from Tina Weymouth's section of the booklet from "Sand in the Vaseline". It's paraphrased a little wrong, since "stuck" sounds like a gradual process of acceptance, whereas in fact the name was chosen once and for all, two or three days before their first public performance, at CBGB's. (Per the same booklet.) I think maybe I'll change it to a direct quote rather than a paraphrase. DanielCristofani 10:28, 15 August 2006 (UTC)
Changed to a quote, and cited as well. DanielCristofani 11:01, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Frantz and Weymouth

Might be nice to add something about Frantz and Weymouth's work as producers since the talking heads. heidimo 01:05, 17 Jan 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Alan Bennett

Please don't bite my head off, but I'm wondering whether there ought to be a disambiguation page; I think British wikipedians at least would imagine Bennett's plays to be the primary meaning of "Talking Heads," and it might be worth mentioning the TV and movie production phrase too. Matthew Platts

I placed the disambiguation at the top of Talking Heads about a week ago (and merged Talking Head (Play) with Talking Heads (plays)). I think this serves the same purpose as a full disambiguation page. People looking for the Bennett plays would still have to load an extra page, while people looking for the band don't have to. The JPS 14:07, 8 Feb 2005 (UTC)
That seems the best solution to me. Take it from me, say "Talking Heads", and most british people think of DB and co, not AB's play :) Camillus (talk) 22:56, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] There are links to "life during wartime", but no article about the song

The "Life During Wartime" link redirected to an unrelated movie (The Alarmist) which has as an alternate title "Life During Wartime". I changed Life During Wartime from a redirect to a disambig, but the article Life During Wartime(song) still needs to be written if the song is notable enough- either that or the links need to be dewikified.JeffStickney 20:57, 19 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] "David Byrne's signature neurotic vocals"

Is "neurotic" the right word or should it be "psychotic"? DanielCristofani 10:04, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Psychotic? Sorry no. It gets me when people use the term without knowing its proper psychiatric definition. Whilst it is true that Byrne's vocals can be neurotic (with repetition of thoughts and obsession, negativity, isolation and fears/phobias). But not psychotic. Psychosis involves a lack of insight and I would say that the Byrne's characters/personas do have a great deal of insight about their "eccenticities" and are still capable of rational thought. I would be against using the term psychotic anyway, due to its already negative connotations and misuse. hedpeguyuk 14 July 2006 13:40 (UTC)

Repetition and negativity are not the point. The point is the disorganized thinking, and the random ascription of meaning to physical objects or conditions, and the paranoia.
"Hold on to that paper. Hold on because it's been taken care of. Even though it was never, it was never written down, still might be a chance that it might work out, if you hold on to that paper."
"What is happening to my skin? Where is that protection that I needed? Air can hurt you too, air can hurt you too. Some people say not to worry about the air. Some people never had experience with air."
"Animals think they understand. To trust in them, a big mistake. Animals want to change my life. I will ignore animals' advice. They're never there when you need them."
"I know the animals are laughing at us. They don't even know what a joke is."
"They're making a fool of us. They ought to be more careful. They're setting a bad example."
"Go ahead, laugh at me."
"This is a crime against the state. This is the meaning of life. To tune this electric guitar. An electric guitar is brought in to a court of law. The judge and the jury (twelve members of the jury) all listening to records. This is a crime against the state. This is the verdict they reach: never listen to electric guitar."
"I'm not a burning building. I'm a tumbler. Drowning cannot hurt a man. Fire cannot hurt a man (not the Government Man)."
"There is water at the bottom of the ocean. Under the water, carry the water. Remove the water, remove the water at the bottom of the ocean."
I mean this is great stuff, I love that quavery voice too, but "neurotic" is not the word for it. And I don't see a lot of rational thinking and perspective in these songs and similar ones. Of course there are plenty of other songs that do have a clear thought progression and are not like this at all. As for "negative connotations", I don't think many people would enjoy being the narrator of these, or his best friend. DanielCristofani 02:14, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
In the context of the song, the electic guitar may "really" be put on trial--just like the Beatles might really live in a yellow submarine. And both singers and the characters they sing about may use metaphors--like removing the water at the bottom of the ocean as a metaphor for doing the impossible. It's pretty hard to say what the "reality" in the context of a song is and whether the character in the song is disassociated from that reality--which I understand is the essence of psychosis.
Granted, some of the songs are so unclear that we can't even tell what is supposed to be "real" in them, or what they are about--we have nothing to compare the narrator's perspective with, all we have is that it doesn't seem to reflect a reality like the one we live in. Great.
If you put "'David Byrne' neurotic" into Google you get a number of references to his singing--which is probably more to the point. Nareek 10:36, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
Likewise for "psychotic". "'David Byrne' neurotic" gets "about 14,900" Google hits. "'David Byrne' psychotic" gets "about 102,000". DanielCristofani 23:29, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Well, I still feel that a lot of of the Fear of Music stuff is more neurotic (I mean, it's called FEAR of Music). Also, as pointed out above, it's hard to find out what reality is in a song. What I means about negative connotations was that the word gets bandied around a lot, often in the wrong context and usually being an unmberalla term for anyone evil or twisted.

That's unfortunate. I wasn't trying to say anything about "evil".

As someone who has suffered from mild psychosis (allegedly) I just don't like it.

Fair enough. If you don't think the word means anything, fine. But you will probably admit that if the word did fit anyone, it would fit a guy who thinks animals are talking to him? Or at least that that is not the kind of thing that would usually be filed under "neurosis"?

The word has just lost all meaning and Byrne's lyrics certainly don't prescribe to the official psychiartic definition. hedpeguyuk 15 July 2006, 11:22 (UTC)

Officially, you can't diagnose anyone unless you are a trained professional and can examine that person, right? So when non-professionals try to guess at a diagnosis for a fictitious person on the basis of song lyrics and vocal style, it's not a reliable process that will produce solid results. (Good question whether diagnosis of real people by professionals is a reliable process that produces solid results, for that matter.) All I was trying to say is that many of these songs do not just give the impression of someone with emotional problems, who is trapped in maladaptive patterns of thought and behavior (that would be more "neurotic")--they give the impression of someone whose picture of reality is very very different from ours (at least, mine), and whose thoughts seem seriously disconnected. DanielCristofani 23:29, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
Note "neurotic vocals". I was under the impression that his vocals were what was being called "neurotic" (and proposed to be called "psychotic"), not Byrne himself (who I expect is neither). In that respect, we don't need a trained professional, we just need definitions of the term. See neurosis, psychosis. Personally, I can't decide. Since GCIDE lists "neurosis" as involving "less distorted perceptions of reality than a psychosis", it may be the more appropriate term if we can't clearly classify the vocals as psychotic. (I also hope we're not descending into original research here.) — Wisq (talk) 03:10, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
Right, we aren't talking about Byrne himself, but the personas he projects while singing these songs. But about trained professionals...I think these words kind of belong to the psychiatric profession, just like the word "mammal" belongs to biologists. (Even if, as is my impression, psychiatrists don't want to use these words anymore, but prefer more specific ones.) And I suspect they are going to say that these words have no definition that can be understood in five minutes by a layman and then used to neatly and correctly categorize fictional people. Maybe we should start thinking about some completely different adjective? Since I don't like "neurotic", and hedpeguyuk doesn't like "psychotic"...DanielCristofani 05:42, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
To call vocals "neurotic" is not a clinical diagnosis, any more than calling Woody Allen's films "neurotic" is. The question is whether we're fairly characterizing the general critical and popular response with that adjective. I would say a quick Google search backs that up:
David Byrne's neurotic yelping [2]
the neurotic and intentionally wooden vocals that had previously characterized all Talking Heads albums[3]
Byrne’s lyrics, which portray a neurotic, paranoid, and fragmented self[4]
the nervous singing of Byrne and simple songs based on a few, strong chords: "Uh Oh", "Love Comes To Town", "New Feeling", "Don't Worry About The Government" but mainly the dark "Psycho Killer" are the best examples of a new genre, both irreverent and neurotic.[5]
Byrne's neurotic, nerdy twitchings delighted the crowd[6]
David Byrne's neurotic twitching[7]
Byrne's neurotic on-stage antics[8]
Their twitchy, preppies-on-amphetamines rhythms and semi-neurotic gestalt[9]
Just from the first couple of pages. Nareek 10:07, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
I would tend to agree. In my experience, I think the term "psychotic" tends to be reserved (by non-psychiatric mainstream culture) for things that imply violent, dangerous behaviour, while neurotic is more for things that merely imply a messed-up view of the world. But that could just be my take on it. — Wisq (talk) 17:31, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
On the inside cover on "Sand in the vaseline" Chris Frantz calls David's vocals "Paranoid," and I agree with him, if you've ever heard "I wish you wouldn't say that" In stage antics, he seems very jumpy, but I'm not sure about either neurotic or psychotic. --199.224.118.156 18:02, 24 July 2006 (UTC)
I agree with the above comment. Paranoid and obsessive are the most accurate descriptions. I think "psychotic" lyrics are more like the Insane Clown Posse's descriptions of killing people and raping their corpses, etc. NZ forever 01:13, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Influences

When a band is cited as having been influenced by the Talking Heads, it should be information that says something about the Talking Heads--because it's the Talking Heads article. If a little-known band covers a Talking Heads song, that tells you something about the little-known band, but it doesn't really shed much light on Talking Heads. Nareek 22:21, 6 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Potent Slab of Art-Punk Virtuosity?

Doesn't the phrase "potent slab of art-punk virtuosity" violate the Wikipedia neutral-point-of-view policy? If nobody disagrees, I'll edit the page at the end of the week. Tiffany78 20:19, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Breakup

This article has surprisingly little about the actual breakup of the band, and I can't seem to find any site that actually elaborates on what happened. Could anyone here expand on it in any way? Emperornortonx 02:56, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Influence

The first sentence of the "Influence" section says that Radiohead took their name from a Talking Heads song; the last paragraph states that "at least one well-known band name has come about from Talking Heads songs," going on to talk about how Husker Du got their name. The "at least one" is kind of strange, considering the section clearly shows two bands whose names are related to the Talking Heads. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.218.223.167 (talk) 04:26, 18 December 2006 (UTC).

[edit] History

Although Talking Heads roots are in Providence, RI, the band formed as Talking Heads in New York City. Mikieminnow 03:04, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] GA Nomination

I believe Talking Heads fulfills the criteria for Good Article status.Tinyboy21 20:57, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

I've failed this article for GA status. There are currently two citations (one of which needs to be formatted properly), and much of the article is unverified. Most, if not all, of the images lack fair use rationales for use in this article. The popular culture section needs to be prosified and probably merged into the article itself with the unimportant information deleted. Individual years should not be linked per WP:CONTEXT. ShadowHalo 03:59, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
Yes this article needs a lot more improvement before it can be a GA. Please merge the trivia section with other sections and remove non-notable ones. References are needed a lot more. Pembroke 05:22, 11 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Risky Business (movie) and "Swamp"

  1. According to Allmusic (link), the "Risky Business" soundtrack album does not include the song "Swamp"
  2. If "Risky Business" was actually named after the lyric from "Swamp", that claim should be supported by an authoritative reference. Given how closely they were released (Speaking in Tongues on June 1, 1983, "Risky Business" on August 5, 1983) this claim seems unlikely to me.

--Register allocation 15:47, 28 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Album charts (not strictly about this article, but...)

I recently added UK chart positions for their albums on the relevant articles. None of the albums, from Speaking in Tongues onward, have US chart positions given for them. Could a fan in America get hold of this info? Thanks. Totnesmartin 14:37, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Talking-Heads-logo.png

Image:Talking-Heads-logo.png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.BetacommandBot 04:26, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Unofficial members

Does anyone have information on how important any unofficial members were to the Talking Heads? They have contributors on a lot of their albums and live shows. I am thinking particularly of Bernie Worrell here. Would Worrell, or any other musicians, be appropriate to mention somewhere in the article? The article does mention touring Europe as an 8-piece band, but that is really all. keammo1 01:31, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

I don't have any information, but I think that would be appropriate if they were important. As long as it's verifiable and not trivial it's okay. --Gimme danger 20:18, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] This article is in a poor state

It's too small, not adequately referenced, needs cleanup. Looks neglected.--h i s s p a c e r e s e a r c h 13:24, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] The Heads (band)

That page is better suited if it was assimilated into Talking Heads' page. Fhb3 07:35, 7 October 2007 (UTC)

  • Agreed. In fact it's already pretty much assimilated, so you might as well just make it into a redirect. --Bobyllib 10:30, 9 October 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Founding locale

The article says Providence, RI but the table says New York City. In Providence, it is well known through the city that Talking Heads formed there...is this like They Might Be Giants techinically forming in Lincoln, MA, but officially forming in Brooklyn? Doc Strange 15:23, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Actually the article says both: "Talking Heads was an American rock band formed in 1974 in New York City" and also "Formed in 1974 at the Rhode Island School of Design in Providence, Rhode Island". Yeah, I'm confused, too. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.16.43.198 (talk) 04:00, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

[edit] "Talking Heads" vs. "The Talking Heads"

The article variously calls the bad "Talking Heads" and "The Talking Heads". Should we be consistent? (Or is that the hobgoblin of little minds?) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.123.89.236 (talk) 16:44, 17 December 2007 (UTC)