Talk:SyFy Genre Awards

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What's the relevance of the 9/11 terrorist attacks, mentioned in the History section? Rojomoke 14:07, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Now that you raise the question, I'm inclined to ask: What is the relevance of this article at all? How is it not just spam? (Note how any defense from a party which has a conflict of interest would tend to validate the notability concern.) Avt tor 18:33, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

What is the relevance of many pages on here? Do I have a conflict of interest? Sure. But to invalidate any statements I would make before I even have a chance to make them is just, well, unnecessary. The SyFy Genre Awards were one of the first virtual awards directed toward issues that were outside the realm of the Internet. "Virtual awards" and such did exist, but usually for recognizing Web sites and the like. The Genre Awards have spawned a lot of the "virtual" awards that are out there, whether it be things as large as Space Channel's "Spacey Awards," or as small as "The Golden Toaster Awards," a set of more fun awards that are given by fans to the cast and crew of "Battlestar Galactica" each year, to whom they will tell you were directly inspired by the Genre Awards. The cast and crew, at their wrap/holiday parties, proudly display their awards for the Golden Toasters, and a lot of that originated with this annual event.

To answer the question about the relevance of the 9/11 attacks, it is there simply to state that there is a break in the "annual" nature of the awards, which was cancelled specifically because of the Sept. 11 attacks. At the time, we didn't feel that it would be the right thing to do with everything going on, and people's focuses elsewhere.

Do I have a conflict of interest? Sure'

Therefore, you should not be involved in creating or editing this article. Everything you say after that point is original research and conflict of interest and therefore of no relevance. Avt tor 15:58, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

There appears to be pages for the Spacey Awards (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spacey_Award) and others. A Web search on "SyFy Genre Awards" will show that these awards are quite well known far beyond the Web site itself, and have been mentioned in hundreds of other media over the year, if not thousands.

What is the difference between including an entry that is of public (even if it's a niche public) interest, or one that could be considered "spam"? And since "spam" is the discussion of unsolicited e-mail that is forced upon someone to read, how is an entry in Wikipedia being forced on anyone? There are other references already to actors and shows in Wikipedia's listings talking about the SyFy Genre Awards, and isn't Wikipedia supposed to be the publication where a user can find whatever information he or she needs? Will you go on delete patrol and look for all ancillary references to the Genre Awards and remove those, too, just in case someone who sees that is curious to what it is and go looking for a page on it?

I can't tell you what to delete or not to delete. But there is a page for the Web site that hosts it, and if this has to be deleted, I ask that some aspects of it actually be merged with the page that provides a bio on the site.SyFyMichael 05:35, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Spam is something that comes to me univited. My visiting any page on Wikipedia would not fit that definition. Besides, the "SyFy Genre Awards" is something that extends beyond this site to fans of very popular shows,and having it mentioned here is a service to those same fans. I think of Wikipedia as a place that provides information rather than one which censors or deletes it.

4.68.248.196 21:17, 19 February 2007 (UTC)MaryAnn

Still wondering when you are going to target this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spacey_Award ... It is a similar awards system (that most likely was formed based on the success of the subject of this top), is a stub, and cites no sources, no external sites, nothing. If this topic is going to be cited, then I think the Spaceys should be next. I have nothing against the Spaceys, but this page was put together with extensive work ... 72.91.234.3 02:16, 1 March 2007 (UTC)~~

Actually, the Spacey Awards are relevant and notable as a television program, which is why it's under Wikiproject Canadian Television. My personal opinion is that the Spaceys are lame and stupid, but them I have the same opinion of American Idol; it is certainly the case that my personal opinion, or anyone else's, does not define notability. I have actually watched the Spaceys on television; it was rather painful, but I watch stuff like this because it is notable in an area that I happen to be expert in. If you 8look at the page history, it was not edited mainly by people involved in the program. Also, nobody is using this to promote the web site. So it is notable, not spam, not original research, and not conflict of interest. I would not be upset if it went away, but I only "target" sites for deletion wich meet Wikipedia criteria for articles for deletion. Avt tor 15:58, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

So relevant that they are nothing more than a stub. I mean, seriously ... it almost invites a joke: How many Wikipedians does it take to create a stub entry? Even the links don't seem to go anywhere for the individual shows. There are no notations of where the information came from (yet where is the warning at the top asking for areas to be notated?), and nothing to suggest that there is any external links that talk about it. (Sure, I know there are external links for the Spaceys, but where are they in the entry?)

Here is something that simply shows up on television in some limited geographic market. The SyFy Genre Awards have not been televised, but have been announced on two separate syndicated American radio shows in the past. And I'm talking about the kind of radio you pick up in your car, not podcasting. The Spaceys are a marketing mechanism of the Space Channel, where the SyFy Genre Awards are a marketing mechanism of SyFy Portal. I guess because SyFy Portal is just a large independent news site, it doesn't get the same "notability" of some Canadian cable channel? How many viewers does the Spaceys get? The Genre Awards, in comparison, have had more than 1 million votes cast over the years, and it has become so significant that if SyFy Portal closed its doors tomorrow, I guarantee you that the Genre Awards would continue.

I like Wikipedia, and I appreciate you discussing this further. I have learned a lot about the Wikipedia notability guidelines, and definitely appreciate that. But I also can see how they are being applied quite subjectively. The Spaceys, in comparison (which I have nothing against, for the record), have no references, no external links, are incomplete, is nothing more than three paragraphs, and is also a marketing tool for a commercial entity (like the SyFy Genre Awards). Because it shows on television with a couple hundred thousand viewers (I may not be Canadian, but I know my stuff, too) and it happens to be a part of some Wikiproject, it gets subjective special treatment.

I have a lot of respect for the Wikipedia team, and I love Wikipedia. I've even had the honor of meeting the founder of this site, and having coffee with him, and feel that this is something that will be around for a long time. If the Wikipedia board decides that this entry does not meet notability standards, then I will see what options I have, and when they are exhausted, I will move on. I have been providing external links showing the interest that has been generated around the Genre Awards internationally ... something that the Spaceys really don't get.

I will maintain my previous request that instead of this being considered for deletion, that a minimized version of this (keeping just the history and such) be merged with the SyFy Portal entry, which I hope is not also being considered for this action. But once again, it's not my decision, it's the board's. I'm just doing what I can to protect what I believe IS a noteworthy entry in Wikipedia.SyFyMichael 21:18, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

There is no "board". Decisions are made on the basis of editorial consensus. As you have a conflict of interest, you lack the impartiality required to be qualified to edit this article.

It's possible you are right that the Spacey Awards need to be cut back or deleted. That's kind of outside the scope of this discussion. Avt tor 21:40, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Yeah ... unlike larger corporations and such, I don't have a budget to pay other people to update my editorial content here, as is a common practice from what I have read. I don't agree with such updating, as I believe THAT takes away from the integrity of Wikipedia more than anything else. But I guess as long as that's allowed, smaller operations don't have a chance. 65.213.147.254 18:42, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

If you have evidence that people are violating conflict of interest on other pages, feel free to take appropriate action. It is certainly the case that the size and budget of an organization correlate to its notability to some degree. At any rate, Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information. You've made very clear that your edits on this page serve a personal commercial interest, making this page both spam and COI. Avt tor 14:15, 28 March 2007 (UTC)