Talk:Steven Adler

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I am pretty sure he was the drummer from 1985-1990, not 1991

Contents 1 Where is the neutrality of this article? 2 Merge 3 Other Famous Steven Adlers 4 Stroke 5 Band Name Confusion 6 German-American category 7 Slash duff axl 8 POV section

[edit] Where is the neutrality of this article?

This segment of the article is an OPINION, it does not belong in a wikipedia article:

• • While Axl was bent on world domination and found little fun in his struggle to achieve it, Steven was the most easy-going of the band, and sought to enjoy his life and career maximally, of course not without the aid of drugs. When Steven shared with Axl's girlfriend Erin Everly a combination of heroin and cocaine (apparently her first time using hard drugs) and almost killed them both, Steven's relationship with Axl reached a breaking point. A legendary manipulator, Axl rallied the other band members against Steven when it came time to start recording for UYI and Steven was still not past his heroin addiction, and Steven soon fired, his drumming remaining only on the first track of UYI II, "Civil War". On one hand, this was understandable behaviour by Axl, who had previously threatened in front of thousands to quit the band if the others didn't clean up, and the rest of the band also endorsed his firing at the time. On the other hand, Steven claims it was the medication against heroin addiction that made him unable to perform in the studio, and the unaccomodating attitude of the band, even his lifelong friend Slash, indicated much manipulation by Axl. GN'R fans are often devided into two camps: one favouring the brighter-sounding early GN'R with Adler, the other preferring the heavier sound GN'R aquired with replacement drummer Matt Sorum (previously of The Cult). Izzy Stradlin, who quit the band (citing Axl's dominance) a short while after Steven was fired, insisted later that Steven's drumming was crucial to the band's sound, and agreed to an interviewer's comment that replacing him with Sorum turned GN'R from a hard rock band to a heavy metal one. Sorum, nonetheless, became an integral part of GN'R, and continues to work with Slash and Duff even today in Velvet Revolver.

I have been a fan of GNR for over 5 years and I have NEVER heard that incident involving Erin and Adler. Where is the proof??? Show us some external link where that is mentioned. And calling someone a "legendary manipulator" seems to me extremely low. This article should be simply written all over again.<<Coburn_Pharr>> 04:21, 6 August 2005 (UTC)

You've been a fan for "over five years"? Dude, these guys have been around for like 20 years now. Do some reading in back issues of Rolling Stone and other magazines and catch up on stuff.

Hello,that article right there was addler blowing of steam again, After Guns N' Roses,Addler`s had limited success,andghas been frustrated,the real reason behind Addler leaving was that when Axl threatened to break up the band if they didn`t stop drugs,everyone but Addler didn`t. And it wasn`t Axl`s personality that got Izzy to quit,it was the musical directyion,with Matt Sorum,"the band sounded more like a heavy metal band than a hard rock band"-Izzy Stradlin. Overall the article is slanderous,Axl wasn`t a legendary manipulator,he can`t even win the court cases over the greatest hits album,to finish it Steven himself was a wreck,not Axl,he had to sue to get money for Apetite for Destruction,bad mouths the band,and then failed with Addler`s Apetite(a loose parody of Apetite for Destruction) then went on tour with Guns N' Roses revisited,which in itself got quite a bit of attention due to the guns n' roses name, and the 2 gnr alumni(guns and himself.)Most Importantly though Steven was fired after his drug use got so bad he was fired when he could only play two songs at a concert before going to a hostpital.

• • • • It doesn't matter if I have been a fan for 5 years or 30. The fact is that even if parts of this article were true, it does not follow WIKIPEDIAS NEUTRAL POINT OF VIEW POLICY. That's my whole point. <<Coburn_Pharr>> 00:08, 2 September 2005 (UTC)

I hate to add to an already tense situation but isn't it more than a little redundant to say that GNR fans can be divided into those who prefere Steven and those who prefere Matt? In my experience that happens any time a band member is replaced, there are always fans who prefere the original and fans who prefere the new guy (definately applies to everyone in GNR), so including it in an encyclopedia seems more than a little redundant. If no one can offer a valid reason for including this sentace I'd like to remove it. Danikat 22:42, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Agreed, it's been in the article with a citation request for months. That's more than long enough, but nobody's stepped in with any source to validate its presence here. It should go. DanielEng 19:18, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

And its gone. Danikat 15:24, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Well done. Thanks for remembering this. :) DanielEng 03:49, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Merge

I merged this from Steve Adler. I know very little about the guy, so I'll leave the NPOV dispute you guys. -- Chris 23:57, 14 August 2005 (UTC)

The drug incident with Adler and Erin Everly is well known. By everyone. It is not disputed. Axl went into details about it, ending with "Steven almost killed my f***king wife".

It was not an opinion, insamuch as the incident is disputed by nobody involved.

I've been a GNR fan for 18 years, and I have no idea how any fan of GNR of even 6 months could *never* have heard of this famous incident. Oh, by the way, Slash plays the guitar. In case you haven't heard. That's a well-kept GNR secret too.

• • One again it doesn't matter if it's true or not, the fact is that it is not NEUTRAL!!!! Review wikipedias neutral point of view policy. Calling someone a "legendary manipulator" doesn't seem neutral <<Coburn_Pharr>> 21:50, 15 September 2005 (UTC)

• • I added an explanation in brackets of my reason for calling Axl that, I hope this alleviates your problem with it. Furthermore, since GN'R's history is so murky and disputed vastly even between band members, you can hardly expect a completely impartial article of a fan, can you?

• • Steve was the ORIGINAL drummer for GNR from 1985 - 1990!!! I've fixed the first paragraph up. It's correct now. Unless someone edits it again and ruins it!!!

(sigh) why is it that so many people don't get it that being the first person to play a particular instrument on a band's first official album doesn't make that person the "original" player of that instrument for that band? well, time for me to "edit it and ruin it"... Gringo300 04:00, 8 October 2005 (UTC)

• If you had said "being first doesn't make you the best" you would have been right, but being first DOES, in fact, make you the ORIGINAL (i.e. it ORIGINATED with you). Anyway Appetite for Destruction has sold (and continues to sell) several times as many copies as any GN'R album with Matt Sorum on it, so it is not unfair to say that he was the drummer of GN'R at its prime.

Wrong,the "Origonal" drummer for Guns N' Roses was Rob Gardener

• Yeah partially true, but then you'd have to say that the Original guitarist was Tracii Guns and not Slash, that doesn't seem so right does it? Steven and Slash were part of creating the stuff that made GN'R famous, before that GN'R was small-time, I think of it in the sense that Adler and Sorum were the only two major recording drummers of old GN'R, and of the two Steven is the original

now i've heard that ole beich played bass for guns'n'roses before duff mckagan. actually, i think i've seen a gnr picture with ole. this would mean that the ENTIRE first l.a. guns line up (axl rose, tracii guns, ole beich, and rob gardner) were also in guns'n'roses. l.a. guns now has ZERO past or present guns'n'roses members. Gringo300 04:06, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

Just so you know it's also well known that Izzy DID leave GnR due partly to Axl's behavior. Also, I do have to say that both Steven and Axl were "wrecks" (Axl knocked out a guy with a camera because security could not get to him in two seconds, left the stage, and started a riot) Steven was too heavy of a drug user, everyone knows it, and Axl was an egomaniac, everyone knows it, however those are opinions and Wikipedia should be about facts. (oh, and as for Steven being the ORIGINAL,just about every famous band has nobody's that start with them for a litte while, that doesn't mean they were true parts of the band, a true part of the band is who gets famous with them, and that was Adler.)

---

My heart goes out to Steve, he suffered more than any other Guns N' Roses members.

[edit] Other Famous Steven Adlers

Consider for removal or move.

This should go on a disambiguation page, no? Stuhacking 14:22, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

If there are other Steven Adlers deserving of a wikipedia page, then I suppose so. Are there? Sylvain1972 15:13, 15 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Stroke

The article mentions that he had a severe stroke after taking a speedball, but doesn't mention when, or if he stopped taking drugs because of it, if anyone knows I'm sure a lot of people (including me) would be very thankful if you added it. 75pickup (talk · contribs)

In 1995, he was shooting cocaine when he suffered a stroke and went into a coma. He later suffered a second stroke and a heart attack. --Archenemydnb 18:25, 1 February 2007 (UTC)

Well in a January 2006 interview with Metal Sludge he said he was smoking marijuana while doing the interview and mentioned smoking 'rock' 2 months before (not 100% sure what that is, I've heard it as a name for 2 or 3 diffrent drugs.) http://www.metalsludge.tv/home/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1139&Itemid=37 Danikat 15:56, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Band Name Confusion

Previously the article stated that Duff introduced Steven and Slash to Izzy and Axl and that they were the remaining original members of Hollywood Rose which featured Tracii Guns and Ole Beich. That is factually wrong. I have changed it from Hollywood Rose to Guns N Roses. There was already a lineup of Guns N Roses before Slash, Steven, and Duff joined. I also added Rob Gardner after Ole Beich. He was the drummer that Steven replaced. SleazeTease 22:26, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] German-American category

This has been removed twice now, not because there's an issue with the category itself, but because no source has been provided, and there's never been any evidence to prove it. As far as I know, Adler has never identified publicly as having a German background. If there is an article or something else that can confirm Adler's German heritage, please provide the source and I'll be happy to put the category back. I'm aware the surname is a German word, but that doesn't necessarily mean he is. DanielEng 03:31, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Slash duff axl

hate steven duff slash and axl or are they friend?--213.101.224.93 (talk) 16:09, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

[edit] POV section

This material was deleted from the article by consensus several months ago, and should not have been added back.

GN'R fans are often divided into two camps: one favouring the brighter-sounding early GN'R with Adler, the other preferring the heavier sound GN'R acquired with replacement drummer Matt Sorum.^{[citation needed]} Izzy Stradlin, who quit the band (citing Axl's dominance) a year and a half after Adler was fired, insisted later that Steven's drumming was crucial to the band's sound, and agreed to an interviewer's comment that replacing him with Sorum turned GN'R from a hard rock band to a heavy metal one. He also famously stated in the same interview: "After Steven left, nothing worked."^[1]

Why:

GN'R fans are often divided into two camps: one favouring the brighter-sounding early GN'R with Adler, the other preferring the heavier sound GN'R acquired with replacement drummer Matt Sorum.^{[citation needed]}

Absolutely unsourced, and message board posts with fan opinions don't count. A citation was requested for this back in 2/07, over a year ago, and the material was left without a citation for an extended period of time before being deleted. See WP:SOURCE and WP:NPOV.

Izzy Stradlin, who quit the band (citing Axl's dominance) a year and a half after Adler was fired, insisted later that Steven's drumming was crucial to the band's sound, and agreed to an interviewer's comment that replacing him with Sorum turned GN'R from a hard rock band to a heavy metal one. He also famously stated in the same interview: "After Steven left, nothing worked."^[2]

Again, not sourced properly, and undue weight--the comment about "nothing working" actually referred to everything, not that Adler's departure screwed up the entire band. In Slash's autobiography and every other reliable source, it's stated that Adler, with his drug use, was impeding the band's ability to work and was fired by mutual consent of all the members. The quote about "Axl's dominance" is irrelevant to the article on Adler. Also, the quote isn't "famous," there's no evidence it has ever been repeated or cited anywhere else. DanielEng (talk) 09:30, 26 April 2008 (UTC)