Talk:St. Nahi's Church
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[edit] Pronunciation of Taney
Pronunciation or Taney. This article called the correct pronunciation as "Tawney" and says that this is based upon the fact that the origin of the name is Irish. If this were true, the letter a would appear with a fada over it - and no such records exist. It also appears to backed up by a note made by Archbishop John Alan, and Englishman who occupied the archiepiscopal seat from 1528 to 1534 (when he was murdered near Artane) where he annotates an entry referring to the title of a prebendal stall in St. Patricks Cathedral of "Tathtoin" with "alias Tawney".
But there is much more evidence disagreeing with this pronounciation. The original Irish term was "Tigh Nahi" meaning "House of Nahi". There is no "aw" sounds likely from this pronounciation. Furthermore, predating the note by Archbishop Alan, the earliest mention of the church is made by Pope Alexander III and he refers to the parish as "the middle place of Tignai and it's church". Again, the pronunciation of Tignai is tig-nay, with a short vowel sound of Tig to rhyme with pig (or alternatively tee-nay, silent 'g', depending on the dialect). In a note in his book, the "Liber Niger", which is used as the basis for the "tawney" pronunciation, Archbishop Alan refers to the parish as "Tanney", again precluding a pronunciation of a long drawn-out vowel sound. Bardcom (talk) 19:23, 21 February 2008 (UTC)
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- That's indeed what you tend to hear nowadays. But I spoke to someone at Mount Merrion church this morning, and they say "Tawney" was used in living memory. They thought the article might have been drawing on an old Parish history, which mentions this, apparently someone bought a copy by post late last year "to use on an Internet article." I suppose that many people editing Ireland-related articles are not actually in Ireland and have to use "library-style" sources. 83.250.96.225 (talk) 13:34, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
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- A lot of articles for surnames indicate a pronunciation of "Tawney", but I listened to one that has a link to an audio of their name, and I would say it sounded like imagining how someone with a "Dort" accent would pronounce the word. It's interesting that you say that "Tawney" was used in living memory though. Hopefully it doesn't means that the Dort accent has been around for longer than any of us would like to think :-) I live locally, and nobody I know says "Tawney". But the fact that the "Tawney" pronunciation was used in living memory suggests that perhaps it used to be used in the past - but was it ever the common pronunciation? The old parish history is probably the same one I've used as reference, but the *only* mention there is a handwritten footnote that says "Tawney". This is very dubious as evidence though - the same person also uses the spelling of Tanney, and the book he annotated also has other alternate spellings - hard to see why someone would use this as the basis to say that out of all the possible spellings/pronunciations, Tawney is the correct one. Bardcom (talk) 18:01, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
The name “Taney” has had many different spelling variations over the centuries. The parish of Taney: a history of Dundrum, near Dublin, and its neighbourhood (1895)[ http://www.archive.org/details/parishoftaneyhis00balliala] includes these twelve: Taney, Tacheny, Tachnensis, Tachney, Tanee, Tanhy, Tannee, Tanney, Tathtoin, Tawnee, Tawney & Tignai. Take your pick! Seriously though, surely the "correct" pronunciation is the one in current usage, even if it was pronounced differently in times past. Perhaps the ref to "Tawney" could be re-instated in the article pointing out that this version is archaic. Suckindiesel (talk) 21:34, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
- Perhaps a listing all of the spellings like you've just done is an even better idea - it gives people an idea of how many ways there are to spell (and hence pronounce) the name. I removed the original pronunciation guide as I thought it was a mistake, but if it's one of several possible archiac variations, I think the article would be much improved by including the list above. I'm happy with any other suggestions too. Bardcom (talk) 21:43, 24 February 2008 (UTC)
