Talk:Southern belle

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[edit] Southern belles and race/ethnicity

Hi! This isn't something I know a lot about so I am asking for information: could someone offer examples of southern belles of various races/ethnicities? All the examples in this article are caucasion, and given that part of the definition is "an archetype for a young woman of the American South's antebellum upper class" "nostalgic for a bygone era," I am wondering how this might apply to anyone other than caucasions? If the definition has been appropriated or expanded by (an)other group(s), I wonder if there needs to be a little more explanation? — scribblingwoman 12:06, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Photo

This is a really good photo. Interesting composition, evocative take on a pedestrian subject. I don't, however, think it is entirely suitable here. It doesn't really tell the casual reader much about the Southern Belle. A still from Gone With the Wind would be better, or a fashion plate from 1845. — scribblingwoman 23:10, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

See Daughters of the Dust, research Creole culture, and learn more about the lack of funding or attention given to major works of art that highlight women of color (in particular those racialized as black) in a romanticized fashion, and you'll have answers to much of your inquiry.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.48.189.38 (talk • contribs)

At first I was confused because this comment follows my comment on the photo, but I assume that you are referring to the earlier question, re. race? Apparently, and not surprisingly, there is a huge literature out there about racialized women in the South. I still think, however, that the statement "A southern belle can be of any racial/ethnic background" needs explanation, especially given that the definition goes on to say that Southern Belle's are "nostalgic for a bygone era": presumably slavery times/grand old plantations/etc. etc. The line "Although a southern belle can be of any background, traditional symbols in film have often been juxtaposed to the enslaved woman or hired maid servant" goes some way to explaining the use of women of colour in some of these representations, but the article does not explain how women of colour can actually be Southern Belles, nor offer any examples. Again, this is far afield from my areas of knowledge, but I had always thought that the Southern Belle was a white image, because of its history in plantation culture. I'm not arguing that the people who have written otherwise here are wrong, but I am saying that I think there needs to be some more explanation. This is a friendly, and interested, request for clarification. — scribblingwoman 12:48, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes, the typical (or archetypal) belle is white, since there is a strong connotation of upscale leisure associated with the belle. However I would think that Whitley in the TV show A Different World would qualify as a belle. In addition, in antebellum New Orleans, there was a thriving demimonde of quadroon and octaroon belles--they had debuts just like their white counterparts, albeit toward a different purpose (to secure a protector, rather than a marriage).72.229.110.85 (talk) 02:59, 7 March 2008 (UTC)

The photo is a horrible example for illustrating the subject. There is nothing informative in it. All I see is a black and white photo of a woman with a ring, nothing unique or descriptive of southern belles. I think it should be removed. ~MDD4696 03:07, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

It contributes nothing to the article. DELETED! 69.138.251.227 07:01, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Citations

Shouldn't this article be tagged for citations? It has none. Kellenwright (talk) 04:50, 4 April 2008 (UTC)

I agree. Will do so. — scribblingwoman 03:35, 5 April 2008 (UTC)