Talk:South Melbourne FC

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needs to be cleaned up, it's too much text not in sections

Contents

[edit] South Melbourne FC

I've modified the bulk of this article because it was a little cumbersome, separating it by era. I've also rewritten much of it, but tried to retain some of the original article for consistency (apologies to the original author). —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dragases (talk • contribs) 20:42, 23 January 2006.

Thanks for your work. I've been trying to guard this and related articles from vandalism, but can't do much else from lack of knowledge. No need to apologise to the original article; that's what happens on Wikipedia (see the first, bold warning in the "please note" section of the edit pages :). PS: On talk pages, could you please sign your posts? You can do so by typing four tildes, thus: ~~~~. —Felix the Cassowary 12:48, 23 January 2006 (UTC)


Quick summary of some things i edited. I fixed up a bit in the 1990's section which i felt wasn't worded properly, to a) demonstrate the broader situation, b) sound less accusational for want of better word, and c) removed the 'stayed away in droves' bit because the smfc official site has an increase in average attendance for that period in time, which didn't support the claim made prior. Also made a small correction with regards to the 1971 campaign, in that it was Footscray JUST not George Cross who beat us to top spot. Thanks to whoever put the page and info up in the first place and to Dragases who cleaned it up. Blackmissionary 10:37, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

Thanks, Blackmissionary. Do you have any scans of the club's old emblems (ie. original red V, Gunners) so we can include them in the article? Dragases 08:29, 16 May 2006 (UTC)
There's this http://www.ozfootball.net/museum/images/bphellas.jpg, and this http://www.ozfootball.net/museum/images/keyringgunners.jpg which i'm not sure if you need permission to use them. So best to check, or failing that, i'll try and see if i can get in contact with one guy who i'm pretty sure has something to do with OzFootball and see what he says Blackmissionary 10:44, 16 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bored

Bored so i made/edited one of those userbox things for South fans. Enjoy. Template:User_South_Melbourne_FC Blackmissionary 23:19, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

And we even have our fan category, which i'm not quite sure how i created it, but it's there, even if there are only like two of us at the time of this message. Blackmissionary 01:47, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 2006 mid point revert

I did this because, though i thought it was not an inappropriate entry per se (i quite liked it), i also think it's better to have a full season's summary rather than some half season update. That kind of thing is not necessarily encyclopaedic in my opinion, and is more akin to something you'd find on the official site. Anyway, i'd love to see you register, that way you can keep it on watch and such. Blackmissionary 09:35, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

Further to that, if a coach is sacked, or something similarly major happens, then by all means, should be updated accordingly. Blackmissionary 09:58, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 24/6/06 Changes

Ok, thanks S.M.Hellas for the efforts (see your 'talk' section for more), but i reverted, changed and adapted your work for the following reasons:

  • The "(Formerly: South Melbourne Hellas S.C.)" in the infobox was unnecessary; it was already in the first paragraph (a good addition by yourself), and later on in the name change paragraph of the 1990's section.
  • Removed "with ethnic greek roots", because it was an amalgamation between 2 greek and 1 non greek club, and greek support is elaborated upon in the next paragraph.
  • The Melbourne Knights link. You broke it! I fixed it. If someone clicks on that link they can find out all about Melbourne Knights/Croatia, and their history, name changes etc.
  • Removed "as most supporters still prefered the name Hellas at the end" because it the paragraph i felt is rather self-explanatory.

Other things i did. Just added a three more references at the end, as well as adding info about the original uniform. Blackmissionary 01:27, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Bored 2 - Something more useful than a userbox

Inspired by S.M.Hellas recent editing, i went and created a redirect for South Melbourne Hellas to link to this article. Blackmissionary 08:10, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

and also a redirect for South Melbourne Lakers Blackmissionary 23:56, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] South Melbourne FC player category

After much fiddling around and searching, and a hell of a lot of frustration trying to figure out how to not only get a 'South Melbourne FC players' category up and running, but also how to get it included in the 'Australian players by club' category, i finally managed to do it. Don't ask how, i've already forgotten. Anyways, for those who don't know how it works, to add it to a player's article so they end up listed in the category, next to the other categories usually at the bottom of the page, just add

[[Category:South Melbourne FC players|

followed immediately by their last name, than a comma, then the first name, and don't forget to close off the section as well. I've already done most of the players listed in the SMFC article that have articles of their own, as well as the A-League players that i could find pages for. Blackmissionary 01:31, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Series of small edits

  • Slight addition to the intro, "only 2 clubs to play in every nsl season"
  • Separating second paragraph from intro to form "formation" section"
  • Added Albert Park link to the info box
  • Added bit in 1990's section to link the 1995/96 to 1996/97 seasons/years better. Might benefit from a little fiddling with the wording, just a thought.
  • Elaborated a little more on the '98 and '99 triumphs
  • added NSL Minor Premiers to 'club honours' Blackmissionary 01:51, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] John Anastasiadis and Ange Postecoglou articles

If someone out there with a little bit of spare time and nous could get some articles started on these two it would be really good. I wouldn't know where to start personally, but someone out there might. It would certainly be a really important gap to fill in terms of the 1990's section of South at the very least. Blackmissionary 01:55, 6 September 2006 (UTC)

I've created the John Anastasiadis page, with lots of help from this page. I'm not very good at remembering statistics, and I'm not even 100% sure what year he retired, so if you have any other info or if you can find any stats on his SMFC career, feel free to build on the article. Greekfire 10:36, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
That's great work there, thanks for that, i'll get round to whatever i can on it as soon as possible, but once again, great work, most appreciated. Blackmissionary 11:03, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
lol, also you gave me way too much credit on smfcboard! Supermercado started the page and got most of the relevant information up in the first place, others helped deflect vandalism, and added/fixed things along the way, but plenty of credit must got to Dragases who cleaned up the article, and set apart the eras, and did a lot of work on fixing it up and adding links etc, so when i got here in April, i could do what i do best, fix up little mistakes, and generally work with the material at hand, especially the 1990's and 2000's, honours, squad list etc. but i don't want to build myself up because Wikipedia is a team effort! Once again, thanks for the beaut article on Johnny A, and for spreading the word. Now if only we could find an appropriate photo for the 1970's section, and a legal/licensed pic from the Brazil adevnture for the 2000's section and maybe one from the VPL as well for the same section... :) Blackmissionary 13:31, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks to Hack who has created the Ange Postecoglou page. Blackmissionary 23:58, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Rewrite on the 21st September 2006

I've just finished reading Paul Wade's autobiography, and on a casual look through the article decided to fix a a few dates up (Puskas arrived earlier than indicated for example), and almost by necessity, added Pyrgolios and Arok to the mix, which forced a bit of a rewrite, addition/removal of material, and rearranging stuff to make it flow as well as possible. Any mistakes, you know the drill! Blackmissionary 05:32, 21 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Club records

Used the official site (which goes up to season 2001/02) in conjunction with OzFootball's stats. If anyone can think of any other things to add, go ahead. Blackmissionary 05:43, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 2000-present section

It's starting to get a little unwieldly, but i think it's ok for now, but it will likely require a rewrite soon, probably with the sections broken up into eras by club phase rather than by decades. If we can find a picture to stick in somewhere to break up the paragraphs, preferably vpl, it'll look better. Blackmissionary 23:17, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks to Alex Louziotis for letting me use his wonderful photo! Bit of trial and error to get it in place but, with the addition of the sub-heading and joining up of the two vpl paragraphs i think it looks ok. Blackmissionary 02:16, 3 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Middle Park

I have created an article for this at Middle Park (stadium). Blackmissionary 04:48, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Kit Evolution

I've included a Kit Evolution section to show the various SMFC kit designs through the years. Most of the designs have been compiled from newspaper clippings, photos, and other media (special thanks to Blackmissionary for a descriptive list of kits through the years). If anyone is certain of a kit design, by all means make the necessary adjustments. Cheers. Dragases 06:54, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Progress Report

When i started working on wikipedia a year ago, this article had recently been cleaned up by Dragases, but still mostly consisted of info straight from the official site, and was prone to vandal attacks on a frequent basis. Since then, through the efforts of a few people, but principally Dragases, Greekfire, and myself, we now have an excellent article on our hands. We have a better, more in depth and more structured and original history section, removed of most of its POV bits; We've added rivalries and records, and more photos; the honours section is suitably beefed up; the current squad section looks a hell of a lot better; we have notable player and coach sections; we have a superb kit evolution section; and importantly, we've done some good articles on John Anastasiadis and Ange Postecoglou, as well as worked on Bob Jane Stadium and created an article for Middle Park. There are also now categories for South Melbourne and South Melbourne players. And vandalism is now almost down to a non-issue.

So what next to make this article better? Well obviously, it'd be great to improve related articles. We need to add more references, which i will likely try to get onto soon. A couple more photos would be good perhaps. The Central Coast Mariners article recently got featured article status, but i reckon this one has the potential to be even better. So we might need a restructure of it a bit to fit in with the general football article template, but that's something for the future. But for now we should reflect on how far the article has come in this past year, and we unashamedly pleased with the effort and results. Blackmissionary 00:55, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] A-League proposal

I think it may be worth mentioning in this section that the ethnic clubs of the NSL were one of the main reasons why the new A-League club structure was used. Hence, SMFC will not be able to join the A-League in it's current form. -- Chuq (talk) 01:33, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

Couple problems with this. By the end of the NSL, majority the teams were not of an ethnic persuasion, so it's not completely fair to assign that much causation to the ethnic clubs, when there were many, many factors for the collapse of the NSL and the eventual format the A-League took up. Secondly, since we don't know what form any possible bid will take, speculative comments, which in my opinion are not suited to wikipedia, are best left to rest until concrete stuff comes up. Blackmissionary 04:14, 12 May 2007 (UTC)
I kind of agree, which is why I brought this up on the talk page, not on the article page. No matter how much they try to "de-ethnicise" the clubs, South Melbourne still has a strong Greek influence, Melbourne Knights a strong Croatian influence, and so on. I still think the way it is worded in the article needs some sort of mention as to how unlikely it is under the current scenario, though I recognise how this would be difficult with no references (except blogs, forums, etc). -- Chuq (talk) 10:33, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fair use rationale for Image:Smfc-emblem.jpg

Image:Smfc-emblem.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Wikipedia:Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 05:44, 24 January 2008 (UTC)