Talk:Soup

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Food Portal
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Food and drink, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of food and drink articles on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.
Start This article has been rated as Start-class on the quality scale.
Top This article has been rated as top-importance on the importance scale.
To-do list for Soup: edit · history · watch · refresh

Contents

[edit] 5/19 revisions

  • The classification of soups in this article comes from the "Larousse Gastronomie" and therefore should be defined as French. (page 998). "Food and Drink in America" confirms this. (page 462).
  • The invention of the spoon and the ensuing popularity of soups occurred in Europe in the 17th century. Unsure of my oriiginal source for the popularity of the spoon in Europe. The origin of the spoon is a lot older than that. Morton's "Cupboard of Love" (page 289) states that the spoon became a popular eating utensil in the 14th century; "Food and Drink in America" (page 462), a far more comprehensive history, and says that "exquisite ivory spoons were buried in the tombs of pharaohs" and that the word spoon was used in the Book of Exodus when God commanded Moses to make gold spoons. (page 434-435). I originally added this, but cannot locate my source. It's just inaccurate, and needs to be explained in more detail. I am guessing that spoons became used more widely in the 17th century as a result of the changing fashions of the times...but cannot find the proper citations...

I got rid of the two sentences:

Thin soups became popular in Europe during the 17th century, when the spoon was invented. The spoon was designed to accommodate the new fashion of wearing large, stiff ruffles around the neck.

If you can find a source, put it back in. If not, it doesn't belong here. The spoon was never invented. The long-handled spoon was used around that time so you could use a spoon without damaging your ruffles, but you still can't prove that the spoon's popularity made soups more popular; maybe the desire for some good soup led to better methods of eating it. Besides, why specifically would thin soup be associated with spoon lengths?

24.125.117.4 00:10, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

  • The word restaurant derived from Boulanger's (the "French entrepreneur") shop. The French called these soups "restaurers" and when the shops became more popular, the word changed to "restaurant". Source: Morton's "Cupboard of Love" (page 256). Confirmed in Eugene Ehrlich's book, "You've Got Ketchup on Your Muumuu," (page 204).
  • Information on Jean Baptiste Gilbert Payplat dis Julien is cited in "Food and Drink in America" (page 462).
  • First American cookbooks: "Food and Drink in America" (page 461).
  • Chicken Nodle Soup is one of the most popular soups in America: Source "The History of Campbell Soup Company" see full reference on Campbell soup Company.
  • Deletion of lakschen: Chicken Soup a.k.a. "Jewish Penicillin" can include anything from kreplach, Matzoh Balls, noodles, or lakschen. However: lakschen is a Yiddish word and not a requirement for "Jewish Penicillin." Source: Mama Leah's Jewish Kitchen" (page 64) and no doubt plenty of websites devoted to Chicken Soup and "Jewish Penicillin." Campbell's calls it noodles.
Priority 3  
Soup was the collaboration of the week for the week starting on June 12, 2004.

For details on improvements made to the article, see history of past collaborations.
This article has been reviewed by the Version 1.0 Editorial Team.
Version 0.7
 This article has been selected for Version 0.7 and subsequent release versions of Wikipedia.

[edit] Boulyon Cubes

What are they? Im not sure how to spell it, but its used i the Scrubs episode where JD and Turk put Boulyon Cubes in Hooch's shower and call it "the Soup Shower" JD moves out and JD makes Hooch his best freind. i put this in soup talk because they call it the soup shower.... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dappled Sage (talk • contribs) 17:37, 10 February 2007 (UTC).

Bouillon cube used instead of broth or stock as a soup base. Rmhermen 17:47, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
thanks Ive been wanting to find this out forever. Dappled Sage 21:47, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Article scope

Clearly this needs an exposition of the history of cooking in some form, from the Romans through the Middle Ages and the Renaissance, and the development of modern soups via Italy, France and modern times. Were Asian soups an independent invention? How important were soups generally in the development of noodles? What about the history of mulligatawny?

[edit] Differences between soup, gruel, stew, etc.

Difference in definition between soup and beverages? What's the border between soup, gruel, congee, porridge, etc? Removed salty from the description, as some soups are sweet--Confuzion 08:06, 14 Jun 2004 (UTC)

What's the difference from stew? And someone should look at the terrible description of stock (food) which this article links to. Rmhermen 13:54, Jun 14, 2004 (UTC)

[edit] DEFINITION OF SOUP

I deleted the following text from this version:

Learning to boil food was advantageous because it greatly expanded the available food supply for humans. Previously inedible grains, tougher vegetables and animal bones could be cooked together to add their taste and nutrients to a dish.
In addition, making soup was a convenient method of cooking food, as food could be cooked as long as water and fire were available. Cooking food in water was an advancement in cooking methods, since it improved the consistency of cooking.
My logic is as follows: Boiling food is not making soup. Boiling food has a lot to do with the history of food preparation, but not necessarily the history of soup. allie 23:00, 8 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Soup v Beverage

And now I cannot stand it, and I have to look it up in the OED, thank you very much. Okay: A "beverage" is something that one drinks. A "soup" is a savoury liquid that is made by boiling ingredients together, such as vegetables, meats, and legumes. The word, "soup" is medieval. When meat was boiled, the resulting broth was poured over bread. Now someone is going to question why is this different than saving rice water? My answer would be, that when writing an article on soup - stick to soup - otherwise this will never get written and you'll get consumed in what is known as "Pea Soup" or an impenetrable fog... allie 20:34, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)


[edit] Stew v Soup

A stew is a soup with meat as an overwhelmingly primary ingredient (for example, chili is a type of stew). allie 20:34, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Asian soups

As a suggestion for the non-Western soup section, I'd like to see some description of some of the more 'popular' asian soups such as: miso (Japan), seaweed soup (Korea, forgot the name, it's traditionally served on birthdays), Tom Yum something? (Thailand), Pho (Vietnam) etc. Mimsie 23:49, 14 Jun 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Wording: homeopathic?

Is homeopathic really the word to describe the "chicken soup/common cold" relationship? Joyous 06:01, Jun 15, 2004 (UTC)

No, it isn't. Homeopathy is a very specific pseudo-science which has nothing to do with soup. I'll change things (if someone hasn't beatnen me to it). RobertAustin 08:45, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cold soup

Vichyssoise is not an American potato soup! The name is French. Any experts on leek and potato soup out there? JPF 11:59, 16 Jun 2004 (UTC)

I was confused too. Turns out it was developed by a French chef working at an American restaurant in 1917. This page [1] has move detail about it and soup history in general. Should be a good source for our article. Rmhermen 20:54, Jun 16, 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Chicken Soup

I think there should be a link to the (already existing, good-sized) article on Chicken soup, but everyone contributing to this article seems to be obsessed with chicken noodle soup. --Random|832 07:52, 17 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Actually, that links to the history of Campbell's soup. The original 21 varieties featured a "chicken soup with noodles" but when it was advertised on "Amos & Andy" radio in the 1930s, by a slip of the lip, they referred to it as "Chicken Noodle Soup." Campbell's changed the name almost instantly, as as a result, the legend of chicken noodle soup began. There you go. allie 19:59, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Category:Soup

Just for fun. ✏ Sverdrup 14:08, 18 Jun 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Modern Technology

Modern advances in soup preparation generally consist of microwave types. There are reductions newly available, but I'm concerned that this will complicated matters. A reduction is when a stock is slowly simmered down from, for example, 20 quarts of stock to 1 cup of reduction. allie 20:34, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)soups need to be really fatty!!!!!!!!

[edit] Popular Soups

Look at this listing: They're NOT popular soups: They're REGIONAL cuisine that have become globally popular. There is a difference. Do you think an American housewife in 1920 would have ever heard of Bouillabaise? Or vichyssoise? So that has to be considered. allie 20:34, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)

You appear to be talking about the section "Famous soups"? Not "Popular soups" And I am not sure what use the opinion of a 1920's American housewife is when making a 2000's international encyclopedia. Rmhermen 01:32, Jan 8, 2005 (UTC)
I'm referring to the fact that these soups were not "popular" prior to the 20th century. They were "regional" and distinctly cultural in origin. It was only with the advent of modern technology that the French soups, for example, or the modern definition of soup, which is distincly French, became accepted and standardized. So there is a difference. While the cooking method itself dates back to Neandertal era, there is a great difference between what was palatable or more accurately, would have been served in any household anywhere. For example: Bouillabaise would never have been served in a New England household in the 18th century; and conversely, Clam Chowder would have never been served in a Provencal household during the same time. So I hope that makes sense. allie 14:16, 9 Jan 2005 (UTC)


Chicken noodle soup It is often used as a traditional remedy for the common cold. Chicken soup and lockshen (Yiddish for noodles) is known as Jewish penicillin. Noodle soups are also quite common across Asian cuisines.

  • Pho is a Vietnamese staple noodle soup
  • Ramen is a Japanese noodle soup that comes in several varieties
  • Saimin is Hawaiian fresh, soft, undried egg noodles in bonito fish or shrimp broth with Chinese, Japanese, Filipino, Hawaiian, Korean and Portuguese influences
  • Thukpa is Tibetan noodle soup, that is more or less the staple (along with Butter Tea and [[Tsampa]

[edit] Where did the content go?

This article is a lot shorter than it used to be. What happened? In particular, why did the information about soup in ancient times disappear? - Fredrik | talk 2 July 2005 06:47 (UTC)

Carm down, who cares about soup its not as if one peace of missing writing is going to mean that no one can make soup any more?

[edit] Sops in Onion soup?

I'm confused by the section which says onion soup is a surviver of the custom of making thick stew and pouring it on bread. The only onion soup I have ever seen or eaten has been a thin, clear soup.

_; you poor dear. The finer cafés that are so common around the world usually serve onion soup in the form of a thick, cheesy soup that is very filling. Of course, this is the French version of it, whose name I have forgotten; however, I understand there is a "poor man's" version of it that may be what you have been treated to.

[edit] Soup time

Might want to include when people drink soups. There are some cultures that drink before and some after their main course meal. 128.6.175.26 17:56, 2 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Soup in other languages

I think this section should be removed, since Wiktionary:soup already has such a list. Links to notable soups in other cultures can be moved into the appropriate section. Wmahan. 23:26, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Soup in America

I was wondering why the paragraph about Soup history in America was there? (In America, the first colonial cookbook...).

This is a genuine question -- I'm still learning about WP and wasn't sure if this is an encyclopaedia for people learning about America? It's not an American invention, so why would this go in the article? --Kierenj 12:15, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Good question, which Kieren has taken in a more general form to the Village Pump and which is being discussed in general there. Tonywalton  | Talk 10:28, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Didn't you know? America is the centre of the universe!

An encyclopedia 4 people learning about America? Dude, what country do you live on? Wikipedia is awesome and it has info about almost everything imaginable. Hope that answers ur question. For reals what country do you live in? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.215.26.168 (talk) 23:45, August 24, 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Soup and Health

Does Soup have a link to eating healthy? Is this notion true? Soups can be extremely healthy or extremely unhealthy. I often get angry because it is hard to find places that serve healthy soup. Is my anger justifiable? Or does health and soup have no connection?

I think it's a comfort thing. Like hot chocolate and such after an awful day.Eelio 15:44, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] me, first time here.

the article is a useful one. (Rlakshmipriya 22:03, 3 March 2007 (UTC))

[edit] The Nature of Soup

The first line says that soup is a type of drink. While it is a liquid, I would not consider it a drink. Any thoughts? Matthew Cadrin 16:56, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] From Wikipedia:Talk page

How's the soup? --John

It's great!! --Jane
Not too bad.. --George
I made it myself! --John

I think the soup-discussion should be moved to Talk:Soup.. --Jane

I tend to disagree. --George
Too bad for you, George. \sim Lenoxus " * " 17:19, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] RACIST?

Is "Jewish Penicillin" considered RACIST? --ColaDude 20:45, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Nah, but it's not exactly very accurate either. Westerners in general consider chicken soup to be effective medicine. Or just whites in general. You know, like that South Park episode Red Man's Greed they describe the "traditional medicine of the white man" which consists of chicken soup and Sprite.

[edit] Other soup topics

Manners, slurping when one eats, spoons vs chopsticks, tilting the bowl towards your mouth and just drinking from the dish, etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.72.21.221 (talk) 22:10, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Gee, thanks guys!

It sure is good to know that Wikipedia editors have their eyes on what's important. I really think there would be something wrong with this article if it didn't spare a few words for the depiction of soup in computer and video games. It is my hope that someone will find the time to add such a section to every Wikipedia article on otherwise staid and tedious subjects, such as pillows, washing powder and Faberge eggs. The article still, however, feels a little thin and limited in scope in its coverage of soups as featured in media favoured by shut-in twentysomething nerds. Perhaps a section on soup in animes would be the way forward here, or one on appearances of soup in the Pokemon franchise? 172.213.96.96 13:17, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Soup in pop culture

Most of this stuff is dumb as hell and has nothing to do with soup; it can all be placed in trivia for more appropriate articles. I'm killing it. 209.248.160.82 20:43, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

[edit] No Rhyming Section

I couldn't help but notice that while we have cultural references to soup, there is no section called out to list common words that rhyme with soup.

I, like most of you, probably can't think of "soup" without thinking of "poop." In fact, I often combine them in my mind to form "poop soup." To keep the article relavent, my hope is that the wiki community consider this addition.

[edit] Proposed New Section: Other Uses for Soup

I think the article needs a section on uses for soup other than food. For instance, many types of onion soup can be used as a temporary substitute for engine oil and coolant. Beer cheese soup is used in many European countries as a spermicide and for other home remedies. In the name we would use our C rations (usually a turnip and carrot soup) in the field on our wounded. It would coagulate a wound better than anything.

[edit] Rhyming section!

I agree with the previous post on the rhyming section and also the poop soup thing; the two things go hand in hand.

Coop also rhymes with soup, and chickens are kept in coops, and chicken soup is very popular around the world. I think if we really want this article to be an exhaustive compendium of encyclopediac knowledge about the topic of soup, then we should mention somewhere that chickens are kept in coops and that "coop" rhymes with soup.

Also, there was Augustus Gloop, the fatty from Wonka. His name not only rhymes with soup but I am pretty sure he was also seen in the 1970s movie production eating a bowl of soup, therefore this article on soup should also be about Mr. Gloop. It is cosmic and preordained. Gloop soup has a special ring to it as well. I wonder what author Roald Dahl's favorite kind of soup was? Maybe, if we aren't completely distracted tonight reading Penny Arcade and playing Second Life in our underwear, we could add a "celebrities' favorite kind of soup" subsection?

[edit] not related

this stuff is nor related to soup and should be deleted 71.94.16.143 22:01, 27 September 2007 (UTC)