Talk:Soka Gakkai International/Archive 3

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Komeito issues

What is the political party related to Soka Gakkai? Zengakuren?

Would it help to say that Soka Gakkai has a role in Japan similar to that of Opus Dei among Catholics? -- Error 01:22, 14 Aug 2003 (UTC)

I added a link to the New Komeito party. It seems like it should have been there already... --Carl 04:11, 11 Apr 2004 (UTC)


You know, isn't it about time to drop the Komeito reference -- unless you want to also give the same weight and reference to so many other organizations that SGI *IS* affiliated with - such as the Boston Center for Peace, the Toda Institute for Global Peace Policy and Research, etc. I did a Google News search and an EBSCO news search, and *everytime* the two names come up together, there is also a disclaimer that says the two groups are NOT connected. And on each of their websites it says the same thing. So give it up already! KPMP --151.198.99.71 22:39, 10 October 2005 (UTC)
Perhaps this link will help clear up the connection: Mainichi Shimbun Interview with SGI President in which Dr. Ikeda clearly states that "In order to respond to the needs and concerns of the members, I felt it was important to clarify again the independent identity of the Soka Gakkai...In other words, the goal of our religious practice is not to provide electoral support to the Komeito. The essence of religion is found in spiritual solidarity among people. The time for political factionalism is long past. It will only lead to a dead end. Priority should and must always be placed on people. We are advancing a religious movement that is by the people, for the sake of the people." or, perhaps you'd appreciate something from, say, The Economist "Formally, the LDP's coalition partner, New Komeito, which has 34 lower-house seats in parliament, is separate from Soka Gakkai, a lay Buddhist organisation with more than 10m Japanese members. Soka Gakkai makes no campaign donations to New Komeito, for example." (Lotus politics. Economist, 11/27/2004, Vol. 373 Issue 8403, p44-45)


The article fails to say *why* Soka Gakkai and its leader are controversial... excess of precaution?

Soka Gakkai has been identified in the Japanese and U.S. press as militant and aggressive in their recruiting tactics. The New Komeito or "Clean Government Party" is highly controversial because Daisaku Ikeda and other SGI leaders have said that their aim is for the party to rule Japan and institute Buddhism as the state religion. I think this article should provide links to opposing views of SGI, or at least admit that opposing views exist.--Goettel 01:17, 8 May 2004 (UTC)

http://freedomofmind.com/resourcecenter/groups/s/soka/

Where does it say that SGI is "militant and aggressive in their recruiting tactics?" Where have you seen these claims made? "Daisaku Ikeda and other SGI leaders have said that their aim is for the party to rule Japan and institute Buddhism as the state religion." ? It seems fairly irresponsible, not to mention unfair, perhaps libelous to make such statements about a person or organization without proof. And by the way who is Steve Hassan? The above site has a disclaimer that says:

Copyright © 2001-2005 Freedom of Mind Resource Center, Inc.
Freedomofmind.com fully supports religious freedom and the United Nations Universal Declaration of Human Rights. The fact that a person’s name or group appears on our website does not necessariyl mean they are a destructive mind control cult. They appear because we have received inquiries and have established a file on the group. The Freedom of Mind Resource Center Inc. was established by cult expert Steve Hassan.

Shouldn't we be using better sources? This is just some guy with his own little "business" and a website. What makes you think he is reliable?

It appear that annonymous "62.141.83.33" is a member of Aleph (Aum Shinrikyou). Check his edit history. --FWBOarticle 06:06, 28 Aug 2004 (UTC)


And you, my friend, are a Romulan.


I have recently been studying Nichiren Buddhism through the teachings of SGI. A good friend of mine is an SGI member.

All in all, I think this article is relatively fair-handed. I have had some problems with the almost-hero-worship that SGI displays towards Mr Ikeda, and my friend and I have discussed it openly and honestly.

As far as recruiting goes, my own experience has been that they are most definitely NOT pushy, abusive, or even irritating; rather, they are just like any other religious group that has an evangelical side. They're excited about their religion and beliefs, they honestly think that those beliefs are the best for people, and they enjoy sharing them with people who are curious.

SGI does have some various controversies around it, but some are mainly driven by conflict between the Nichiren Shoshu religious group and SGI. Some are more political in nature in terms of internal Japanese politics, and finally you have some that are the "cult" accusations and so forth.

Ultimately, each of these may have some measure of truth, and some measure of falsehood. The article on SGI treats things reasonably fair. About all it really lacks is more in-depth information on some of these things, and I am sure people will add to it in the future. (With luck they will not use Wiki as a forum for a big edit/flame war.) Enumclaw

Purpose of Komeito

Can you produce a quote where Daisaku Ikeda or someone from the (New) Komeito leadership says that their purpose is to institute Daishonin's buddhism as a state religion? Otherwise that's just another conspiracy theory.

Komeito was formed to prevent Japan from sliding back to the same mad totalitaristic government that made WWII to happen and to protect freedom of religion. Maybe you know, but wartime Japanese government imprisoned 13 Soka Gakkai leaders, including Soka Gakkai founder (who died there in malnutrition) and his follower Josei Toda, just because they didn't acknowledge state Shinto. This is all well documented in various speeches by Toda or Ikeda (recently in The New Human Revolution—Volume 14: Fierce Winds).

Perhaps this link will help clear up the connection - or lack there of?: Mainichi Shimbun Interview with SGI President in which Dr. Ikeda clearly states that:

In order to respond to the needs and concerns of the members, I felt it was important to clarify again the independent identity of the Soka Gakkai...In other words, the goal of our religious practice is not to provide electoral support to the Komeito. The essence of religion is found in spiritual solidarity among people. The time for political factionalism is long past. It will only lead to a dead end. Priority should and must always be placed on people. We are advancing a religious movement that is by the people, for the sake of the people.

or, perhaps you'd appreciate something from, say, The Economist:

Formally, the LDP's coalition partner, New Komeito, which has 34 lower-house seats in parliament, is separate from Soka Gakkai, a lay Buddhist organisation with more than 10m Japanese members. Soka Gakkai makes no campaign donations to New Komeito, for example. ("Lotus politics" in The Economist, 11/27/2004, Vol. 373 Issue 8403, p44-45)


Definition of shakubuku

Made an edit- I deleted the definition of "shakubuku". I can live with the criticism of SGI; even though I am a (proud) member of the group, I believe that the page is factual in the first paragraph of the "criticism" section. However, I do not believe the definition "bend and conquer" is correct for the word "shakubuku". For a reference (and yes, I know it's an SGI-linked group that put up the reference page) see http://www.gakkaionline.net/Imagery/Shakubuku.html.

I think that the reference is very open and explicitly explains not only the actual definition of the word, but also where those who use the incorrect definition go wrong.

Finally, in today's SGI world (at least in my corner of it!) "shakubuku" has a meaning more along the lines of to talk about, spread, and propogate the faith- but not through beating people down, but rather by being a friend and explaining it. I just don't know anyone who's out there intentionally saying to other SGI members "I'm going to break XXX down and convert them".

So the "definition" of shakubuku had to go.

--Enumclaw 08:34, 23 September 2005 (UTC)


Glad to hear it! It bugged me too. I think it is important to put shakubuku in perspective -- at the time Nichiren was doing his thing, he was basically preaching a humanist religion to a militaristic nation where the religion and government were completely corrupt. The Buddhist practices of the day were steeped in tradition and history, I mean, at that time, women could not expect to ever be enlightened, until they reincarnated as men! ANd here was Nichiren saying not only that all men were capable of enlightenment, but so were women! And that they didn't even need a priest to pray for them to acheive it, and nor did they have to wait until the lived a thousand ifetimes! The priests of that age were not about to hear anything that suggested they might be going about it the wrong way. So, he had to be hard hitting, based in the doctrine, and he had to address them at their own level with their own doctrine. So Shakabuku at that time was pretty intense, and very different.
Today, the world is much different - the ideas expressed in Nichiren Buddhism are hardly outlandish or threatening - peace, equality of all humankind, self-determination, compassion, interconnectedness of all beings, etc. These are things we pretty much agree on -- its just HOW do we make it happen that we disagree about...and so when we "shakabuku" today, its really just about sharing another approach that can help us to make the world the kind of place we'd all like it to be...KPMP --151.198.99.71 22:31, 10 October 2005 (UTC)

Discussion continues at: Criticism