Talk:Siege of Jerusalem (70)

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I'm not sure if this counts as a duplicate or if the articles can exist separately, but I notice we have also had Destruction of Jerusalem for quite some time. Adam Bishop 05:53, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Contents 1 Re: Destruction of Jerusalem 2 Casualties? 3 7th of September? 4 Biblical source for prophecy, moved from article space. 5 Dispersal of Jews

[edit] Re: Destruction of Jerusalem

Thanks for pointing that out. I'd gone to the disambiguation page for Siege of Jerusalem and found that this article didn't yet exist, so I just assumed it needed doing and wasn't under another name. Still, since this one is more about the events of the siege, rather than the destruction afterwards, and follows a more standard format for a battle/siege article, I think it's cool to keep it. I'll have it and Destruction of Jerusalem link to one another though. Thanks again.

LordAmeth 11:43, 16 Jan 2005 (UTC)

In the destruction section, this page refers to the Solomonic temple and Jospehus' contention that the temple had stood for 1,000 years. While the article mentions the Herodian construction, it misses the fact that A) this is the post-golah temple, the Second Temple, not the Solomonic temple which was destroyed in the exile, and B) while the Herodian addition/rebuilding project did demolish and reconstruct the temple, as well as enhancing the structure of the mount, it still is considered the Second Temple because the worship continued.

Kirkengaard (talk) 20:57, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Casualties?

The strength of the Jewish army: 13,000 men... Jewish Casualties: 60,000 - 1.1M?.. .. Is this possible? Am I missing something? Are you including the civilians? Unissakävelijä 05:26, 16 May 2005 (UTC)

The casualties included civilians as it was customary at the time (unfortunately). ←Humus sapiens←Talk 06:48, 16 May 2005 (UTC)

[edit] 7th of September?

The city was completely under Roman control by the 7th of September.

Is it possible to know this date for certain? Bear in mind that the jewish calendar is different from our current Gregorian calendar. And before the Gregorian calendar, we had also the Julian calendar. --Pinnecco 16:43, 19 December 2005 (UTC)

Since it is possible to calculate all the transitions (including those you've mentioned above), and since there is no serious dispute about it, the historians may say that they know the date, so we should be fine. ←Humus sapiens ^ну? 01:33, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

The date of the final destruction of the Temple has been established with a reasonable degree of accuracy. It is definitely not September 7th. Josephus was writing for a Roman audience and used a calendar that had wide usage at the time. He habitually used the Syro-Macedonian lunisolar calendar that he treated as the equivalent of the Hebrew calendar. In AD 70, the date he gives for the destruction, 10 Loos (381 AS), fell on Sunday August 5. This tallies with the description that it was the day following the Sabbath. It is interesting to note that this is the same date given by Jules Oppert in the 19th century after a meticulous reconstruction of the Hebrew calendar of the period.

[edit] Biblical source for prophecy, moved from article space.

Jesus made the prophecy himself to his disciples. The prophecy was fulfilled not "alleged"

Matthew 24:2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

Luke 21:6 As for these things which ye behold, the days will come, in the which there shall not be left one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

Luke 19:44 And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation. User:64.193.70.148

Sorry, is it just me, or is there something EXTREMELY WRONG about having a section on Christian prophecies of the destruction, and nothing on JEWISH prophecies of the destruction? Prophecies that, if one reads the Jewish scriptures, make the above references look like a discussion on the hydrodynamics of sugar-coated biscuits? There should of course be included reference to the plethora of Talmudic passages indicating the uselessness of the Temple and the necessity of its destruction.

Thank you for removing this from the article. It looks like the user doen't conform to Wikipedia standards and has caused borderline vandelism. ForestJay 01:01, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Interesting, I was not aware that there were Talmudic "prophecies" on the matter of the destruction of Jerusalem. If someone could site those, that would be great. Anyway, Jesus being himself a Jew, and connecting Daniel's abomination of desolation (part of the Torah), would make these prophecies essentially Jewish. Really early Christians only had the Torah as their Bible, since nothing of what we know of as the "New Testament" existed yet. So, outside of the Talmud commentary, I'm not sure what's the difference between a Christian and a Jewish prophecy as concerns the destruction of Jerusalem. Most of the first "Christians" were Jews in fact.

(^^^ Nobody signed this stuff -- whose comment? Kirkengaard (talk) 21:05, 24 March 2008 (UTC))

-- Note -- there are a variety of OT passages in the prophetic literature that suggest the temporary nature of the Temple. Consider that when Jesus cites Third Isaiah (My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations -- the re-dedication of the Temple and the post-golah assertion that proselytizing is good and joining the people of God is possible by keeping Sabbath and covenant), he also cites Jeremiah 7 (den of robbers), which refers to the fact that the unrighteous have no ability to count on the Temple as sanctuary -- see what he did to Shiloh. Kirkengaard (talk) 21:04, 24 March 2008 (UTC)

[edit] Dispersal of Jews

This article doesn't discuss the aftermath of the siege, and the resulting dispersal of the Jewish people to other countries. A section about this should be added. Badagnani 07:18, 3 December 2007 (UTC)