User talk:Shipmaster

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[edit] Translation request

Hello, I saw that you are a native speaker of Arabic, so I would like to ask you if you could take a look at 2003 invasion of Iraq and Iraq War. There is a featured article in Arabic which we would like to know how it could be used the English one which is of course dominated by people who have either been there as soldiers or have their knowledge from western media. Someone also asked if the section about "related propaganda and phrases" could be amplified with information about the Iraqi side. Maybe there are also people who took photos in Iraq at the Arabic version? Nameme 16:15, 2 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Where are you from

Hi! Which country are you from? If you're a Lebanese, since your Arabic is good, I would like you to visit this website (since we're looking for Lebanese - and even non-Lebanese - to help improve Lebanon-related articles):

Also consider going to the English version by clicking here

Thanks. - Qasamaan 22:40, 16 January 2007 (UTC)

P.S. If you're Lebanese, add {{User_Lebanese}} on your user page.

[edit] RfA thanks

Thank you for your support on my Request for adminship, which finished successfully, with unanimous support of 40/0/0.

I will do my best to serve Wikipedia and the community. Again thanks.
--Meno25 08:14, 7 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] things you never heard of

The purpose of an encylopedia is to find about things you never heard of

if you go around trying to delete artticles because you never heard of what is inside them, then the encyclopedia will be limited to just your own personal life. And if you are Egyptian like you say, then I cannot understand why you would delete pages related to Egypt/Egyptians unless its a matter of bad feelings from your side!

I would suggest that instead of doubting the English Article, that you improve upon the Arabic one, since you are a lebleb in Arabic. Jumpster 07:34, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Your argument of "Go around improving instead of deletion articles about your fellow Egyptians" doesnt stand, and even though you chose to argue an incompletely irrelevant line than the original point, I am going to give you a chance to convince me not to put that article for WP:AFD, convince me he is suitable according to WP:BIO using sources other than his own website or that he is a moderator for a yahoo group and I will drop the subject. --Shipmaster 11:29, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Marco Mann

If you are in Alexandria you could check the Ministry of Culture center in Sidi Gaber where he had a solo exhibition in 2004 .. Some pictures of the exhibition and the Exhibition statement are published in the website (the Cultural Center doesnt have a website, but holds paper and video records of the event)

If you are in Cairo you will find that in the March issue of "Portrait Magazine" there was a published Article and Photograph of Marco Mann. Portrait Magazine is a monthly independant non-limited magazine about the plastic arts. That particular issue (the 12th) portrayed more than 30 artists who are active in the Art scene in Cairo today. Among them were Farouk Hosny, non-governmental Abla, and other less know and alternative trend artists.

Alexandria does not have a cultural publication .. however the most active cultural entity in Alex is the Library, which is a member of the International group for Art and Culture, and the head of the art center of the library "Maestro Sherif Mohi El-Din" sends the bibliotecha's monthly program regularly to the members of the group.

I suggest you join the International group for Art and Culture and through it you will get more insight into Marco Mann and his work. And even if it doesnt fully suit your personal criteria, you will have no doubt that that artist actually exists and is notable enough to the 4200 members of the group at least (which I think is a big enough number to make him eligible for a small article in the wikipedia)

The argument that he is Egyptian like you is, I agree, an impotent one, but I didnt make that point for the purpose of persuasion, but as an illustration of the Irony, that from all the visitors that visited that page, the one who asked for deletion is an Egyptian; while the opposite attitude is usually expected between members of other nationalities. If people find an article about someone they dont know, they would either leave it alone, or try to find out more if interested. But why ask for its deletion? I am making an assumption that it is because of the article in the arabic section that was just added recently and it must be admited that Marco Mann is not well known among the purely arabic reader (and the name too sounds foreign and could be spirtually confusing) even though Marco Mann is 100% Egyptian in blood and heritage and the name change has a long story that has nothing to do with religion or an attachment to Western trends.

Jumpster 11:58, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Jumpster, I am still not convinced that this artist satisfies WP:BIO, A solo exhibition in the Sidi Gaber center which is known for its lax criteria for exhibitors or mention among 30 others in a local magazine doesnt qualify as "significant" (A solo exhibition in Bib. Alex. would have convinced me right away of course), And being a moderator of a yahoo group with less than 100 message activity per month doesn't make him notable as an artist. If you want, I can make a formal inquisition at the Bib. Alex, the Arabic wikipedia has very strong ties with the Bibliotheca, but I am guessing the artist has not had any exhibitions related to the Bib. Alex. , also, making the claim that such a large entity as the Bibliotheca is memeber of the group is a bit bold, my guess is that the person you mentioned is the member not the Bibliotheca itself, again, I can verify that formally if you want with the Bibliotheca.
Not catching the irony in your argument, I think the article evaded deletion for so long because people assumed he is notable in Egypt, that's why I specifically noted where I live, also not sure what you want me to do? Ignore WP:BIO for a fellow countryman? I am sure that's not what you wanted to convey. You are correct that it caught my attention when it was posted in the Arabic wikipedia, but there it was posted for AfD as soon as it was created (not by me). It has nothing to do with the name or beliefs of the artist btw, I don't have anything personal against him and I don't know him personally, I am just following WP:BIO. If you don't have any more sources to backup his notability I will go ahead and put it on WP:AFD and let the community decide, also, I will move this discussion to the article's talk page to make it easier to follow, I hope we can cooperate more in the future on Egyptian-related articles, or you can join us on the Arabic wikipedia which really needs all the help it can get.--Shipmaster 12:49, 10 April 2007 (UTC)


    • you wrote: Jumpster, I am still not convinced that this artist satisfies WP:BIO, A solo exhibition in the Sidi Gaber center which is known for its lax criteria for exhibitors or mention among 30 others in a local magazine doesnt qualify as "significant" (A solo exhibition in Bib. Alex. would have convinced me right away of course)
    • and this is just proof of the bias of your opinion. The Sidi Gaber center has exhibited for most of the prominent Alexandrian Artists .. what makes you assume that the BA is more significant in ARTS than a Cultural Center? The Alex library is simply a library (a big one with historic significance0, while the Ministry of Culture and its centers are the specialized body for the Arts; BA's job in the Arts, is its documentation and not its approval!! Of the exhibitions that were held in the BA .. none really matched the assumed status and significance of the BA (Does the Shady Abdel Salam Permanent exhibition make him more notable that Youssef Shahin or Waheed Hamed or or or?? You are of course free to view matters from your own perspective. But dont tell that there are less than 30 significant artists in Egypt? I mean if you are not satisfied with the 30 MOST significant artists in Egypt, then I will have to wonder about the future of Art in Egypt, if you were the one responsible for telling the world about it! Do you mean that among the 30 artists profiled there are Only 5 or 6 that YOU think are significant?? i.e. only 5 or 6 significant artists in All or Egypt? and is Farouk Hosny or Mohamed Abla not significant because they never held an exhibition at the BA?

I have been a strong advocate of the Alexandria Library and take pride in mentioning to people that it contains the mirror of the internet archive. I dont consider the BA to be an authority except when it comes to books and documentaion of WHAT ALREADY EXISTS. And this is Precisely the point of the BA, in the same way that this is the point of Wikipedia. It would be immoral if either BA or wikipedia think that they can act as a censoring body and define what is notable and what is not. And if entities try to greedily be what they are NOT, they lose their original purpose, and to be honest, I dont want to lose my respect for the BA or Wikipedia because someone who speaks on their behalf is telling me that Artists are automatically notable if they exhibit in the BA, but not elsewhere. Also, the Marco Mann article does not claim that he is notable in Alexandria. In fact Marco Mann was never involved in such politics as you seem to be involved yourself; but simply an artist who creates art in his studio. Marco in Notable in the International Art scene to some degree, like any artist in notable to a degree in different areas. So if you want to work ONLY with ARTISTS CONSIDERED SIGNIFICANT BY or WORKING with THE LIBRARY, then feel free to do so, but as I had said earlier that would limit the scope of wikipedia. And I am not only talking about the English Language version; I am specifically talking about the Arabic Language version; which will simply become an exclusive document serving the purposes of the BA rather than an all-inclusive encyclopedia. The Significance argument is subjective and doesnt make sense, the only reason to want to not include Marco Mann in the Arabic wikipedia of which you are sysop, is to simply try to deny him of his right to be included, which is actually an Egyptian way of doing things .. Deny people their rights, unless you know them. It goes on many level, to get anything done, you need a wasta, a recommendation from some common person. Well this is not the case in Wikipedia, and should not be the case in the Arabic language version which is, as you said, under the Control of the Library of Alexandria!! I will again return to YOUR assumption that readers assumed that the painter is notable in Egypt! I am sure no one assumed anything more than what is written in the Article! in no context is it implied that the artist is active in the Art Scene in Egypt; the only context in which he is active is through his group (and I bet if BA had control over that, it would delete it too!! to make sure that independant artists are not active AT ALL) I can go around putting articles up for deletion!! but that would not satisfy my ego. I feel better when I build things, not when I try to destroy them. If I search I will find that there are grounds for Afd in at least 700,000 of the 1,700,000 articles in the en.wiki resource and possibly the same ratio in the ar.wiki .. but what would that serve. I cant cooperate in ar.wiki because my arabic is weak. I am sure that many people in the Alexandria Library (for whom I think you speak) would be happy to assist though.

I mean I dont understand the logic of finding and article somewhere, and trying to find reasons for deleting it! Jumpster 15:17, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

You are putting words in my mouth (and making a whole rhetoric out of it about politics and stuff I dont know how on earth would get crammed into an argument about article notability), I never said BA listing is needed for notability, you brought the BA as a reference not I, so I was simply discussing how the BA can be used as a reference, and you contradict yourself by listing your only sources for the artist notability being inside Egypt then saying he is only known internationally?! In the end, why are you so riled up? I am just putting the article up for community discussion of deletion, if I am wrong the community will not buy into my argument, no? If you still need to go at such a tirade to discuss it, just do so on the AfD request,but be prepared to backup your claims with sources this time not just words, I will notify you when I put it. --Shipmaster 16:46, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
Um also, to set the record straight, strong ties is not equal to under control of, Alexandrian wikipedians are cooperating with the library to make a bid for organizing wikimania 2008, there are around 5-10 Alexandrian wikipedians out of 50,000 users or so on ar.wiki, BA doesnt hold any control over anything done in the wiki, dont twist my words. --Shipmaster 16:49, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Keep up the energy

wow I think you found your mission in life busy editing, reorganizing and relcoating the spa in the vfd page for Marco Mann .. to be honesy with you (and maybe to your disappointment) I lost interest in trying to keep the article and really dont mind if it gets deleted. So I think that this (to you) means that you won.

Well done. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jumpster (talk • contribs) 20:57, 12 April 2007 (UTC).

Despite the fact that you are considering this an ego battle and also despite the fact that you have attacked me for a lot of reasons none of which are true (even though I am sure you are not convinced), if the article gets deleted and if you provide sources in the future that will prove me wrong, I will rewrite it myself. I am not after deletion of articles that satisfy wiki criteria because of some vague personal vendetta chasing shadows. I follow up on all my AfDs and if you look through my history on ar.wiki, you will find me doing the same clerk work on a lot of discussions/articles (if you look at my history there you will also find I am not fully dedicated to give you pain as you think, I am just not an active editor here on en.wiki). --Shipmaster 21:22, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

The more proof that your nomination for deletion was not in your behavior pattern, as you are usually not active at all on en.wiki ... I really dont want to jump to ideas that the Alexandria Library is related to this and is against Marco Mann!!! Jumpster 01:14, 13 April 2007 (UTC)
And the fact that you so actively watching all the pages (including talk pages) related to the afd! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Jumpster (talk • contribs) 01:16, 13 April 2007 (UTC).
  • Regarding rewriting the article after you find your sources, I suspect you are sincere, in which case I suggest you join the art and culture group, through which I am sure you will stumble upon some references to the artist's notability (if you are not actively trying to find out if he is significant or not, then it is further proof of bad faith) .. I, however, will delete my account on wikipedia as soon as this vdf is over, I am actually fed-up with the crap politics here, so I wont be available to rewrite it. Jumpster 01:46, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] name

So what's your real name?


[edit] Images

Hello, I seen that you are a volunter for the wikimania 2008, so I come to notice your team that if you need to create Image, the Graphic labs can create or improve images on request. See : en:Wikipedia:Graphic Lab and the french fr:Wikpedia:Atelier graphic. 210.203.61.15 (talk) 13:36, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

Ok, that's great.
Other thing : please notice that I leaved wikipedia in big part because of the really bad welcome I received on the wikimania 2007. The fact that I was forbidden to talk with programmers such user:Brion destroyed some really need improvement for SVG on Wikipedia/Mediawiki, which [I think] make lost 2 years to Wikipedia in the SVG-MediaWiki compatibility/innovation field.
Also, for your 2008 wikimania, I encourage you to have "open public space" where everyone [I means EVERY ONE, including those who have ideas but who can't paid the daily reservation] will be able to talk together and to share ideas.
Regards,
210.203.61.15 (talk) 16:31, 29 January 2008 (UTC)